Some bathroom reading...cause it'll make you puke!

Is Trophy Hunting A Form of Serial Killing?
Lion Expert and Conservationist Gareth Patterson Takes Aim
By Gareth Patterson

Published in Personality March 12, 1999

For me and many of the people who contact me to offer their support, killing innocent animals for self-gratification is no different from killing innocent people for self-gratification. By extension, then, trophy hunting--the repeated killing of wild animals--should surely be viewed as serial killing. And in the same moral light humanity's thinking is, I feel beginning to approach such a level of morality.

What are the comparisons between trophy hunting and serial killing?

To attempt to answer this question, I did some research into the gruesome subject of serial killing. I learnt firstly that serial murder is a grotesque habit which analysts regard as addictive. Serial murder, I learnt, is about power and control--both linked to the killers' longing "to be important."

It appears when the serial killer commits the first act of murder, he experiences feelings such as revulsion and remorse, but the killing--like a dose of highly addictive drug--leads to more and more murders until the person is stopped. Researchers have discovered that serial murderers experience a cooling-off period after a killing, but as with a drug craving, the compulsion--the need to kill--builds up again until the killer heads out again in search of another victim.

Trophy hunters are mostly "repeat" killers. This is further fueled by the elite SCI trophy hunting competitions. It has been calculated that in order for a hunter to win these competitions in all the categories at the highest level, he would have to kill at least 322 animals.

Pornography is perceived by analysts as a facter that contributes toward serial killers' violent fantasies--particularly "bondage-type" pornography portraying domination and control over a victim.

Hunting magazines contain page after page of (a) pictures of hunters, weapon in hand, posing in dominating positions over their lifeless victims, (b) advertisements offering a huge range of trophy hunts, and (c) stories of hunters' "exciting" experience of "near misses" and danger.

These pages no doubt titillate the hunter, fueling his own fantasies and encouraging him to plan more and more trophy hunts.

Trophy hunters often hire a camera person to film their entire hunts in the bush, including the actual moments when animals are shot and when they die. These films are made to be viewed later at will, presumably for self-gratification purposes and to show to other people--again the longing "to be important" factor?

This could also be seen as a form of trophy which mirrors in some respect pornographic "snuff" videos known to be made by some serial killers. Other serial killers have tape-recorded the screams of their victims, which were kept for later self-gratification.

This is a strong urge to achieve perceived "heroism" in serial murderers. This is linked to the individual's craving for "self-esteem." Student Robert Smith, for example, who in November 1996 walked into a beauty parlor in Mesa, Arizona, and shot five women and two children in the back of the heads, said of his motivation to kill: "I wanted to become known, to get myself a name."

Multiple killer Cari Panzram (among whose victims were six Africans he shot in the back "for fun" while working for an oil company in Africa) once stated of his actions: "I reform people." When asked "How?" he replied: "By killing them." Panzram also liked to describe himself as "the man who goes around doing good."

The "Stockwell Strangler" of South London in the mid-1980s who told police: "I wanted to be famous" is another example of how the serial killer clearly confuses notoriety for fame.

Are the trophy hunter’s killings linked to the serial killer's addiction to murder, to achieve what is perceived to be heroism, to deep-rooted low self-esteem, to wanting to be famous--the "name in the trophy book” motivation?

Certainly one could state that, like the serial killer, the trophy hunter plans his killing with considerable care and deliberation. Like the serial killer he decides well in advance the "type" of victim--that is, which species he intends to target. Also like the serial killer, the trophy hunter plans with great care where and how the killing will take place--in what area, with what weapon.

What the serial killer and trophy hunter also share is a compulsion to collect "trophies" or "souvenirs" of their killings. The serial killer retains certain body parts and/or other trophies"--"...for much the same reason as the big game hunter mounts the head and antlers taken from his prey...as trophies of the chase," according to Colin Wilson and Donald Seaman in The Serial Killers, a book on the psychology of violence.

In The Serial Killers, the authors also wrote about Robert Hansen, an Alaskan businessman and big-game enthusiast who hunted naked prostitutes through the snow as though they were wild animals, then shot them dead. Hansen would point a gun at his victim, order her to take off all her clothes, and then order her to run. He would give his victims a "start" before stalking them. The actual act of killing his victims, Hansen once said, was an "anti-climax" and that "the excitement was in the stalking."

