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  #91  
Old 03-16-2018, 03:24 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Dick284 View Post
Give yer bean bag a good shake.
Flying off the handle based on pure speculation, yup that’s gonna give some credence to our persuits. It makes us look like dumb clucks.

Don’t you get it, rile us up, get us talking about speculation, bingo look at us we are a bunch of hot head dim switches going off half cocked.
+1 Nothing makes a person look more the fool, than protesting when you don't know what you are protesting.
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  #92  
Old 03-16-2018, 03:39 PM
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Obviously your the one who doesn't get it! They have a majority government. Once they introduce the bill, that's it. Libs wont vote against their own bill. Your probably just a Trudeau voter anyway........
We have no idea what to protest because nothing has been officially presented.
Wanna look like a half wit, just go screaming your mammeries off over pure speculation. It’s like throwing fists at a shadow.
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  #93  
Old 03-16-2018, 03:59 PM
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  #94  
Old 03-16-2018, 04:24 PM
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The coming legislation will also leave it to police to make the call on which currently restricted weapons should be put on the prohibition list.”

This is in the announcement by the liberals for their pending bill and what should be the main point of emails and letters.
Having the RCMP determine the class of a firearm without Government oversite is outrageous!
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  #95  
Old 03-16-2018, 04:35 PM
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The coming legislation will also leave it to police to make the call on which currently restricted weapons should be put on the prohibition list.”

This is in the announcement by the liberals for their pending bill and what should be the main point of emails and letters.
Having the RCMP determine the class of a firearm without Government oversite is outrageous!
And not only that, what firearm is currently restricted that should be prohibited?
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  #96  
Old 03-16-2018, 04:40 PM
whiteout whiteout is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Chuck_Wagon View Post
The coming legislation will also leave it to police to make the call on which currently restricted weapons should be put on the prohibition list.”

This is in the announcement by the liberals for their pending bill and what should be the main point of emails and letters.
Having the RCMP determine the class of a firearm without Government oversite is outrageous!
Unless they completely rewrite the FA, the RCMP still has to follow it when determining NR/R/Prohib. The only way around that is an order in council, which the RCMP can’t do.
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  #97  
Old 03-16-2018, 05:56 PM
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Unless they completely rewrite the FA, the RCMP still has to follow it when determining NR/R/Prohib. The only way around that is an order in council, which the RCMP can’t do.
no, the RCMP can't reclass any firearm on a whim, but the minister of public safety and a cabal of liberal bobbleheads can. which way do you think they'll vote? just to add insult to the matter, the upper echelon of the RCMP are nothing more than bureaucrats anyway. they aren't the common sense and strict but fair mounties of yesteryear.
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  #98  
Old 03-16-2018, 06:42 PM
Big Grey Wolf Big Grey Wolf is offline
 
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On CTV news yesterday mentioned legislation will be tabled early next week. Going to be quite a wild ride again!!
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  #99  
Old 03-16-2018, 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by whiteout View Post
Unless they completely rewrite the FA, the RCMP still has to follow it when determining NR/R/Prohib. The only way around that is an order in council, which the RCMP can’t do.
unless within the bill to be tabled on tuesday includes a revision to legislation that allows it, that's the problem!!
Tuesday will tell the tale.
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  #100  
Old 03-17-2018, 05:16 PM
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Default Polysesouvient Memo , June 2017 - Assault Weapons


I found a post about "Polysesouvient" on CGN - last fall. It potentially might be the platform for discussion in the house of common’s - this coming week. This post isn't to send everyone down another dark rabbit hole - only for learning more, about the "hot topic" of the day.

Polysesouvient's platform on Facebook : "We are a voluntary organization seeking all criminals,drug dealers,ganstas and real badd asses have no guns."

http://polysesouvient.ca/Documents/M...rmesAssaut.pdf (in French)

English translation:
June 2017

Issues and recommendations related to the availability of assault weapons in Canada (Federal Act)

1) Definition of assault weapons

Canadian law only defines weapons as "restricted" and "prohibited" and that is according a series of criteria. It does not define what constitutes "assault weapons." The gun lobby claims that assault weapons are already banned, because it defines them as the gun can fire "automatic" (which are indeed prohibited by law). However, government authorities around the wrld define "assault weapons" otherwise, according to specific criteria too. For example: According to a definition of the US Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and weapons (ATF), the existence of a "military configurations" following (other than the ability to accept a detachable magazine) made a weapon an assault weapon, not "sport": the ability to accept a detachable magazine, a folding stock, a bayonet mount, a pistol grip on a long weapon (to ensure more
stability when firing at succession "rapid fire"), a flash suppressor, a bipod, a grenade launcher and night vision lenses. More recently, the Supreme court of the United States confirmed the Maryland assault weapons ban as defined by the law: "all semi-automatic rifles that can shoot ammo center fire that can
accept detachable magazines and have two or more configurations as a flash suppressor or a pistol grip. " Thus, although certain features or accessories are prohibited in Canada, simply that a firearm has the ability to incorporate in itself a "military configuration" which increases the risk to public safety. In fact, the RCMP found that circumvention prohibitions or restrictions on shippers and firing mechanisms is fairly easily and commonly.

