BHA Alberta Chapter

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by Don Meredith

Yes, an Alberta chapter is in the process of being formed. Presently, you join through the Montana HQ:
http://www.backcountryhunters.org/
Once the chapter is official, it will be pretty autonomous with funding remaining in the province to pursue local projects and events.
The organization is all about protecting wildlands for quality hunting and fishing opportunities. The chapter has made a submission to the Castle parks planners demonstrating that many hunters and anglers appreciate the hunting opportunities that will be possible in the new parks.

Good idea, but do we really need the Americans to show us the way ? Canadians will just be just another filing cabinet in their office. Besides all the political and cultural differences,they can't help but put their own priorities first, much like similar organizations, thinking of the Rocky Mountain Elk foundation here.


Grizz

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams

Good idea, but do we really need the Americans to show us the way ? Canadians will just be just another filing cabinet in their office. Besides all the political and cultural differences,they can't help but put their own priorities first, much like similar organizations, thinking of the Rocky Mountain Elk foundation here.


Grizz

Yea, you pay your fee to become a member of an organization. Your money goes elsewhere, then any funding you want or need your chapter has to fund raise for the money. That sounds like a great idea!!

[Echo-Gecko]

Originally Posted by chuck

We might learn a few things. Some of those states have public land access figured out. WIN!

Originally Posted by ram crazy

Yea, you pay your fee to become a member of an organization. Your money goes elsewhere, then any funding you want or need your chapter has to fund raise for the money. That sounds like a great idea!!

Yes, an Alberta chapter is in the process of being formed. Presently, you join through the Montana HQ:
http://www.backcountryhunters.org/
Once the chapter is official, it will be pretty autonomous with funding remaining in the province to pursue local projects and events.
The organization is all about protecting wildlands for quality hunting and fishing opportunities. The chapter has made a submission to the Castle parks planners demonstrating that many hunters and anglers appreciate the hunting opportunities that will be possible in the new parks.
__________________
Don Meredith
"Rubs, Scrapes and Tangle", Alberta Outdoorsmen
Don's Blog
Don's Website

If I understand Don's post correct the money stays in the province and that the chapter is autonomous.

Maybe Don can chime in?

[alberta_bha]

Hi there,

The Alberta chapter (which is non-profit) is affiliated with the Backcountry Hunters & Anglers group, as the Alberta members share the same values (conserving the experience of wilderness hunting and angling, through the preservation of wild lands and wildlife).

Don Meredith is absolutely correct, that any funds collected by the Alberta chapter remain in Alberta, as is the case with the British Columbia chapter. Conversely, no money is sent by the US BHA chapters to the Canadian chapters. Money is directed towards efforts that our board, and general members, have identified as critical.

We are very much our own entity, as all BHA chapters are, and we pursue causes that affect the core values listed above. I understand that the perception is a US organization is attempting to influence what we do here in Alberta, but the board members that we have are committed to Alberta first, and foremost.

If you are open to further discussion, we will begin hosting pint nights (in Lethbridge, Calgary, Edmonton, and "tentatively" Fort McMurray) on a regular basis, starting in May. Everyone is more than welcome to attend, and see what we are about, and at the least, exchange a few hunting/fishing stories while having a beer.

We can be found on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Albe...ountryHunters/
Twitter: alberta_BHA
email: albertabha@gmail.com

[seven0eight]

I am a member and I'm very happy to have an Alberta chapter to push for continued responsible access to public lands! BHA has been very active in pushing back against the sell off of public lands in western states and against consolidation of private lands to block access to BLM lands. And, for what it's worth, I don't for a minute think that Alberta Parks has some secret agenda to ban hunting in the Castle. There are a lot of passionate hunters in that agency...have they ever tried to stop hunting in the Willmore? In Blackfoot? Or in the other 85% of their landbase where hunting is allowed? Relax and come on out to a pint night and see what these folks are really all about before jumping to conclusions.

[Bigfeet]

For those of us without a way to access Facebook, is there another way to learn about when and where any meetings are taking place?

[alberta_bha]

Originally Posted by Bigfeet

For those of us without a way to access Facebook, is there another way to learn about when and where any meetings are taking place?