How many times have I heard trophy hunters describing their actions in similar terms? "No, hunting is just about killing," they say. "It’s also about the stalk, the build-up to the kill."

Hansen was a trophy hunter, who, according to Wilson and Seaman, had achieved "celebrity by killing a Dall sheep with a crossbow." He also trophy hunted women but, as a married man with a family, he couldn’t put his human trophies next to those elk antlers and bear skins in his den.
As an alternative, Hansen, it was revealed, took items of jewellery from his victims as "trophies" and hid these in his loft so that, as with his animal trophies, he, the hunter, could relive his fantasy-inspired killings whenever he wished to.

In Londen in 1988, again according to Wilson and Seaman, Jack the Ripper cut off one victim’s nose and breasts and "as if they were trophies, displayed them on a bedside table, together with strips of flesh carved from her thighs."

Jewellery, body parts, clothing such as underwear and so on, are all known "trophies" of the serial killer. One serial killer flayed his victim and made a waistcoat from the skin as a "souvenir" or "trophy."

What could the non-hunting wives, girlfriends, brothers, sisters, mothers, fathers and children reveal of the nature and behavior of a hunter in the family? Could they reveal that the hunter had a very disturbed childhood?

Almost half the serial killers analysed during behavioral research were found to have been sexually abused in childhood. Environmental problems early in life manifest in many cases in violence such as cruelty to animals. Maybe they have a frustrated craving for "self-esteem," a deep desire to be recognized, a resentment against society? All these factors are some of the known links to the profile of the serial killer.

Lastly, serial killing has been described as a "20th-Century phenomenon." The same could be said of Western trophy hunting in Africa.

[hal53]

Sad thing is he's probably doing his "research" on a Gov't grant that the taxpayers are paying for......think I'll just let an idiot like that revel in his own self admiration.....WHAT A FOOL!!!!!!

[Tuc]

Hey Sheep, good to see you back !

[kranky]

IMHO the only thing that seperates a tree hugger and a hunter is the corner grocery store. If there wasn't one they would be hunters just like you and I.

[kayaker]

I'll give Patterson his dues for really living deep in the Botswana bush in a very meagre fashion but he has unfortunately been gunning for hunters for years (as this date shows, in fact it seems he has been quiet of late, replaced by others). He certainly has some impressive experiences but amongst the professional conservation community I know in Southern Africa he doesn't actually garner much respect. Many wildlife managers I have met dont think much of him...

[trophyboy]

Why do you even give these hypocrites any recognition at all?

[huntinstuff]

Sorry guys, I have to agree with him.

Yup, he is correct, no doubt about it.

All of his points are valid and his comparisons cannot be disputed.

SCENE 24: HUNTINSTUFF IS LAYING IN HOSPITAL BED. DOCTOR ENTERS THE ROOM

"Pardon me doctor, why yes I know why I'm in the hospital. I was walking down the street when a brick fell off that old building and hit me on the head......yes, I feel just fine, thank you doctor. What am I doing, you ask? Oh just typing to some guys on Alberta Outdoorsmen. What's that , doctor? My mommy is here??? Oh I hope she brought me my nightlight. I can't sleep without it...."

[huntinstuff]

You would have to have brain damage to think like that......

Serial Killer.

He should meet a serial killer........

[hunt_and_fish]

Yuck. I couldn't even force myself to read the whole thing.

I fear that we as outdoorsmen are going to be in a serious battle to retain our hunting privileges over the coming years. Negative propaganda like this will be the enemy's primary weapon. The most ridiculous thing is that there are people that will read this and actually take it into consideration because they don't understand hunting or the benefits that come with it.

[Jamie]

Unfortunatly there has been a few "Hunters' on this board who would aggree with the nut job that wrote that POS.

I Remember a certain Chef (Not Calgary Chef) who had some of the same ideas.

Jamie

[McLeod Valley]

Maybe this guy was abused as a child. In this I mean he spent too much time pondering all that literairy trash , so his dad couldent take him out to the bush and teach him to hunt and fish. Or maybe his dad tryed to teach him how to hunt and fish but although he liked it he just was'nt any good at it.Hmmm thats it he himself, must have been an abused child!!!

