F150 Wipers Issue

[tbiddy]

So my wipers have quit working along with the fluid sprayer. They worked this morning. Made it an hour down the road and they no longer work. I checked the fuse and it’s fine. Replaced the 40a relay and it didn’t fix the issues. Any idea of what it might be. The turn signal and brights work. Just the wiper and wiper pump don’t.

[silvertip]

Are you sure you have power to the motor,

check that

might have to remove and bench test it

if you changed fuses or relay already

maybe motor

[Sooner]

Almost certain you need a new signal/wiper switch. My 97 did that. Try a wrecker first before you buy new.

If you have easy access to the wiper motor, you can unplug it, get 2 pins or what I use is rivets and put one in each of the clamps of a battery charger and touch the motor plug pins and see if the wiper motor engages. Easy way to test the motor without taking it out.

[tbiddy]

Thanks guys. I ended up booking it into a shop. I don’t have the time or anywhere warm to work on the truck. Mechanic I talked to didn’t think it was the signal/wiper switch cause the dimmer and signals still works. He’s thinking it’s the wiper motor. Guess it’s time to pull the old GMC 2500 out of the garage for work for the next few days.

[Cement Bench]

mine was a wiper motor but they did not know till after I pay for an hour diagnostic time, fancy that

I could have replaced the wiper motor for 30,bucks. bill was 210 ouch

[hogie]

Originally Posted by Cement Bench

mine was a wiper motor but they did not know till after I pay for an hour diagnostic time, fancy that

I could have replaced the wiper motor for 30,bucks. bill was 210 ouch

So had they replaced the motor and it didn't fix the problem would you have been happy? You had every right to go there and demand to have the motor replaced without paying for diagnosis. Customer is always right.

[Crankbait]

I thought it was the motor/pump but then bought a turn signal unit for $27 and it worked again. a youtube vid showed how to replace, took about 10 minutes and that was mostly fidgeting finding the release for the key unit with a paperclip.

[Dean2]

I will be very surprised if it turns out to be the wiper motor. With both the pump motor and the wiper motor not working at exactly the same time, fixing the wiper motor won't fix the pump. My bet would be that you have an electrical issue that is not getting power to the pump and the wiper motor. Be interested to hear the outcome.

[Grizzly Adams]

Son had a similar problem. Nothing is simple any more, the wipers are run by a computer module that needed to be replaced. Duh.

Grizz

[220 Swift]

What year F150

[tbiddy]

Originally Posted by 220 swift

what year f150

2013

[Strix]

I have a 2012. A few years ago I had a problem in that the wipers would not shut off. I had to pull the fuse to stop them. Turned out it was the "Multi-function Switch" that had to be replaced. Yours could be similar.

[Cement Bench]

Originally Posted by hogie

So had they replaced the motor and it didn't fix the problem would you have been happy? You had every right to go there and demand to have the motor replaced without paying for diagnosis. Customer is always right.

that is,not,what I,said,nor,implied
and the customer is not always right

I should have tried the wiper motor first at home so it was 30 bucks and a hour of my time to get the motor and put it in, fun anyway

what gets me is the mechanic who took the truck in hit the wiper function while getting,behind,the,wheel and diagnosed the,problem,after starting the truck for 10 seconds
the mechanic then went and got a wiper motor from parts and put it in the vehicle in less than 30 minutes from the time he walked out the door until I got the bill

they tried to charge me 2 hours and parts for over 330
I asked to see the service manager and said ask the mechanic how long it took

I happily settled for the amount above in the original comment

diagnosis should not be an hour if it takes 18 seconds it,should be included in the time to do the job

[hogie]

