Stores cheaping out on parts?

[elkhunter11]

The simple fact is that many products now use metric sized fasteners, so whether you like the metric system or not, you should make an effort to understand the basics of the metric system. And if you are buying cheap Chinese products, you should expect lower grade materials, whether it's tools or fasteners.

[W921]

Originally Posted by jef612

Read this
https://www.fastenermart.com/underst...fasteners.html

and this
https://www.fastenermart.com/underst...d-classes.html

those sum it all up pretty well

That's a good read.

[W921]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

The simple fact is that many products now use metric sized fasteners, so whether you like the metric system or not, you should make an effort to understand the basics of the metric system. And if you are buying cheap Chinese products, you should expect lower grade materials, whether it's tools or fasteners.

I have a john Deere tractor that has standard normal fasteners plus metric. Bolts are not marked like bolts you would buy at a place like Lethbridge fasteners. So annoying. On front axle housing it had not only a metric but a super fine thread metric. Nobody stocks much metric and if they do it costs twice as much and then when you throw in a third metric pitch to the threads. So its you have to spend time trying carry or go get all these normal and metric wrenches because you dont know until you get under machine which one it is and then messing around figuring out thread pitch,etc.
Look how many bolt bins you need now a days just trying to stock what you might need. So expensive and annoying driving to city for one lousy bolt that you need.
For years I was proud of my trucks that didn't have any metrics on them. But now a lot not replacement parts have metric because everything china. Now I look at my trucks with metrics on them much the same as I would look at pretty woman who had herpes.

[Pekan]

People seem to like cheap chinese tools and gear. PA sure has grown over the years. There's one in the states called Harbour Freight. My US brother in law tells me it's just like Princess Auto.
I like KMS tools in Calgary, but its probably mostly chinese as well.

If you wanted to boycott china, you'd be left standing there in a loin cloth holding a rock!

[justsomeguy]

Guys this is not a "China" problem, the decisions to cheap our are being made by Canadian / North American manufacturers in their push for profits, driven by an investment industry that demands returns so they can show profit in our RRSP's.

At its heart is the "mass consumerism/instant gratification / I want it now and won't wait" that we've all been lulled into in the past few decades. Only way it changes is if we dial back consumption of disposable goods and demand quality, no matter where it's built. I've bought China made goods that meet / exceed quality of North American made goods, it's all in the specs the manufacturers give to the factories.

Princess Auto stuff is mostly junk not because of where it's made, but because consumers will buy low quality stuff at low prices thinking they're getting a deal. This is a "look in the mirror for the problem" issue. Until society changes its consumption habits this will only get worse in the race to the lowest price.

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by Pekan

People seem to like cheap chinese tools and gear. PA sure has grown over the years. There's one in the states called Harbour Freight. My US brother in law tells me it's just like Princess Auto.
I like KMS tools in Calgary, but its probably mostly chinese as well.

If you wanted to boycott china, you'd be left standing there in a loin cloth holding a rock!

I see PA is promoting a lot of GRIP stuff these days, that's the lime green tool line . Grand Rapids Industrial products, but from China.

[W921]

Originally Posted by justsomeguy

Guys this is not a "China" problem, the decisions to cheap our are being made by Canadian / North American manufacturers in their push for profits, driven by an investment industry that demands returns so they can show profit in our RRSP's.

At its heart is the "mass consumerism/instant gratification / I want it now and won't wait" that we've all been lulled into in the past few decades. Only way it changes is if we dial back consumption of disposable goods and demand quality, no matter where it's built. I've bought China made goods that meet / exceed quality of North American made goods, it's all in the specs the manufacturers give to the factories.

Princess Auto stuff is mostly junk not because of where it's made, but because consumers will buy low quality stuff at low prices thinking they're getting a deal. This is a "look in the mirror for the problem" issue. Until society changes its consumption habits this will only get worse in the race to the lowest price.

Automotive parts
I have everyone telling me my China stuff is better than the other guys China stuff but for as a consumer it seems all same garbage. There is exceptions like say john Deere but you were really going yo pay for it. That's another thing, when john Deere went China the prices just went up. I'm sure john Deere makes more from the Chinese parts but the consumed has no savings.
It used to be that with made in Canada, America, Germany, etc you knew you were getting a quality part. Which reminds me. Company name brands that used to be good years ago are now garbage. All these young people don't even know what quality is because it has not been around in their lifetime

[IronCreek]

Originally Posted by amosfella

So, dad bought an engine stand from Princess Auto, and today I got around to helping him get it together. Except I found a problem. The parts list in the manual calls for grade 8.8 bolts. There isn't a single grade 8.8 bolt in the hardware supplied. It's all grade 4.8.