[farmerbob]

Originally Posted by hunt_and_fish

Yuck. I couldn't even force myself to read the whole thing.

I fear that we as outdoorsmen are going to be in a serious battle to retain our hunting privileges over the coming years. Negative propaganda like this will be the enemy's primary weapon. The most ridiculous thing is that there are people that will read this and actually take it into consideration because they don't understand hunting or the benefits that come with it.

sad but true.

[flower]

That article SUCKS!!!

[Outdoor_Ed]

The writer has a goal to convince people that hunting is undesirble. So he tries to paint a very dark image of the type of person who would do such an act.

Wouldn't do him any good to point out that hunters also are about conservation and all that other good stuff.

MHO he is wrong.

Ed S.

[hal53]

Originally Posted by Outdoor_Ed

The writer has a goal to convince people that hunting is undesirble. So he tries to paint a very dark image of the type of person who would do such an act.

Wouldn't do him any good to point out that hunters also are about conservation and all that other good stuff.

MHO he is wrong.

Ed S.

Wonder how much he has spent on the conservation of our resource in comparison to hunters?????....BTW guess I'll have to tell my daughter(who served this country in Afghanistan)...it's my fault for turning her into a serial killer, for teaching/learning with her how to fish and hunt...not even any sense responding to someone like that.....gotta go...better phone somebody , cause my kid is training for the next deployment....wouldn't want a hunter or a fisher person over there.........

[pottymouth]

Wow what great article, so true I can't believe nobody on here made that connection .......Just one small point I don't agree with though, not all of us are serial killers ( trophy hunters) ,some of my friends and I must be ethnic cleansers (meat hunters), cause we try to kill only whitetail every year.

There should be a season for stupid.

[redneck posse]

what a load of bullsh*t. know i must go and revel in my trophies..

jaime i remember the chef you where talking about think he got droped on his head as a kid.

Originally Posted by redneck posse

what a load of bullsh*t. know i must go and revel in my trophies..

jaime i remember the chef you where talking about think he got droped on his head as a kid.

he got droped on his head as a kid.How do you "KNOW" have you met him ?

Before I start writing this post I want you all to know that I have nothing against hunting....IF IT WILL BE USED FOR FOOD !!!!!!
If you want to go on a hunt just for the sake of having an animal head on your wall then you aren't much of a hunter at all!! Now almost every animal in North America can be eaten and I don't think there is a good hunter out there that just kills for the sake of killing .When if comes to Hunters (and I use that term loosely) who go to a 3rd world Country like Africa just to say I have killed a beast aren't much of a hunter at all!

You go to Africa and shoot a hole into an animal the size of a baseball led by guides and their helpers who could take you to these animals with their eyes closed. You call this hunting? Why not just go to the circus and shoot the animals as they do their tricks???
Any guide will tell you that they all have "honey" spots where even the worst of hunters stands a better than average chance of getting his game. And he knows he will be taking his meat home with him or donating it to someone who does need it. This is hunting the way it should be.

There was a poster on here who was showing all the animals he and his wife shot and killed while in Africa. He was proud as a peacock that he killed these wild animals!.. Did he kill them for meat ?....no.Did he kill them because they were attacking or threatening?...no.. He killed them because he always wanted to go to Africa and come back with some heads or shoulder mounts for his wall. I remember being in Manitoba and visiting my Taxidermist friend when this knucklehead came in with his equally as stupid friend. They were carrying a bear that might have weighed 130 LBS. and wanted it mounted. The one that shot it was so proud and said in regards to the bear "It was either him or me!!". I thought this guy was an idiot and I am sorry to say anyone who goes to Africa just to shoot a dumb animal and then considers themselves "The great white Bawana Hunter" .

I am a true believer that going to Foreign Countries just to kill should be banned. But as long as dummies like this guy I was talking here about will pay tons money to go kill then it won't.
I really think this is what give hunters a bad reputation, but the ones who want the Monster looking Zebra with a killer look in it's eyes.
It sure doesn't take much to pull the trigger now does it!!!!

Originally Posted by hal53

Wonder how much he has spent on the conservation of our resource in comparison to hunters?????....BTW guess I'll have to tell my daughter(who served this country in Afghanistan)...it's my fault for turning her into a serial killer, for teaching/learning with her how to fish and hunt...not even any sense responding to someone like that.....gotta go...better phone somebody , cause my kid is training for the next deployment....wouldn't want a hunter or a fisher person over there.........