Originally Posted by Cement Bench

that is,not,what I,said,nor,implied
and the customer is not always right

I should have tried the wiper motor first at home so it was 30 bucks and a hour of my time to get the motor and put it in, fun anyway

what gets me is the mechanic who took the truck in hit the wiper function while getting,behind,the,wheel and diagnosed the,problem,after starting the truck for 10 seconds
the mechanic then went and got a wiper motor from parts and put it in the vehicle in less than 30 minutes from the time he walked out the door until I got the bill

they tried to charge me 2 hours and parts for over 330
I asked to see the service manager and said ask the mechanic how long it took

I happily settled for the amount above in the original comment

diagnosis should not be an hour if it takes 18 seconds it,should be included in the time to do the job

OK, the mechanic is paid by the job not by the hour. Diag fees can be anywhere from half an hour to one hour depending on shop. From the time the mechanic clocks on the job, getting the work order, finding vehicle and bringing in the shop, diag time, pricing out parts needed. Then getting approval from customer to do repairs. There is more to this than just hitting the motor.

I agree one hour is overcharged but disagree that diag should not have been charged at all.

Did they not give you an estimate that you agreed to or they just did the repair without informing you of the cost?

[Lefty-Canuck]

Where I work we have a minimum 2hr charge... whether it takes 5mins or 1hr 59mins. We charge a trail which includes 2hrs minimum... so travel time and 2hrs included in a flat rate based on distance from major center. That’s all upfront in the quote though. If a customer wants to try to fix it themselves first, all the power to them. But if you schedule a call and I show up on-site, there is a cost for that.

LC

[Dean2]

You guys can dance and pedal all you like but Cement Bench said from the time the mechanic went out to get the car till CB had the Bill in hand was 30 minutes. He brought the car to them, they did not come to him, 2 hours labour on a 30 minute job is BS. Flat rate has now become the "Thing" and in most cases the flat rate is now easily double the time it actually takes, and if it takes longer than flat rate they add extra hours under some other heading like diagnosis to cover it. This kind of behaviour explains why so many people have gone looking for independent operators we can trust. Thank goodness for guys like RandyBoBandy, and a couple of other great ones I deal with in Edmonton..

[hogie]

Originally Posted by Dean2

You guys can dance and pedal all you like but Cement Bench said from the time the mechanic went out to get the car till CB had the Bill in hand was 30 minutes. He brought the car to them, they did not come to him, 2 hours labour on a 30 minute job is BS. Flat rate has now become the "Thing" and in most cases the flat rate is now easily double the time it actually takes, and if it takes longer than flat rate they add extra hours under some other heading like diagnosis to cover it. This kind of behaviour explains why so many people have gone looking for independent operators we can trust. Thank goodness for guys like RandyBoBandy, and a couple of other great ones I deal with in Edmonton..

Book times are used by every shop. Independent or a dealer. Both can decide how the charge for diag. There are good and bad dealers and Independent shops out there. I have seen some bad examples of estimates from both over the years.

If I remember correctly flat rate times were put in place by Henry Ford. He made his dealers use it so pricing was consistent from dealer to dealer for repairs. I have some old auto publications from the fifties that had flat rate times for repairs. Flat rate has been around for decades.

Manufacturers make the times that are the warranty time. Chilton and other companies use the manufacturer times and bump them up to account for independent shops not necessarily having all the factory training or equipment. Also due to age. These are retail times.

As a customer you come to whatever shop you want for a concern. It gets diagnosed as to what's needed then you should be presented with an estimate to repair. You can agree to estimate or take elsewhere. I believe Alberta has some laws in place for this that have to be followed or a shop can be investigated.

An estimate for a repair should be relatively the same from shop to shop for labor. The only difference being what the labor rate is per hour. Parts can be all over the place. You aren't getting parts at cost at an independent shop either. They inflate the prices on those too.

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by Dean2

You guys can dance and pedal all you like but Cement Bench said from the time the mechanic went out to get the car till CB had the Bill in hand was 30 minutes. He brought the car to them, they did not come to him, 2 hours labour on a 30 minute job is BS. Flat rate has now become the "Thing" and in most cases the flat rate is now easily double the time it actually takes, and if it takes longer than flat rate they add extra hours under some other heading like diagnosis to cover it. This kind of behaviour explains why so many people have gone looking for independent operators we can trust. Thank goodness for guys like RandyBoBandy, and a couple of other great ones I deal with in Edmonton..

