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  #151  
Old 04-30-2014, 09:25 AM
jeprli jeprli is offline
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My rig is made of a 4/0 1/16th oz jig hook and a treble on common snap, jig hook goes right behind head and through mouth while treble is between dorsal and tail. This kind of rigging needs no waiting you're good to strike as soon as they clamp on it. I use 6-8" bait.
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  #152  
Old 04-30-2014, 09:42 AM
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Id thought about how they would work for bait, but if you read the regs they are illegal in Alberta.
"Fishing with Bait Fish

Bait Fish means any of the following:

suckers (family Catostomidae)
sticklebacks (family Gasterosteidae)
trout-perch (Percopsis omiscomaycus)
Iowa darter (Etheostoma exile)
minnows (family Cyprinidae), except carp, goldfish and the western silvery minnow."
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  #153  
Old 04-30-2014, 09:55 AM
Secret coulee Secret coulee is offline
 
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I talked with our game warden at the brooks office ,Unriner and he said not a problem I was out at j-dam last spring with him and our fisheries bio when all the carp were heading up the main feeder ditch trying to spawn.So if he told me yes then I feel Preatty confident seens how he's the one giving out the tickets in our area.that bein said he got transferd so I'm Gunna go talk to our new warden about it now that you have posted this Wayne.thank you
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  #154  
Old 04-30-2014, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Secret coulee View Post
I talked with our game warden at the brooks office ,Unriner and he said not a problem I was out at j-dam last spring with him and our fisheries bio when all the carp were heading up the main feeder ditch trying to spawn.So if he told me yes then I feel Preatty confident seens how he's the one giving out the tickets in our area.that bein said he got transferd so I'm Gunna go talk to our new warden about it now that you have posted this Wayne.thank you
cool, let us know what the new guy says, i hate spending money on bait if I dont have to
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  #155  
Old 04-30-2014, 10:07 AM
Secret coulee Secret coulee is offline
 
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I think reading the regs is to not introduce these two species in the chance of introducing them with people using for bait.but now that they they are an astablished invasive species it opens up a new page now I will find out foresure
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  #156  
Old 04-30-2014, 10:17 AM
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I talked to a warden at the forks last year on opening day and he said that it was OK. I guess I will avoid it until I get further clarity. I dont want to break the rules.
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  #157  
Old 04-30-2014, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WayneChristie View Post
Id thought about how they would work for bait, but if you read the regs they are illegal in Alberta.
"Fishing with Bait Fish

Bait Fish means any of the following:

suckers (family Catostomidae)
sticklebacks (family Gasterosteidae)
trout-perch (Percopsis omiscomaycus)
Iowa darter (Etheostoma exile)
minnows (family Cyprinidae), except carp, goldfish and the western silvery minnow."

I think they just mean carp aren't classified as a baitfish. Since they're also not classified as a sportfish they fall under the "bait" category. I'd say this means you can use them as long as the water body doesn't have a total bait ban. Legally I think they fall under the same category as worms, cheese and smelts; they are bait but not baitfish.
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  #158  
Old 04-30-2014, 12:40 PM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WayneChristie View Post
Id thought about how they would work for bait, but if you read the regs they are illegal in Alberta.
"Fishing with Bait Fish

Bait Fish means any of the following:

suckers (family Catostomidae)
sticklebacks (family Gasterosteidae)
trout-perch (Percopsis omiscomaycus)
Iowa darter (Etheostoma exile)
minnows (family Cyprinidae), except carp, goldfish and the western silvery minnow."
I agree Wayne.

Id say that is pretty clear.

Looks like some should have read the regs.
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Last edited by huntsfurfish; 04-30-2014 at 12:47 PM.
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  #159  
Old 04-30-2014, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish View Post
I agree Wayne.

Id say that is pretty clear.

Looks like some should have read the regs.
So by your definition the frozen smelts and herring sold as bait in Alberta are also illegal as they're not on that list either.

There may be a rule stating that it's illegal to use carp as bait but the rule quoted only says they're not classified as baitfish.

Last edited by AdverseCity; 04-30-2014 at 01:24 PM.
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  #160  
Old 04-30-2014, 01:54 PM
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Ok everybody I got clarification from lethbridge fisherysbio.
You absolutely can not use prusion carp for bait.
That being said I was also told that there is a commercial fisherman in the brooks area that has found a market for these carp and is allowed to net for them location specific I'm sure.
Wouldn't one think that if these little bas...terds are in our water system all ready on this level,fisheries would be all for the removal of as many carp as anybody would want,and if our predatory fish are preying on the new envasive carp why shouldn't anybody be allowed to catch and use for bait.every one caught is one less in our system.
PS thanks Wayne I'm sure at some stage here Ida had a nice juicy ticket from a game warden always pays to go back and double check
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  #161  
Old 04-30-2014, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdverseCity View Post
So by your definition the frozen smelts and herring sold as bait in Alberta are also illegal as they're not on that list either.