A fisher person over there would be great! She could slip out at night with her fly rod , put on a little midnight blue skidder-fly and take out the enemies eyes so they can shoot the sand out of each other!!

On the serious side my friend..I wish only the best and a safe return home for your daughter.

[BrownBear416]

Originally Posted by randyfromalberta

Before I start writing this post I want you all to know that I have nothing against hunting....IF IT WILL BE USED FOR FOOD !!!!!!
If you want to go on a hunt just for the sake of having an animal head on your wall then you aren't much of a hunter at all!! Now almost every animal in North America can be eaten and I don't think there is a good hunter out there that just kills for the sake of killing .When if comes to Hunters (and I use that term loosely) who go to a 3rd world Country like Africa just to say I have killed a beast aren't much of a hunter at all!

You go to Africa and shoot a hole into an animal the size of a baseball led by guides and their helpers who could take you to these animals with their eyes closed. You call this hunting? Why not just go to the circus and shoot the animals as they do their tricks???
Any guide will tell you that they all have "honey" spots where even the worst of hunters stands a better than average chance of getting his game. And he knows he will be taking his meat home with him or donating it to someone who does need it. This is hunting the way it should be.

There was a poster on here who was showing all the animals he and his wife shot and killed while in Africa. He was proud as a peacock that he killed these wild animals!.. Did he kill them for meat ?....no.Did he kill them because they were attacking or threatening?...no.. He killed them because he always wanted to go to Africa and come back with some heads or shoulder mounts for his wall. I remember being in Manitoba and visiting my Taxidermist friend when this knucklehead came in with his equally as stupid friend. They were carrying a bear that might have weighed 130 LBS. and wanted it mounted. The one that shot it was so proud and said in regards to the bear "It was either him or me!!". I thought this guy was an idiot and I am sorry to say anyone who goes to Africa just to shoot a dumb animal and then considers themselves "The great white Bawana Hunter" .

I am a true believer that going to Foreign Countries just to kill should be banned. But as long as dummies like this guy I was talking here about will pay tons money to go kill then it won't.
I really think this is what give hunters a bad reputation, but the ones who want the Monster looking Zebra with a killer look in it's eyes.
It sure doesn't take much to pull the trigger now does it!!!!

You start off your post by saying this "Before I start writing this post I want you all to know that I have nothing against hunting....IF IT WILL BE USED FOR FOOD !!!!!! " And then follow it by stating all the reasons you dont like hunters??? Good post..looks like you put a lot of thought into it.

Hal53....Much respect to your DAUGHTER sir...

Originally Posted by BrownBear416

You start off your post by saying this "Before I start writing this post I want you all to know that I have nothing against hunting....IF IT WILL BE USED FOR FOOD !!!!!! " And then follow it by stating all the reasons you dont like hunters??? Good post..looks like you put a lot of thought into it.

Hal53....Much respect to your DAUGHTER sir...

BrownBear416;;

I have noting at all against hunters!! but if you kill eat, eat it! I never once said I gave reasons why I hate hunters !! My farourite meats are elk, bear , quail, rabbits and yes even the odd feed of squirrel.
All I am saying is that if you can spen upwards of $10,000.00 or more on a hunt just to consider yourself "king of the jungle", you are actually more like "George of the Jungle!!"

Now if someone was smart, they would start a hunting program that uses tranquilizer darts. You track and tranquilize the animal, it goes to sleep you get your picture taken and the animal walks away! Thats all the trophy you really need isn't it?
Damn, if you need a throphy that bad get a Zebra leg on Ebay..there is some guy selling them for $50.00 !!LOL

[BrownBear416]

[QUOTE=randyfromalberta;314246]

I have nothing at all against hunters!! but if you kill eat, eat it!

So what makes you think the animals killed while on a outfitted hunt,trophy hunting or in place like Africa are not EATEN???????

I find it pretty Pathetic that you are on here judging law abiding ethical hunters but yet you would support a type of hunt where you chase and tranquilize animals for fun..

