Durable mid efficient forced air furnace?

[Pathfinder76]

Does anyone have a recommendation? Does one exist? It seems that everyone I know with a newer furnace is constantly having them fixed. The amount of motherboards being replaced (service man scam?) is ridiculous.

I am about to replace my furnace and I want something that is durable and well built. Thanks.

[twofifty]

Look into one of those Savage furnaces. They're not the fanciest looking or most efficient, but accomplish the basic mission at a reasonable price.

[crazyperch]

They stopped making the mid efficient furnaces a few years back. You will have to get a high efficient furnace now. i personally would go with a Carrier but lennox is good as well. stay away from the lower end furnaces like Goodmann

[Justanotherbuck2]

Mid efficiency furnace are no longer available in Canada, condensing furnaces only. The key is maintenance, I have been doing this for 33 years and the only problem with the new furnaces is the lack of customer annual maintenance by professional techs. Gone are the days of the home owner being able to maintain their own furnace other than filter changes. Every furnace on the market is built to a high quality standard, start with a quality installer and a good maintenance schedule and you will not be disappointed, if you look for the discount installer that's what you will likely receive for service as well.

[JohninAB]

Originally Posted by twofifty

Look into one of those Savage furnaces. They're not the fanciest looking or most efficient, but accomplish the basic mission at a reasonable price.

[CaberTosser]

As others have noted, mid-efficient furnaces are no longer available, they were legislated out. You'll be looking to install a condensing furnace.

[greywolf]

Originally Posted by Justanotherbuck2

Mid efficiency furnace are no longer available in Canada, condensing furnaces only. The key is maintenance, I have been doing this for 33 years and the only problem with the new furnaces is the lack of customer annual maintenance by professional techs. Gone are the days of the home owner being able to maintain their own furnace other than filter changes. Every furnace on the market is built to a high quality standard, start with a quality installer and a good maintenance schedule and you will not be disappointed, if you look for the discount installer that's what you will likely receive for service as well.

So tell me, what annual maintenance must be done by a "professional" tech that a homeowner isn't capable of doing????

[benamen]

My office coworker put in the most expensive furnace Carrier makes last fall. Got it fired up in November and in April, it needed a new control board.
Good thing for warranty as I think he said the board was $1500.00

[Pathfinder76]

This is my fear. I know of at least five people this winter who were told by professional techs that there mother board was shot. One got a second opinion and was told this is the biggest scam going.

[savagewsm]

If you have an older furnace already in place look into just fixing it. I know there comes a point where it cannot be fixed but if it is fixable I'd go with that. My old furnace was put in in 1969 and is still going strong. I had to change the motor this year for the first time. That was $120 installed.

I have it inspected every couple of years. Perhaps I am burning a bit more gas than the newer oner but considering the repair stories I've heard I don't think I am losing any money. My relative has already put in well over $2000 into their high efficiency furnace. Funny how it crapped out right after the warranty expired.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by savagewsm

If you have an older furnace already in place look into just fixing it. I know there comes a point where it cannot be fixed but if it is fixable I'd go with that. My old furnace was put in in 1969 and is still going strong. I had to change the motor this year for the first time. That was $120 installed.

I have it inspected every couple of years. Perhaps I am burning a bit more gas than the newer oner but considering the repair stories I've heard I don't think I am losing any money. My relative has already put in well over $2000 into their high efficiency furnace. Funny how it crapped out right after the warranty expired.

This is where I may stay for sure.

[avb3]

My last house had a fifty year old furnace. Had the firebox inspected each fall. There was no reason to replace it, as the math just did not make sense.

Not replacing the furnace in the house I'm renovating right now either.

The new furnaces just don't last long enough to get a pay back. I can virtually guarantee none will work 30 years from now, let alone 50.

[357xp]

The older furnaces are usually more reliable for sure. Hate working on the newer ones, to many gadgets on there for a furnace. Now u r supposed to be a computer tech to fix a furnace.