There may be a rule stating that it's illegal to use carp as bait but the rule quoted only says they're not classified as baitfish.
Re-read regs please.
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  #162  
Old 04-30-2014, 05:52 PM
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If people are using these Prussian Carp as bait in areas that aren't already affected with the fish, aren't you just increasing the chance of spreading their range...?
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  #163  
Old 04-30-2014, 06:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Secret coulee View Post
Ok everybody I got clarification from lethbridge fisherysbio.
You absolutely can not use prusion carp for bait.
That being said I was also told that there is a commercial fisherman in the brooks area that has found a market for these carp and is allowed to net for them location specific I'm sure.
Wouldn't one think that if these little bas...terds are in our water system all ready on this level,fisheries would be all for the removal of as many carp as anybody would want,and if our predatory fish are preying on the new envasive carp why shouldn't anybody be allowed to catch and use for bait.every one caught is one less in our system.
PS thanks Wayne I'm sure at some stage here Ida had a nice juicy ticket from a game warden always pays to go back and double check
Please PM me some details on who is marketing them. I want to ditch some perch also.

I wish we could collectively catch these vandals before they destroy our fisheries.
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  #164  
Old 04-30-2014, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Sundancefisher View Post
Please PM me some details on who is marketing them. I want to ditch some perch also.

I wish we could collectively catch these vandals before they destroy our fisheries.
Glad to see some positive action on something like this. Hate to see any manipulation of habitats that is not restorative in nature, and especially do not like to see introduced species that compete with the indigenous ones.
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  #165  
Old 04-30-2014, 08:26 PM
jeprli jeprli is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew View Post
If people are using these Prussian Carp as bait in areas that aren't already affected with the fish, aren't you just increasing the chance of spreading their range...?
Can't use live bait in Alberta.
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  #166  
Old 04-30-2014, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli View Post
Can't use live bait in Alberta.
I know, but doesn't seem good to be putting an invasive species into waterways its not already plaguing, dead or alive. you never know what could happen...

kill em all and leave them dead and out of our water if you ask me.
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  #167  
Old 04-30-2014, 09:48 PM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew View Post
I know, but doesn't seem good to be putting an invasive species into waterways its not already plaguing, dead or alive. you never know what could happen...

kill em all and leave them dead and out of our water if you ask me.
Agree. Run more risk of introducing via bucket brigade.
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  #168  
Old 04-30-2014, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by huntsfurfish View Post
I agree Wayne.

Id say that is pretty clear.

Looks like some should have read the regs.
i read it as legal.
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  #169  
Old 04-30-2014, 10:19 PM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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i read it as legal.
K, then re-read it. You will get it.
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  #170  
Old 04-30-2014, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by huntsfurfish View Post
K, then re-read it. You will get it.
i did. im reading, you can not use minnows in waters where a bait fish ban is, except for carp minnows, goldfish minnows, or western silvery minnows.

making them legal.
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  #171  
Old 04-30-2014, 10:33 PM
jeprli jeprli is offline
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Service berry cannot be more manipulated than it already is, it's surrounded by farm country, feed lots, green houses, grain stations and so on.

Srd knew about Prussian carp long time ago, but for some reason never did anything about it. Whd from Strathmore knew about Prussian carp as well. If action was taken 15-20 years ago maybe something could have been done.

Regulations state carp and goldfish. Does not state Prussian carp anywhere. They allow minnows of ciprinid family. Kinda confusing. Prussian carp don't have whiskers and have tiny heads, they grow really small so in my defence I understand them as minnows of carp family. I cured my bait and froze it as mentioned in my previous post. Not a protected species either so I don't understand why one could not use them for bait.
They clearly state not to use freshwater herring, instead use saltwater kind.
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  #172  
Old 05-01-2014, 10:30 AM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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What part of "Carp" do people not understand? Minnows(family Cyprinidae) of which carp belong as does the Prussian Carp. It does not say Common Carp, it does not say Asian Carp, it does not say Prussian Carp. It says Carp! Each of those mentioned is Carp!

Prussian Carp are illegal to use for bait.