Email is likely the best way: albertabha@gmail.com

I'll send out emails once the next pint night is scheduled. Thanks for your interest!

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by Don Meredith

I don't think they have a particular stance on grizzly hunting, except it should be done in a quality manner when numbers warrant. See their mission and values statement. So far the Alberta chapter has no stance but I would assume it would be the same.

With regard to being "closely associated with Y2Y," BHA supports Y2Y because they have similar goals in wanting to see large tracts of wilderness to support large populations of all wildlife. And if being "over the top" on grizzly bear conservation means ensuring we will always have bears to see and maybe even hunt, then Y2Y has my vote. See FAQs about who they are.

Really Don,

Have you forgotten how Mountain Equiptment Coop, the founding financial institution of Y2Y, raised the funds to market the advocacy for the Alberta Grizzly Bear hunt closure campaign?




Y2Y and blood related (financing and sponsorship) organizations learned to clean up their marketing tools of obvious anti-hunting bias, instead promoting the creation of "Sanctuaries" where Aboriginal hunting is allowed, but closed to all else, as happened with the Kluane National park efforts.

Y2Y strongly advocates the elimination of ALL predator hunting.


A person needs to be willfully blind if they research the history and still believe Y2Y is ambivalent towards hunting.


I have heard of the BHA, and first impression was that perhaps it is a group worth supporting. Hearing that BHA is actually aligned with Y2Y, well, that takes them OFF the list.

As an active advocate for maintaining hunting rights for ALL people, there is no way I could suggest anyone support this group.


-------

As to Y2Y policy, a person, and Don SHOULD know, has to read between the lines.


Y2Y Hunting Fishing Policy, between the lines in Red

Y2Y's Hunting, Trapping and Fishing Policy Revised Fall 2012
The Yellowstone to Yukon Conservation Initiative (Y2Y) is committed to the ecological integrity of, and long term health of habitats and wildlife populations within, the Yellowstone to Yukon region. Within this context, Y2Y recognizes that hunting, trapping, and fishing:

 are indigenous rights;
Y2Y will purport support for hunting, but only for Aboriginal harvest. Everyone else, you WILL NEVER get support from us.

 are part of the cultural heritage and economy of the Yellowstone to Yukon region;
So we will finance non-hunting advocacy groups to replace this heritage and economy with non-consultive uses such as Bear photography.

 are appropriate activities within the Yellowstone to Yukon region, provided that they are
conducted in an ethical manner that includes fair chase principles; and
 may be appropriate means to help maintain or manage fish and wildlife population health.
In saying so, we mean that hunting will only be used when prey species become so over-populated in an area that they become a serious problem and non-human predators are not able to provide the control needed. Remember, we advocate No Predator Hunting, so that only "natural" predators can kill prey species. No predators? Well, we will finance a wolf introduction.


In addition, Y2Y acknowledges the legitimacy of wildlife sanctuaries set aside from hunting, fishin,g or trapping where wildlife populations can recover from the impacts of the developed landscape, to protect wildlife genetics from the impacts of selection from human-caused mortality, and which act as source populations for hunting, trapping, and fishing opportunities outside their boundaries.

Remember the Bighorn and now Thinhorn research claiming hunting induced genetic selection, we helped with that. This is part of the strategy to eliminate hunting from areas within 200 km of National Park boundaries, We got Parks Canada on board, too bad the Alberta Gov. disagreed. Anyways, we will continue to lobby and finance the establishment of more National and Provincial Parks, where NO Hunting will be allowed (baby steps), while marketing to the masses that we Actually support hunting. *****ers!

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by alberta_bha

Hi there,

The Alberta chapter (which is non-profit) is affiliated with the Backcountry Hunters & Anglers group, as the Alberta members share the same values (conserving the experience of wilderness hunting and angling, through the preservation of wild lands and wildlife).

Don Meredith is absolutely correct, that any funds collected by the Alberta chapter remain in Alberta, as is the case with the British Columbia chapter. Conversely, no money is sent by the US BHA chapters to the Canadian chapters. Money is directed towards efforts that our board, and general members, have identified as critical.