2) Deficiencies in the current system - arbitrary nature of the criteria

The problem with the current system is that the criteria do not reflect a systematic or consistent risk to public safety of various categories of weapons. Indeed, on this point we agree with the pro-gun groups
based on physical characteristics such as length of the weapon or the barrel, the classification appears often arbitrary. Criteria for restricted weapons: "According to the Criminal Code, a firearm is restricted: - a handgun that is not a prohibited firearm; - any firearm - which is not a prohibited firearm - with a barrel of less than 470 mm in length which can draw center-fire ammunition in a semi-automatic manner; - any firearm designed or adapted to discharge when it is reduced to a length of less than 660 mm by folding,
telescoping or otherwise; - any firearm designated as such by regulation." Take just the example of the Beretta CX4 Storm or the weapon used in the killing at Dawson College, which at the time was a restricted weapon. Since the killings, the manufacturer has brought to market a new model at the end of 2013, a slightly modified version in order to escape the requirements of the restricted class. Since this new model has a slightly longer barrel 470 mm (18.5 inches), or 19 inches, and that the firing mechanism is "rimfire" and not "central percussion", it is an unrestricted weapon. This is a perfect demonstration of arbitrary classification, which differs for two almost identical weapons simply depending on a slight difference in the length of the barrel.

3) Deficiencies of the current system - neglected regulations

The system had to rely on an update of Regulation containing the list of restricted and prohibited Weapons: The update of the list of restricted weapons and prohibited is especially necessary given the practice some manufacturers use to circumvent the intent of Parliament by slightly adapting and giving a new name to restricted or prohibited military weapons, all so that they can benefit from a less severe classification: "The expert in firearms and ballistics Alan Voth explains that arms manufacturers study the laws of each country and create a version adapted to the legislation of each of the markets, which gives them more
sales opportunities. "In order to thwart the spirit of the law, manufacturers can rely on manifestly arbitrary criteria such as the exact length of the barrel, as well demonstrates the example of the latest model Beretta CX4 Storm, whose classification is not restricted. The coroner who conducted the investigation into the tragedy at Dawson College was rightly criticized the federal government for failing in its responsibility in connection with the classification of the weapon used, saying that if the spirit of law would have been applied, the CX4 Storm Beretta was prohibited. " The legislature did not foresee the development and subsequent development of the 'bullpup' design when it adopted the 'Regulations Prescribing Certain Firearms and other Weapons, Components and Parts of Weapons, Accessories, Cartridge Magazines, Ammunition and projectiles as prohibited or restricted'.
The spirit of the Firearms Act was that the firearms, such as the CX4 Storm Beretta used by M. Gill, are prohibited rather than restricted. Only the government knows the reasons behind the sad fact that the
updating of the list has no (or almost no) was made since its creation in 1995, but it is reasonable to believe that the latter is connected to the enormous pressure from weapons amateurs towards a greater availability of assault weapons.

4) Deficiencies in the current system - classification by third parties

Another problem with the current system is that it depends on the good faith of manufacturers or importers, two entities that hold financial interests in the least severe classification of weapons produced or traded. Despite this conflict of interest between public safety and profits, these are private entities, respectively, design weapons and who propose a classification at the time of import. In general, physical verification of each weapon by the RCMP is done only on rare occasions. This therefore results in thousands of weapons that are wrongly categorized according to the RCMP, which emphasizes for this purpose "several false statements made by importers and auditors".
The case of the family of "Swiss Arms" and F-858 are but two examples that have attracted the attention of the media. Despite their initial classification as non-restricted weapons, subsequent investigations have prompted the RCMP in 2014 to revise it to "prohibited" because of their ability to "be converted into a fully automatic firearm." Given the thousands of such weapons already in circulation as well as the abolition of the register of non-restricted weapons that prevents the RCMP from identifying the owners,
the result is a huge public safety issue extremely difficult, if not impossible to solve. Another less known example is that of the unrestricted SKS rifle. In 2014, the RCMP issued a bulletin for the benefit of companies like anything, "a Russian SKS rifle without restriction manufacturing fully automatic discharge, which raises concerns in terms of public safety. ... The weapon fires only in automatic mode (no semi-automatic mode);" The Quebec controller estimates that "tens of thousands" of them were imported into Canada, of which more than 5,000 in Quebec. But to date, no action on their classification as
non-restricted weapons appears to have been undertaken. Why this inaction? Again, there is that pressure from pro-gun groups that may explain this stagnation in our view.