Been hearing about stuff like engine stands and cherry pickers having failing hardware/bolts, so I had double checked it.

Engine that was to go on the stand is pretty heavy, and I don't want to engine to come crashing down when I'm trying to crack off the harmonic balancer bolt. Last one I did on one of these engines took a 4 foot 3/4 drive breaker bar with another 4 feet of cheater pipe to get loose.

Moral of the story, check the bolts in your made in china stuff to make sure they gave you the correct ones.

I have called the distributor to complain already. I don't expect much from them though. It's not a Princess Auto house brand item.

LOL the 8.8 ISNT the grade of your bolts man. fml guys lol

[W921]

Originally Posted by IronCreek

LOL the 8.8 ISNT the grade of your bolts man. fml guys lol

I didn't think so either but it actually is. Just more complicated than it needs to be haha

[Bushrat]

China can make top quality or total junk and everything in between. They will build to whatever specs the purchaser asks, usually bottom drawer unfortunately.

[IL Bar]

Originally Posted by IronCreek

LOL the 8.8 ISNT the grade of your bolts man. fml guys lol

Yes it is genius. Only problem is a metric 8.8 is comparable to a grade 5 SAE. 10.9 is comparable to grade 8 SAE.

[npbra]

Originally Posted by IronCreek

LOL the 8.8 ISNT the grade of your bolts man. fml guys lol

Grade/Class Strength
Grade A Nuts Strength exceeds Grade 2.
ASTM A325 Bolts meet ASTM A325 Type 1 standards for structural steel joints.
Grade B Nuts Strength is similar to Grade 5.
Grade B7 Threaded
Stud & Rod Same as Grade 5. Use with Grade 2H and Grade C nuts.
Grade C Nuts Strength exceeds Grade 5. Use with heat-treated medium-strength steel fasteners like ASTM A325 structural bolts.
Grade G Nuts Strength is similar to Grade 8. Use with ASTM A325 structural bolts.
Grade 2 Low strength.
Grade 2H Nuts Strength is similar to Grade 5. Use with ASTM A325 structural bolts.
Grade 5 Medium strength.
Grade 8 High strength.
Metric Class 4 Similar to Grade 2.
Metric Class 8.8 Similar to Grade 5.
Metric Class 10.9 Similar to Grade 8.
Metric Class 12.9 The highest metric class for strength, it exceeds Grade 8.
Now do you understand, chart is from Fastener Mart.

[amosfella]

I went to Dennis' Boltworks and bought all class 10.9 bolts today for this.

Company sent an email saying that some bolts were meant to be 4.8 and other 8.8, and it was a misprint in the manual. They offered to send a set of the correct bolts.

[amosfella]

Originally Posted by npbra

Grade/Class Strength
Grade A Nuts Strength exceeds Grade 2.
ASTM A325 Bolts meet ASTM A325 Type 1 standards for structural steel joints.
Grade B Nuts Strength is similar to Grade 5.
Grade B7 Threaded
Stud & Rod Same as Grade 5. Use with Grade 2H and Grade C nuts.
Grade C Nuts Strength exceeds Grade 5. Use with heat-treated medium-strength steel fasteners like ASTM A325 structural bolts.
Grade G Nuts Strength is similar to Grade 8. Use with ASTM A325 structural bolts.
Grade 2 Low strength.
Grade 2H Nuts Strength is similar to Grade 5. Use with ASTM A325 structural bolts.
Grade 5 Medium strength.
Grade 8 High strength.
Metric Class 4 Similar to Grade 2.
Metric Class 8.8 Similar to Grade 5.
Metric Class 10.9 Similar to Grade 8.
Metric Class 12.9 The highest metric class for strength, it exceeds Grade 8.
Now do you understand, chart is from Fastener Mart.

I went through all this dealing with a machine that had issues with shear bolts a while back. It had both imperial and metric on it, and a lot of cobbled together parts.

PITA.

But I got to learn all that the hard way.

I'm also starting the regret not buying a lathe with metric threading gears.