Hope that helps.
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  #173  
Old 05-01-2014, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntsfurfish View Post
What part of "Carp" do people not understand? Minnows(family Cyprinidae) of which carp belong as does the Prussian Carp. It does not say Common Carp, it does not say Asian Carp, it does not say Prussian Carp. It says Carp! Each of those mentioned is Carp!

Prussian Carp are illegal to use for bait.

Hope that helps.
What part of BAITFISH DEFINITIONS do you not understand?

Nowhere in the quoted rule does it say they are illegal, it just says they are not baitfish. Smelts and saltwater herring are also not baitfish but are legal anywhere without a bait ban.

You keep telling us to read the regs and we are, we're even explaining our interpretation of them to you. Maybe you could elaborate on how you've determined them to be illegal?
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  #174  
Old 05-01-2014, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Secret coulee View Post
Ok everybody I got clarification from lethbridge fisherysbio.
You absolutely can not use prusion carp for bait.
This is the only argument in this thread that has any weight behind it and even still is 3rd hand information. Maybe the biologist just read the same baitfish rule we're discussing and made their own call. Personally I'll never use them as bait without getting some evidence that they're legal, as of right now I can't find any that isn't open to interpretation.
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  #175  
Old 05-01-2014, 11:04 AM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdverseCity View Post
What part of BAITFISH DEFINITIONS do you not understand?

I think you are the one who does not understand.

Nowhere in the quoted rule does it say they are illegal, it just says they are not baitfish. Smelts and saltwater herring are also not baitfish but are legal anywhere without a bait ban.

So if not listed as baitfish it is ok to use? Smelts and SW Herring are listed as "ok", is prussian carp? Note the word carp.

You keep telling us to read the regs and we are, we're even explaining our interpretation of them to you. Maybe you could elaborate on how you've determined them to be illegal?
Already have!

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdverseCity View Post
This is the only argument in this thread that has any weight behind it and even still is 3rd hand information. Maybe the biologist just read the same baitfish rule we're discussing and made their own call. Personally I'll never use them as bait without getting some evidence that they're legal, as of right now I can't find any that isn't open to interpretation.
Do you know what "except" means? Can you use goldfish for bait in Alberta?
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  #176  
Old 05-01-2014, 11:22 AM
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You're obviously not getting my point and I can't think of a way to explain it any simpler. Your conclusion is likely correct but the logic and evidence you used to get there is flawed in my opinion. A couple people in this thread saw exactly what I meant, that's good enough for me.

I'm going to turn off the computer and go fishing, Glenmore reservoir has been un-fished since October.
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  #177  
Old 05-01-2014, 11:26 AM
Donkey Oatey Donkey Oatey is offline
 
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Straight from the regulations. http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/r...4.html#docCont

19. No person shall angle using

(a) more than three hooks attached to a line;


(b) a hook with more than three points on a common shaft;


(c) a lure with more than three hooks as part of it;


(d) in open water, more than one line;


(e) in ice-covered water, more than two lines;


(f) a spring-loaded hook; or


(g) any fish as bait, other than dead bait fish, dead smelt, dead herring, dead shrimp, dead fish eggs or the skin, fins or eyes of game fish caught by angling.



That would make prussian carp illegal for bait.
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  #178  
Old 05-01-2014, 02:41 PM
jeprli jeprli is offline
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Other than dead bait fish. Which seems legal to me dead, frozen, cured is all allowed except sport fish and protected species such as cisci/Tule bee.

Let's point some more fingers...
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  #179  
Old 05-01-2014, 05:00 PM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdverseCity View Post
You're obviously not getting my point and I can't think of a way to explain it any simpler. Your conclusion is likely correct but the logic and evidence you used to get there is flawed in my opinion. A couple people in this thread saw exactly what I meant, that's good enough for me.

I'm going to turn off the computer and go fishing, Glenmore reservoir has been un-fished since October.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeprli View Post
Other than dead bait fish. Which seems legal to me dead, frozen, cured is all allowed except sport fish and protected species such as cisci/Tule bee.

Let's point some more fingers...

Sorry, but you dont have a point.
Check out the definintion of "except" that will/should help.
Are goldfish legal to use as bait?


You need to figure this out.
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  #180  
Old 05-01-2014, 08:27 PM
jeprli jeprli is offline
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You are just not reading properly, if you read it and understand what you read than you should understand that carp, goldfish and stickleback can be used on water where bait fish ban is in effect, as they are not considered bait fish I guess.

English is my second language, but I think I understand it better than you do.

Last edited by jeprli; 05-01-2014 at 08:48 PM. Reason: reading full sentences and understanding them...
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