We are very much our own entity, as all BHA chapters are, and we pursue causes that affect the core values listed above. I understand that the perception is a US organization is attempting to influence what we do here in Alberta, but the board members that we have are committed to Alberta first, and foremost.

If you are open to further discussion, we will begin hosting pint nights (in Lethbridge, Calgary, Edmonton, and "tentatively" Fort McMurray) on a regular basis, starting in May. Everyone is more than welcome to attend, and see what we are about, and at the least, exchange a few hunting/fishing stories while having a beer.

We can be found on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Albe...ountryHunters/
Twitter: alberta_BHA
email: albertabha@gmail.com

And does the Mothership support Y2Y?

If so, I suggest that no Alberta Hunter ever joins this group.

[slickwilly]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

And does the Mothership support Y2Y?

If so, I suggest that no Alberta Hunter ever joins this group.

Many hunters also care about preserving wilderness. If the choice comes down to seeing an area remain open to hunting, and be exploited, or be closed to hunting, I think many hunters would be happy to watch wilderness from a distance.

An unwillingness to ever work with a group that doesn't support hunting 100% will see hunting pushed to the fringes. We should be working openly with groups that want to see nature preserved, and working hard to show that hunting is an important part of multiple-use on public lands.

The attitude above appears frighteningly black-and-white. I would hope that our groups are able to take a more nuanced look, since I would hope they would do the same when we approach them with ideas that help hunters.

[Don Meredith]

I agree, Willy. I belong to these groups because 1) they do good work for conservation which helps maintain quality fish and wildlife for all, and 2) to keep them informed about the importance of regulated hunting and fishing to those efforts. And guess what, many other members of Y2Y, CPAWS and AWA are also hunters and anglers because they know what needs to be done to preserve quality outdoor experiences.

Read between the lines all you want, Walking Buffalo, but I look at what is actually being said and done by these organizations. And for me, they are doing much good.

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by seven0eight

I don't for a minute think that Alberta Parks has some secret agenda to ban hunting in the Castle. There are a lot of passionate hunters in that agency...have they ever tried to stop hunting in the Willmore? In Blackfoot?

The Willmore and Blackfoot are not provincial parks either. What do your hunting regs. say about hunting in provincial parks other than the special Elk draw in Cypress. I believe it says no hunting in provincial parks.

[Newview01]

It is pathetic how many people happily give up the rights of others.

What you people don't realize is that the group that is being singled out for the "destruction" of nature in reality has affected a miniscule portion of the land areas we are talking about. There is likely a lot of back room back-slapping going on between Y2Y, Ms. Phillips and Co. thanks to groups like BHA. Divide and Conquer.

If you want to keep hunting, stick up for the quadders.

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by alberta_bha

Hi there,

The Alberta chapter (which is non-profit) is affiliated with the Backcountry Hunters & Anglers group, as the Alberta members share the same values (conserving the experience of wilderness hunting and angling, through the preservation of wild lands and wildlife).

Don Meredith is absolutely correct, that any funds collected by the Alberta chapter remain in Alberta, as is the case with the British Columbia chapter. Conversely, no money is sent by the US BHA chapters to the Canadian chapters. Money is directed towards efforts that our board, and general members, have identified as critical.

We are very much our own entity, as all BHA chapters are, and we pursue causes that affect the core values listed above. I understand that the perception is a US organization is attempting to influence what we do here in Alberta, but the board members that we have are committed to Alberta first, and foremost.

So if I were to register as a life member right now, your saying that that registration fee is going directly to the alberta chapter. I find that hard to believe seeing as how there is no alberta chapter yet?

[alberta_bha]

Your interpretation of "reading between the lines" of the Y2Y policy is interesting, but I don't agree with what you are hypothesizing. It may surprise you that Y2Y management are hunters and anglers as well, but, regardless, whether you agree with Y2Y and their policies has very little bearing on this conversation.

If the opinion is that this hunting/angling group should not associate with any conservation group, then I don't agree with you. There is much progress to be made in protecting the wilderness that we all have come to cherish, and enjoy, while working alongside other groups that are just as dedicated to conservation, perhaps for different reasons, but for the same result.

We are demonstrating that hunters and anglers are truly conservationists at heart, as we are working towards preserving what remains of the wilderness, with the sole intent of passing it, and our hunting/fishing traditions, to the next generations, much like what our forefathers did.