5) Deficiencies of the current system - unrestricted assault weapons

All of these elements have resulted in thousands of assault weapons that remain not only legal, but not restricted. Take another example, that of the IWI Tavor Tar-21: this weapon is considered an assault
weapon by his Israeli manufacturer and "developed in collaboration with the Israel Defense Forces." As a weapon not restricted, it is not only legally accessible to ordinary citizens, but it is also not restricted - that
is to say, not recorded, and therefore invisible to the authorities. IWI Tavor Tar-21 - Open weapon in Canada in all, many unrestricted assault weapons are commonly available on the web and in catalogs from merchants.

6) Approval of new models

Despite their own mandate to "act to eliminate ... the assault weapons of our streets ", the RCMP continues to approve the sale of new models of assault weapons (two of which are called" submachine guns "by their respectful manufacturer and which is classified as non-restricted weapon). Questioned
about this, their political aide said that "the government will not intervene in the decision of the police concerning the classification of weapons, since they are the experts in these technical decisions." However, as pointed out the RCMP in response to this, the police have to deal with the "definitions laid
down in the Criminal Code," which are set by the government - definitions that currently allow legal assault gun ownership. The RCMP therefore has little room for maneuver in terms of decision-making authority regarding decisions on the classification of a public safety perspective. Their role is limited to the
interpretation of the Act and the manifestly arbitrary criteria in this regard. Recently, the RCMP approved the marketing of three assault weapons, including a subject of advertising clearly presenting its "military"
use.

7) risk to public safety

There is no reason that can be rationally used to justify private ownership of firearms designed to kill humans. This position is shared by a member of the Liberal cabinet, having itself found that there was no
reason to allow Canada the possession of semi-automatic weapons like the one used to shoot down 20 children in Connecticut (referring to the AR-15, another model of assault weapon that is legal in Canada) and that the goal should be "put out of circulation, not to allow their use." There are many examples of recent tragedies committed with legal assault weapons, not only in the US but in Canada, including the murders of three RCMP officers in Moncton, the PQ election night, the killing at Dawson College, and the
tragedy at the Mosque of Quebec according to some media reports.
Moreover, the RCMP repeatedly alerted the federal Minister of Public Safety as to the risk posed by the availability of these weapons to public security. Justin Bourque used a semi-automatic rifle "Winchester 308 M305" to shoot three RCMP officers in June 2014 in Moncton. This weapon was a Chinese semiautomatic version of the weapon of the American military, the M14, the favorite of military weapons collectors. Bourque legally possessed this weapon. Richard Bain had in his possession a CZ-858 and a 30-
round magazine in the attack against Premier Pauline Marois in September 2012. If the weapon had not jammed when he tried to shoot a police officer, the results would probably have been very different (one person was shot: the stage technician Denis Blanchette). According to an academic expert, the CZ-858 is similar to the AK-47, with a few differences: CZ is more powerful and is known among experts as not as reliable. In 2014, the entire family of this weapon model was deemed prohibited by the RCMP because of his ability to "be converted into a fully automatic firearm", but their original classification "unrestricted" or "restricted" (depending on barrel length) was reinstated by the Harper government with the power he has given through Bill C-42, just weeks before federal elections in October 2015. In 2014, the majority of these weapons (7061) were "unrestricted", while 412 were "restricted". This is probably why, if we go to some media reports, Alexandre Bissonnette has been in lawful possession of a CZ-858 as part of the tragedy at the Mosque of Quebec in January 2017. As in the case of the attack against Marois, the weapon would be checked, which would mean that this is the second time that the death toll would have happened close to being much more important. The legal availability of such weapons is a serious risk to public safety.
Recommendation: the government should establish a new classification system that will ban once and for all assault weapons, or those designed to kill humans. Such a system must be based on a whole new range
of criteria, including the capacity of the weapon to accept military accessories (even if they are prohibited), its power, its scope and effectiveness or speed shooting among others. The system should also incorporate physical verification by the RCMP of each new model, including weapons identified by manufacturers as unrestricted and it BEFORE any classification and market introduction. Finally, a precautionary approach should prevail in any decision leading to classification in unrestricted or
restricted, that is to say which allow its legal possession by ordinary citizens.