[Selkirk]

Sorry folks, and no offence meant, but I have to chuckle at some of the comments being made here about keeping that old 'dinosaur' of a furnace, rather than replacing it with a new high-efficient furnace

Those old furnaces were only about 60-70% efficient when they were brand new, and as they age they get even more inefficient. By the time they are 30+ years old, their efficiency has dropped down to about 40-50% ... costing you 'HUGE' amounts on your gas & electrical bills each month.

Then of course, there's the other issue with old furnaces. Like anything else old, they are at a much higher risk of failure (break-down). And guess when old furnaces usually like to break-down. You guessed it ... on cold winter nights.

To each their own, I guess

Mac

P.S.
My 8 year old high-efficient furnace (94% efficient) works just great, and I've never had a problem with it ... ever!
.

[benamen]

If you look on kijiji there are tons of mid efficient furnaces for sale. I picked one up for $50 and it is going into the garage to replace the 35 year old furnace that is in there now.

[twofifty]

Chuck, if your current mid eff furnace has a good heat exchanger (not leaking), you'll probably be further ahead to fix it.
Don't know how long the parts will be available though.

Why are you looking to replace it?

[wildwoods]

Originally Posted by crazyperch

They stopped making the mid efficient furnaces a few years back. You will have to get a high efficient furnace now. i personally would go with a Carrier but lennox is good as well. stay away from the lower end furnaces like Goodmann

Bang on

[avb3]

Originally Posted by MacLeod

Sorry folks, and no offence meant, but I have to chuckle at some of the comments being made here about keeping that old 'dinosaur' of a furnace, rather than replacing it with a new high-efficient furnace

Those old furnaces were only about 60-70% efficient when they were brand new, and as they age they get even more inefficient. By the time they are 30+ years old, their efficiency has dropped down to about 40-50% ... costing you 'HUGE' amounts on your gas & electrical bills each month.

Then of course, there's the other issue with old furnaces. Like anything else old, they are at a much higher risk of failure (break-down). And guess when old furnaces usually like to break-down. You guessed it ... on cold winter nights.

To each their own, I guess

Mac

P.S.
My 8 year old high-efficient furnace (94% efficient) works just great, and I've never had a problem with it ... ever!
.

I agree... My fifty year old furnace was probably only 50% efficient.

However, my gas bills were only marginally higher than my neighbor in a similar sized house. I had the advantage of large south facing windows which captured sunlight in the winter.

There is no way I could see me coming out ahead once I factored in the cost of purchase and install of a high efficiency furnace, especially with the expect longevity of them and maintenance costs factored in.

YMMV.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by twofifty

Chuck, if your current mid eff furnace has a good heat exchanger (not leaking), you'll probably be further ahead to fix it.
Don't know how long the parts will be available though.

Why are you looking to replace it?

My dad is a gas fitter and tin smith. He isn't getting any younger so thought now would be a good time.

[Sporty]

Just had our furnace tuned up and cleaned. We have the original furnace to our house which is about 25 years old. Our furnace guy was so happy, he said he hates the new furnaces and for the cost of these "energy" efficient furnaces to install only to save about $40-$50 on your utility costs, it would take years before they begin to pay for themselves and that is without any costly repairs.

He told us, like everything else, all the older stuff is made better and if our furnace were to break down, it would likely cost a few hundred dollars in parts and it would be good. Ours is in great shape and has a few years left in it. We're going to be selling our house and our Realtor suggested we install a new furnace, our furnace guy left a note with his invoice for our Realtor telling her that our furnace is probably better than many of the newer expensive models and has many good years left to it.

I can't speak for those who have high efficiency furnaces but after hearing from some of my friends and their friends, who have high efficiency furnaces' how high their heating costs were over the past couple of winters, my bills were consistently lower than their's. Either they jack their heat up or my furnace isn't doing too badly in the efficiency department.