I would hope that, at the very least, you would agree that wildlife management and habitat conservation would be something that needs to be supported, while maintaining our shared traditional activities of hunting/angling. This is what the Alberta BHA members align with, and support, as an independent chapter.

Again, the invitation for a pint is always open to all, as I find that it is far more effective venue when discussing things.

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by Newview01

It is pathetic how many people happily give up the rights of others.

What you people don't realize is that the group that is being singled out for the "destruction" of nature in reality has affected a miniscule portion of the land areas we are talking about. There is likely a lot of back room back-slapping going on between Y2Y, Ms. Phillips and Co. thanks to groups like BHA. Divide and Conquer.

If you want to keep hunting, stick up for the quadders.

2x.. there are a lot of hypocrites in the world.

[alberta_bha]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

So if I were to register as a life member right now, your saying that that registration fee is going directly to the alberta chapter. I find that hard to believe seeing as how there is no alberta chapter yet?

Yes, there is an Alberta chapter. The website has not been updated yet.

http://www.backcountryhunters.org/bh...r_new_chapters

[Newview01]

Originally Posted by alberta_bha

Your interpretation of "reading between the lines" of the Y2Y policy is interesting, but I don't agree with what you are hypothesizing. It may surprise you that Y2Y management are hunters and anglers as well, but, regardless, whether you agree with Y2Y and their policies has very little bearing on this conversation.

If the opinion is that this hunting/angling group should not associate with any conservation group, then I don't agree with you. There is much progress to be made in protecting the wilderness that we all have come to cherish, and enjoy, while working alongside other groups that are just as dedicated to conservation, perhaps for different reasons, but for the same result.

We are demonstrating that hunters and anglers are truly conservationists at heart, as we are working towards preserving what remains of the wilderness, with the sole intent of passing it, and our hunting/fishing traditions, to the next generations, much like what our forefathers did.

I would hope that, at the very least, you would agree that wildlife management and habitat conservation would be something that needs to be supported, while maintaining our shared traditional activities of hunting/angling. This is what the Alberta BHA members align with, and support, as an independent chapter.

Again, the invitation for a pint is always open to all, as I find that it is far more effective venue when discussing things.

If one enjoys quadding on crown land, are they not a conservationist at heart as well?

[Chuck_Wagon]

I will never support an organization whose goal is to stop ATV access in favour of horse’s only, allowing horse’s only cuts out 99% of Alberta hunters.

This whole bulk answer of, “you can always foot hunt” is BS.

You end up creating a massively over hunted area used by foot hunters within a couple miles of trail heads and a gigantic, essentially private hunting preserve for the minuscule number of Albertans that actually own a horse and paid guide/outfitter horse hunts.
Or fork out enough money and they'll helicopter clients in so they don't get saddle sores, 10 miles beyond a foot hunters reach.

[slickwilly]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

The Willmore and Blackfoot are not provincial parks either. What do your hunting regs. say about hunting in provincial parks other than the special Elk draw in Cypress. I believe it says no hunting in provincial parks.

Willmore is a Wildland Provincial Park, as it the majority of the new Castle. The fact that there is hunting allowed in the portion of the Castle that is a true PP is a step forward in my opinion.

[alberta_bha]

Originally Posted by Chuck_Wagon

I will never support an organization whose goal is to stop ATV access in favour of horse’s only, allowing horse’s only cuts out 99% of Alberta hunters.

This whole bulk answer of, “you can always foot hunt” is BS.

You end up creating a massively over hunted area used by foot hunters within a couple miles of trail heads and a gigantic, essentially private hunting preserve for the minuscule number of Albertans that actually own a horse and paid guide/outfitter horse hunts.
Or fork out enough money and they'll helicopter clients in so they don't get saddle sores, 10 miles beyond a foot hunters reach.

I'm sure that would be news to those hunters who actually hunt on foot, in Alberta. But, everyone has different experiences.

That being said, I would definitely pay for a helicopter to haul out the next elk I harvest, that would be pretty amazing, not to mention really convenient, and at a low price of $3,500/hr.