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by randyfromalberta

Before I start writing this post I want you all to know that I have nothing against hunting....IF IT WILL BE USED FOR FOOD !!!!!!
If you want to go on a hunt just for the sake of having an animal head on your wall then you aren't much of a hunter at all!! Now almost every animal in North America can be eaten and I don't think there is a good hunter out there that just kills for the sake of killing .When if comes to Hunters (and I use that term loosely) who go to a 3rd world Country like Africa just to say I have killed a beast aren't much of a hunter at all!

You go to Africa and shoot a hole into an animal the size of a baseball led by guides and their helpers who could take you to these animals with their eyes closed. You call this hunting? Why not just go to the circus and shoot the animals as they do their tricks???
Any guide will tell you that they all have "honey" spots where even the worst of hunters stands a better than average chance of getting his game. And he knows he will be taking his meat home with him or donating it to someone who does need it. This is hunting the way it should be.

There was a poster on here who was showing all the animals he and his wife shot and killed while in Africa. He was proud as a peacock that he killed these wild animals!.. Did he kill them for meat ?....no.Did he kill them because they were attacking or threatening?...no.. He killed them because he always wanted to go to Africa and come back with some heads or shoulder mounts for his wall. I remember being in Manitoba and visiting my Taxidermist friend when this knucklehead came in with his equally as stupid friend. They were carrying a bear that might have weighed 130 LBS. and wanted it mounted. The one that shot it was so proud and said in regards to the bear "It was either him or me!!". I thought this guy was an idiot and I am sorry to say anyone who goes to Africa just to shoot a dumb animal and then considers themselves "The great white Bawana Hunter" .

I am a true believer that going to Foreign Countries just to kill should be banned. But as long as dummies like this guy I was talking here about will pay tons money to go kill then it won't.
I really think this is what give hunters a bad reputation, but the ones who want the Monster looking Zebra with a killer look in it's eyes.
It sure doesn't take much to pull the trigger now does it!!!!

Chef..Chef.. Thant You Chef???

See this is the EXACT type of guy I was referring to.

Your thoughts Sir are silly, uneducated and make you look ignorant.
Probably never been on a guided hunt, obviously has no clue WHAT SO EVER.
Do you even hunt for yourself? Or do you allow the Butcher to do it for you?

I hunt for many different reasons and one of them happens to be MEMORIES. And if the I happen to get a animal I wish to mount.. Well so be it. If it wasn’t for guys like me your friend the taxidermist would have been long out of work.

And yes I will do my best to travel the world and to hunt every place that I possibly can. My life will include seeing sunrises and sunsets all over the globe, and I will be doing it with a rifle in my hands and my family or friends by my side.

Do you actually think any meat over in Africa goes to waste? If so you need to do a bunch less talking a whole lot more listening.

I just noticed that you were over in another thread takeing POT shots at a fellow hunter for going Gopher hunting. You keep opening your mouth and you keep filling it with same old size 14 boot.


Jamie

Now if someone was smart, they would start a hunting program that uses tranquilizer darts. You track and tranquilize the animal, it goes to sleep you get your picture taken and the animal walks away! Thats all the trophy you really need isn't it?

That's actually being done with rhinos in Africa and jaguars in South America already. It's not for me but can understand the attraction to some.

Randy, I appreciate the fact that this is a public messageboard and that you are entitled to your opinion and whether I agree with it or not really doesn't matter but just to clarify one point: if you were talking about about me when you said,

There was a poster on here who was showing all the animals he and his wife shot and killed while in Africa. He was proud as a peacock that he killed these wild animals!.. Did he kill them for meat ?....no.Did he kill them because they were attacking or threatening?...no.. He killed them because he always wanted to go to Africa and come back with some heads or shoulder mounts for his wall.

you are a bit off base.

I went to Africa for the experience and while some of the animals will be mounted (many won't be), they are not being mounted to feed my ego or for some other self gratification but as reminders of a great hunt and a great experience. I hunt for the experience and to feed a primordial need that I have to be a hunter. Part of hunting for me is experiencing other cultures and hunting new areas. I appreciate the fact that you like to hunt close to home and only for meat but for me, hunting runs much deeper.