[Homesteader]

I'll agree for the most part that the high efficient is the way to go. When we moved we went backwards to a mid efficient Lennox. I had a high efficient carrier, MVP58 maybe, can't remember the number. Anyway my recommendation if you do go high efficient is to go with a dc motor. You'll save more money on power, then you will on gas. I had to replace the ignitor on mine after about a year, but it then ran perfectly till we sold it 5yrs later, so not sure how long it went without any problems but it was a sweet furnace. When I replace this one it will be with something along the same lines.

My only question to add for the guys in the know is how hard is it to install the condensing exhaust into the existing roof vent, or does it have to be run on the horizontal out the wall?? If so mine will be a real pig, to vent.

[greywolf]

Originally Posted by Homesteader

My only question to add for the guys in the know is how hard is it to install the condensing exhaust into the existing roof vent, or does it have to be run on the horizontal out the wall?? If so mine will be a real pig, to vent.

Direct vent out the wall

[bobinthesky]

I put in a new high efficiency Trane furnace last fall and come January in the -20 something degree weather, it decided to quit. It took the service guy 2 days to get it going again while I heated the house with the gas cook stove and a couple of electric heaters. The repair man claimed to have put $1600 in parts into it and I had to fight to get warranty.
A month ago, it quit again and I had to get the service guy in to fix it again! This furnace is barely 8 months old.

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by bobinthesky

I put in a new high efficiency Trane furnace last fall and come January in the -20 something degree weather, it decided to quit. It took the service guy 2 days to get it going again while I heated the house with the gas cook stove and a couple of electric heaters. The repair man claimed to have put $1600 in parts into it and I had to fight to get warranty.
A month ago, it quit again and I had to get the service guy in to fix it again! This furnace is barely 8 months old.

There's a lot to be said about things that work , as opposed to those that break down and are about impossible to fix, efficiency be damned. Unfortunately , that's the Future.

Grizz

[Selkirk]

This thread is getting reeeal entertaining ... it seems that some people just cant' handle 'change'.

According to my Father, they were saying the same things when forced-air furnaces took over from gravity furnaces. For some people, that was; The end of the world!

For further entertainment, we should start a new thread about those gosh-darn, newfangled cars with automatic transmissions

Welcome to the future, folks!

Mac

[357xp]

Are you an HVAC tech, Mac?

[benamen]

Originally Posted by MacLeod

This thread is getting reeeal entertaining ... it seems that some people just cant' handle 'change'.

According to my Father, they were saying the same things when forced-air furnaces took over from gravity furnaces. For some people, that was; The end of the world!

For further entertainment, we should start a new thread about those gosh-darn, newfangled cars with automatic transmissions

Welcome to the future, folks!

Mac

I think anyone on this thread can handle change for the better rather than just change for change sake. When I got quotes on my last furnace for my house, one of the contractors did state that the newer furnaces won't save you money. What you save on natural gas you will spend on repairs.
So far, the furnace in the house has only needed one switch replaced in the 12 years I have had it. And that was on warranty (I did the install myself). The original furnace for my house was put into my garage and is still running. But I did have to replace the drive belt once.

[twofifty]

Originally Posted by chuck

My dad is a gas fitter and tin smith. He isn't getting any younger so thought now would be a good time.

Is your dad set up to test the heat exchanger? Apparently there is a stinky or smoky compound that can be released in the combustion side of the heat exchanger, while the blower fan is running but the burner isn't.

If the smell comes through the heat vents in the house, the heat exchanger is toast.

Another consideration with a new furnace is that the warranty is probably dependent upon the supplier doing all of the installation. If your dad does the whole install there may not be a warranty when the motherboard goes.

[Selkirk]

Originally Posted by 357xp

Are you an HVAC tech, Mac?

No, I don't work in the trade or business, but I know several who do. I also get a lot of exposure to furnaces (and the subject) in my work, as an NRCan Energy Advisor.

As an alternative, the OP might want to consider buying a second hand mid-efficient furnace (80% efficient), if it's not too old. He would just want to make sure the heat exchanger isn't faulty, before putting any money down.

Mac

[Homesteader]

Originally Posted by greywolf

Direct vent out the wall

So you're saying a condensing furnace can't be vented vertically by piping thru the existing chase space?