[slickwilly]

Originally Posted by Newview01

It is pathetic how many people happily give up the rights of others.

What you people don't realize is that the group that is being singled out for the "destruction" of nature in reality has affected a miniscule portion of the land areas we are talking about. There is likely a lot of back room back-slapping going on between Y2Y, Ms. Phillips and Co. thanks to groups like BHA. Divide and Conquer.

If you want to keep hunting, stick up for the quadders.

Multiple use is all about balance. Every decision, including making a site a free-for-all restricts somebody. The way I see it, there are many activities that are improved by restricting motorized access, including hunting, for those of us that like to hunt in the backcountry, as well as hiking, fishing, birdwatching, etc, all the activities that are better appreciated in silence.

Alberta has vast areas that are open to quadding, I don't believe that asking for some of the convenient, picturesque, and sensitive sites to be protected is an unfair proposition.

[Newview01]

Originally Posted by slickwilly

Multiple use is all about balance. Every decision, including making a site a free-for-all restricts somebody. The way I see it, there are many activities that are improved by restricting motorized access, including hunting, for those of us that like to hunt in the backcountry, as well as hiking, fishing, birdwatching, etc, all the activities that are better appreciated in silence.

Alberta has vast areas that are open to quadding, I don't believe that asking for some of the convenient, picturesque, and sensitive sites to be protected is an unfair proposition.

And what about the equally vast areas that are not open to quadding, or not accessible to quads but but foot only?

There simply is no reasonable argument for additional OHV bans. More enforcement maybe, but definitely not an outright ban.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by Newview01

And what about the equally vast areas that are not open to quadding, or not accessible to quads but but foot only?

There simply is no reasonable argument for additional OHV bans. More enforcement maybe, but definitely not an outright ban.

Yep, those areas are actually huge. There is a ton of land in the east slopes where atv's are a no go.
More enforcement would be great, fines would cover a lot of the costs. Perhaps lack of helmet fines can be used as well. I am sure I will be contributing to the cause

Wonder which organization Willy represents?

[Newview01]

Originally Posted by alberta_bha

I'm sure that would be news to those hunters who actually hunt on foot, in Alberta. But, everyone has different experiences.

That being said, I would definitely pay for a helicopter to haul out the next elk I harvest, that would be pretty amazing, not to mention really convenient, and at a low price of $3,500/hr.

You have clearly missed the point.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

Really Don,

Have you forgotten how Mountain Equiptment Coop, the founding financial institution of Y2Y, raised the funds to market the advocacy for the Alberta Grizzly Bear hunt closure campaign?




Y2Y and blood related (financing and sponsorship) organizations learned to clean up their marketing tools of obvious anti-hunting bias, instead promoting the creation of "Sanctuaries" where Aboriginal hunting is allowed, but closed to all else, as happened with the Kluane National park efforts.

Y2Y strongly advocates the elimination of ALL predator hunting.


A person needs to be willfully blind if they research the history and still believe Y2Y is ambivalent towards hunting.


I have heard of the BHA, and first impression was that perhaps it is a group worth supporting. Hearing that BHA is actually aligned with Y2Y, well, that takes them OFF the list.

As an active advocate for maintaining hunting rights for ALL people, there is no way I could suggest anyone support this group.


-------

As to Y2Y policy, a person, and Don SHOULD know, has to read between the lines.


Y2Y Hunting Fishing Policy, between the lines in Red

Y2Y's Hunting, Trapping and Fishing Policy Revised Fall 2012
The Yellowstone to Yukon Conservation Initiative (Y2Y) is committed to the ecological integrity of, and long term health of habitats and wildlife populations within, the Yellowstone to Yukon region. Within this context, Y2Y recognizes that hunting, trapping, and fishing:

 are indigenous rights;
Y2Y will purport support for hunting, but only for Aboriginal harvest. Everyone else, you WILL NEVER get support from us.

 are part of the cultural heritage and economy of the Yellowstone to Yukon region;
So we will finance non-hunting advocacy groups to replace this heritage and economy with non-consultive uses such as Bear photography.

 are appropriate activities within the Yellowstone to Yukon region, provided that they are
conducted in an ethical manner that includes fair chase principles; and
 may be appropriate means to help maintain or manage fish and wildlife population health.
In saying so, we mean that hunting will only be used when prey species become so over-populated in an area that they become a serious problem and non-human predators are not able to provide the control needed. Remember, we advocate No Predator Hunting, so that only "natural" predators can kill prey species. No predators? Well, we will finance a wolf introduction.