As a side note.....all of the meat in Africa was utilized by some very needy people. Yes, they could hunt for themselves or they can make money from allowing others to hunt their traditional lands and still get the benefit of the meat. To me, it seemed they are doing what's best for them while still allowing hunters like me with a wanderlust to hunt other parts of the world and to experience other cultures.

All I am saying is that if you can spen upwards of $10,000.00 or more on a hunt just to consider yourself "king of the jungle", you are actually more like "George of the Jungle!!"

All I consider myself is a guy that is very fortunate to have experienced another culture and shared a hunt with some very dedicated and knowledgeable people. The region we hunted was actually quite arrid. I'm more like George of the desert.

[Knownonscents]

Originally Posted by randyfromalberta

Why not just go to the circus and shoot the animals as they do their tricks???

sounds like fun. Can we shoot the clowns too??? Are you a circus clown???
Cause you kinda sound like your telling a bad joke in your post. I dont think you seeing the bigger picture from the statements you made. I really hope you read sheep hunters last post and really try to comprehend it. I am sorry for calling you a clown but those are very iggnorant statements you made. We all do it from time to time, but I think you should reconsider your thoughts.

And yes I am joking about shooting circus animals. unless they are circus gophers. cause that really does sound like a lot of fun.

[Walleyes]

Originally Posted by randyfromalberta

Before I start writing this post I want you all to know that I have nothing against hunting....IF IT WILL BE USED FOR FOOD !!!!!!
If you want to go on a hunt just for the sake of having an animal head on your wall then you aren't much of a hunter at all!! Now almost every animal in North America can be eaten and I don't think there is a good hunter out there that just kills for the sake of killing .When if comes to Hunters (and I use that term loosely) who go to a 3rd world Country like Africa just to say I have killed a beast aren't much of a hunter at all!

You go to Africa and shoot a hole into an animal the size of a baseball led by guides and their helpers who could take you to these animals with their eyes closed. You call this hunting? Why not just go to the circus and shoot the animals as they do their tricks???
Any guide will tell you that they all have "honey" spots where even the worst of hunters stands a better than average chance of getting his game. And he knows he will be taking his meat home with him or donating it to someone who does need it. This is hunting the way it should be.

There was a poster on here who was showing all the animals he and his wife shot and killed while in Africa. He was proud as a peacock that he killed these wild animals!.. Did he kill them for meat ?....no.Did he kill them because they were attacking or threatening?...no.. He killed them because he always wanted to go to Africa and come back with some heads or shoulder mounts for his wall. I remember being in Manitoba and visiting my Taxidermist friend when this knucklehead came in with his equally as stupid friend. They were carrying a bear that might have weighed 130 LBS. and wanted it mounted. The one that shot it was so proud and said in regards to the bear "It was either him or me!!". I thought this guy was an idiot and I am sorry to say anyone who goes to Africa just to shoot a dumb animal and then considers themselves "The great white Bawana Hunter" .

I am a true believer that going to Foreign Countries just to kill should be banned. But as long as dummies like this guy I was talking here about will pay tons money to go kill then it won't.
I really think this is what give hunters a bad reputation, but the ones who want the Monster looking Zebra with a killer look in it's eyes.
It sure doesn't take much to pull the trigger now does it!!!!

Please find what ever rock it was that you crawled out from underneath and place yourself back under it..

As far as the main post go's the capability to comment on such an article really alludes me,, I just wouldn't know where to start..

You would almost think that this buffoon could be charged for making such innuendos wouldn't you??

[cardiacphil]

Whoa...what an Arse hole...I wish the people in his family before him had not hunted or killed animals especially larger ones that would feed more people...Then these types of people would be extinct...

CP

[TheClash]

if...and this is a biiiig IF...if....any of us that consider ourselves hunters..do go out there for the enjoyment of the actual kill. if it is the blood lust you are after...not the experience of nature...but getting a physical high or release from killing another animal, from snuffing out that life from earth and you do nothing with said animal but mount it's head on the wall so that you can relive that fantasy blood lust over and over..then i can almost see the point of the article. however, i would imagine 99.99999999999999% of all of us do not feel this way....it is the enjoyment of nature, being the part of the cycle...and i would imagine that most of us do not relish the moment when we have to actually kill the animal...but know that it is a necessary part of the process and we strive to do it in the quickest, cleanest and least painful way we can. that, imho, separates a hunter from a killer.