8) Deficiencies in the current system - large capacity magazines

Finally, the 1991 Act (C-17) imposed a limit of 5 cartridges and 10 cartridges for long guns and handguns respectively. This was generally accepted and repeated by many official sources, including the safe handling firearms manual. Now, under the previous Conservative government, the RCMP has advanced a new interpretation of the law on these restrictions, interpretation going against the legislative intent of the Act of 1991 as evidenced by the Senior Political Adviser the Minister of Justice at the time, Ms. Kim Campbell, who had himself worked on the drafting of the bill in question. Indeed, in March 2011, the RCMP issued a special bulletin saying the law is only concerned with the
magazines of the firearm model for which that magazine is designed, not the gun that could accept the magazine: "the maximum allowed capacity of a magazine is determined by the type of firearm for which it was designed or manufactured and not by the type of firearm to which it can be used. Example: the Marlin rifle model 45 (Camp Carbine) calibrated 45 Auto accepts magazines designed and manufactured for the handgun Colt 1911. Therefore, magazines of seven bullets and eight bullets are allowed. " In other words,
a semi-automatic long gun" X "can be equipped with a magazine for more than five cartridges, provided that the magazine was not designed for this specific weapon, for example if it has designed for a gun "Y" and, even if the gun is prohibited in Canada, and although the magazine contains 10 rounds or more! Thus it would be legal to use a magazine filled with 15 cartridges (5.56 caliber) rifle designed for "Beowulf" (size 50), a prohibited weapon in Canada, in a semi-automatic rifle as long as the latter Beowulf is not, as confirmed by the RCMP in response to a reporter's question. Such a configuration is illegal in at least six US states. This interpretation is incredibly absurd and extremely irresponsible.
Recommendation: Clarify the rules to eliminate the loophole created by an abusive interpretation of restrictions on high capacity magazines, and to impose an actual limit of 5 cartridges for unrestricted weapons and 10 for restricted weapons
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  #101  
Old 03-17-2018, 08:59 PM
wolf308 wolf308 is offline
 
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Can't read that long
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  #102  
Old 03-18-2018, 09:48 AM
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Mass non compliance is the only way
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  #103  
Old 03-21-2018, 12:03 PM
claykuch claykuch is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Dick284 View Post
Act now on what?
Speculation?

Sure it’s gonna be a train wreck, the Libtards are at the helm, but running around on no information screaming your chicas off make us look like rubes.

Back ups about 8 steps take a deep breath and wait for the roll out.

You guys have been lured down a deep dark rabbit hole.
Not speculation, the bill is here now........... http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&...OoqYQeSuSDKa6N
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  #104  
Old 03-29-2018, 08:42 PM
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For those wanting to watch the BS bills progress: http://www.parl.ca/LegisInfo/BillDet...billId=9710291

I'm predicting mass non compliance, funerals and possibole uprisings in areas if it passes. So much is being 'modified' in this bill its stupid and on top of everything it does f*** all at dealing with crime, all it does is make criminals out of us law abiding citizens again.

......then again, its liberals in power.
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  #105  
Old 03-30-2018, 07:09 AM
mmmax mmmax is offline
 
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Just a few videos on the issue
NFA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NltBuZDi3kE


CSSA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKIfAyU7h3w


Michelle Rempel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EW0PGAUCopA

Ralph Goodale Do You Trust This Man? watch at 11:24 he states 5 priorities but holds up ten fingers!!!! There are a lot of things he mentions they are exploring.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9E4iPcb2RlQ
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  #106  
Old 04-06-2018, 08:15 AM
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Default Sixty days or Jail

Illinois is bypassing the American Constitution. Sixty days turn in your guns or go to Jail (sounds like monopoly game).

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-...guns-or-become
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  #107  
Old 04-06-2018, 08:31 AM
dmcbride dmcbride is offline
 
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Originally Posted by lmtada View Post
Illinois is bypassing the American Constitution. Sixty days turn in your guns or go to Jail (sounds like monopoly game).