In addition, Y2Y acknowledges the legitimacy of wildlife sanctuaries set aside from hunting, fishin,g or trapping where wildlife populations can recover from the impacts of the developed landscape, to protect wildlife genetics from the impacts of selection from human-caused mortality, and which act as source populations for hunting, trapping, and fishing opportunities outside their boundaries.

Remember the Bighorn and now Thinhorn research claiming hunting induced genetic selection, we helped with that. This is part of the strategy to eliminate hunting from areas within 200 km of National Park boundaries, We got Parks Canada on board, too bad the Alberta Gov. disagreed. Anyways, we will continue to lobby and finance the establishment of more National and Provincial Parks, where NO Hunting will be allowed (baby steps), while marketing to the masses that we Actually support hunting. *****ers!

You have already been proven correct in this thread WB

[alberta_bha]

Originally Posted by Newview01

And what about the equally vast areas that are not open to quadding, or not accessible to quads but but foot only?

There simply is no reasonable argument for additional OHV bans. More enforcement maybe, but definitely not an outright ban.

I agree that additional enforcement is needed across the board. We do agree that the province needs to do better, and the OHV community needs to (and who admitted as much) needs to better regulate their "bad apples", as the AOHVA president eloquently put it.

As for the ban (by which you are referring to Castle), obviously we disagree, but I'm not going to re-hash the same arguments that all sides have been having for the past few months.

When you say "equally vast that are not open to quadding", which lands are you referring to? Considering that 93% of Alberta public land that is considered open-use, including OHV, I'm curious as to what you mean. Are you referring to the National and Provincial parks, or private land?

https://albertawilderness.ca/wordpre...nd_open_ab.pdf

This above map was compiled using AEP geodata, which is freely accessible from the province.

[slickwilly]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

Yep, those areas are actually huge. There is a ton of land in the east slopes where atv's are a no go.
More enforcement would be great, fines would cover a lot of the costs. Perhaps lack of helmet fines can be used as well. I am sure I will be contributing to the cause

Wonder which organization Willy represents?

I'm an independent, I cross my heart. Just a concerned citizen.

I am one of those pesky millenial urban hunters, so that might explain it.

[Newview01]

Originally Posted by alberta_bha

I agree that additional enforcement is needed across the board. We do agree that the province needs to do better, and the OHV community needs to (and who admitted as much) needs to better regulate their "bad apples", as the AOHVA president eloquently put it.

As for the ban (by which you are referring to Castle), obviously we disagree, but I'm not going to re-hash the same arguments that all sides have been having for the past few months.

When you say "equally vast that are not open to quadding", which lands are you referring to? Considering that 93% of Alberta public land that is considered open-use, including OHV, I'm curious as to what you mean. Are you referring to the National and Provincial parks, or private land?

https://albertawilderness.ca/wordpre...nd_open_ab.pdf

This above map was compiled using AEP geodata, which is freely accessible from the province.

The vast areas are those not available and not accessible by OHV. Just because OHVs are allowed, it does not mean they are there.

And as far as disagreeing going, I would love to open up the discussion because nobody has come forward with a good reason for the OHV ban. What is your excuse for supporting it?

[takeiteasybird]

Originally Posted by pikergolf

Responsible Off-Highway Vehicle (OHV) Use and Management
Hunters and anglers know that the hike in is usually worth the pack out. Consequently, it’s imperative that motorized vehicle use is balanced with maintaining habitat and non-motorized recreational opportunities. Sportsmen are acutely aware of how illegal off-highway vehicle abuse scars the land, pollutes water, spreads invasive weeds, displaces wildlife and violates the solitude of the backcountry. BHA supports reasonable regulations – and swift enforcement – that encourage responsible OHV use while addressing the needs of fish and wildlife, the security of their habitat and quality hunting and fishing experiences for the general public.

http://www.backcountryhunters.org/public_lands

I can definitely agree with that.