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-...guns-or-become
I don't think it will be long until the RCMP ban the 10-22 here in Canada.
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  #108  
Old 04-06-2018, 08:48 AM
airbornedeerhunter airbornedeerhunter is offline
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I don't think it will be long until the RCMP ban the 10-22 here in Canada.
Deerfield is a tiny village with shallow pockets. They have already been served with legal paperwork dragging them into court over this as it violates state and federal law. The lawsuit has the backing of the NRA which has very deep pockets, the village gun grabbers will buckle under the financial strain due to legal costs and this idiocy will not be followed through with.
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  #109  
Old 04-06-2018, 08:58 AM
dmcbride dmcbride is offline
 
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Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter View Post
Deerfield is a tiny village with shallow pockets. They have already been served with legal paperwork dragging them into court over this as it violates state and federal law. The lawsuit has the backing of the NRA which has very deep pockets, the village gun grabbers will buckle under the financial strain due to legal costs and this idiocy will not be followed through with.
I hope you are right. Sadly, Canada with the Liberals in charge does not give me much confidence.
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  #110  
Old 04-06-2018, 09:35 AM
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Government wants to disarm you, we are getting closer to the Chaos stage. Where you will have higher taxes, less freedom, less money, less health services, more famine, and disease. This all part of history. Governments are preparing. Are you?

https://youtu.be/9w6QYPzF2TI
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  #111  
Old 04-06-2018, 10:35 AM
play.soccer play.soccer is offline
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The bill is going to committee now.
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  #112  
Old 04-06-2018, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by RavYak View Post
You won't stop them by opposing them. Someone needs to form a realistic platform on firearms and then propose it publicly to gain support and sway politicians to get behind you. If you only oppose the changes you will lose as there aren't enough of you but if you can get a bill with some proactive changes and allowances for reasonable firearm ownership/use then you might be able to get enough people on board.

Making all semi automatic firearms restricted is drastic. Semi automatic hunting rifles and shotguns do have a place in hunting. What I would propose is some sort of intermediate level classification between non restricted and restricted that applies to all non restricted semi automatic firearms and has tighter regulations but still allows hunters to use semi automatic hunting rifles/shotguns.

Prohibiting AR-15's is also drastic, restricted is fine. Reclassifying some other assault style firearms as restricted would be reasonable though.

Make a good platform and I would support you guys, I think the proposed changes if true are ridiculous. It wouldn't surprise me if our liberal government would consider doing these things though and they will likely see more support then opposition in doing so...
FUDD that is what you are. Assault style, you are speaking just like every other anti-gun owner out there. "Semi auto hunting firearms have a place in hunting" yeah is that that cause they have a wood stock? There's no difference between a 'semi auto hunting rifle" and as you say "an assault style rifle" other than appearance.
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  #113  
Old 04-06-2018, 10:39 AM
play.soccer play.soccer is offline
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After the last federal election, I liquidated all of my restricted firearms, and my non restricted ACR , because I suspected that the new government would enact some asinine legislation in order to appease the emotions of the anti firearms crowd. I wasn't really using them much, so I reinvested the money elsewhere rather than end up with firearms that would be reclassified or prohibited, which could drastically reduce their value. Now after hearing about the ruckus within the government over the upcoming changes, I am wondering if I will even be able to hunt with my semi auto waterfowl shotgun, or if the fools in power will make that illegal like it is in Australia.
Yep something something first they came for my black rifles and I said nothing, then they came for my semi-auto shotgun and I said nothing. You best sell your semi-auto duck gun and stick to your break actions, or maybe give those up while you're at it.
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  #114  
Old 04-06-2018, 10:40 AM
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Every time you give in to other people's demands, no matter how unreasonable, they are more likely to make more demands, because you have shown that you will always make concessions. That is why bullies always pick on the same people.
So much that people sell guns out of fear.
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  #115  
Old 04-06-2018, 10:41 AM
play.soccer play.soccer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick284 View Post
Act now on what?
Speculation?

Sure it’s gonna be a train wreck, the Libtards are at the helm, but running around on no information screaming your chicas off make us look like rubes.

Back ups about 8 steps take a deep breath and wait for the roll out.

You guys have been lured down a deep dark rabbit hole.
Hah yup this kind of attitude is why the bill is going to committee now.

"Just wait until we see more, still waiting to see more, still wanna see more, aw crap it passed, NOW is the time to moan and complain"
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  #116  
Old 04-06-2018, 10:46 AM
Newview01 Newview01 is offline
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Originally Posted by lmtada View Post
Government wants to disarm you, we are getting closer to the Chaos stage. Where you will have higher taxes, less freedom, less money, less health services, more famine, and disease. This all part of history. Governments are preparing. Are you?

https://youtu.be/9w6QYPzF2TI
Good general info in that video.

The cycle is unstoppable.

We should be questioning every new law the government passes and try to determine the underlying intent. Has nothing to do with being paranoid or conspiracies, it is just being prepared, at least with the knowledge of what can happen.
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