Or they could have sent the other mechanic out and it could have taken him 4 hours disassembling the steering column, ripping half the dash apart changing parts in a process of elimination while changing and billing for not needed parts only to find out it was a fuse. Just about every business model has minimum charges, or price fixed schedule. Your paying for expertise and the infrastructure they work out of, the office staff, equipment, and so on. When I go to the lawyer they bill me for a will, or a land transfer, whatever, they bill me lets say $800, , the legal secretary gets a standard form spends 20 minutes filling out names and numbers, registers it and has the lawyer sign off. Why didn't they just bill me $40 dollars for 20 minutes of secretarial work instead of $800?

The flat rate book is based on the average time it takes technicians to complete a task. It is an industry standard to be fair to customers and to the tech working on your vehicle. Some techs are much faster than others some much slower. In a world very short on good technicians unless they make some money they arent going to hang around and nobody in their right mind is going to sink millions into infastructure of a service department in a dealership or anywhere else and charge only for the time the technician actually works on the vehicle. They would be bankrupt in a week. For each technician in a shop they are approximately 2 supporting employees that also have to be paid from custodians , to office staff, accounting, reception, service writing, managerial, all wages that have to be paid. It's no different for a tire shop with fixed itemized charges for certain services when the super tech can change a set of tires in 15 minutes and the slow learning one takes an hour and a half. Or construction contractor, roofer, that charges by the square foot or the computer store fixed charge to put a new screen on your phone that takes one guy 2 hours and the next guy 10 minutes while the price stays the same . My barber charges $25 and does 4-6 cuts an hour, half of them cash that goes straight in his pocket. Should we time him when he cuts our hair and pay him by the minute rather than a barber shop standard fixed charge?

If people want to be mad how much it costs to fix a vehicle then be mad at the manufacturers that make them pretty much unserviceable without huge amounts of technology, tooling and training required to fix the clusterfrick of over engineered, designed to be unserviceable plus the special feature of built in obsolescence. $3000 headlight that comes without the ballast that they want another $600 for if it is cooked, you have to spend 4 hours removing the bumper and grill to change it. Manufacturers could make a vehicle that sells for 10 grand new, lasts 50 years without ever breaking down if they wanted but that would put them outa business pretty quick.

[silvertip]

If you have issues with a dealership or a repair facility
click on the link below.....

Alberta Motor Vehicle Industry Council

https://www.amvic.org/

they will help or put you in the right direction

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by silvertip

If you have issues with a dealership or a repair facility
click on the link below.....

Alberta Motor Vehicle Industry Council

https://www.amvic.org/

they will help or put you in the right direction

AMVIC kinda like APOS, the do nothing but collect dues and stick their head in the sand organization.

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by hogie

Book times are used by every shop. Independent or a dealer. Both can decide how the charge for diag. There are good and bad dealers and Independent shops out there. I have seen some bad examples of estimates from both over the years.

If I remember correctly flat rate times were put in place by Henry Ford. He made his dealers use it so pricing was consistent from dealer to dealer for repairs. I have some old auto publications from the fifties that had flat rate times for repairs. Flat rate has been around for decades.

Manufacturers make the times that are the warranty time. Chilton and other companies use the manufacturer times and bump them up to account for independent shops not necessarily having all the factory training or equipment. Also due to age. These are retail times.

As a customer you come to whatever shop you want for a concern. It gets diagnosed as to what's needed then you should be presented with an estimate to repair. You can agree to estimate or take elsewhere. I believe Alberta has some laws in place for this that have to be followed or a shop can be investigated.

An estimate for a repair should be relatively the same from shop to shop for labor. The only difference being what the labor rate is per hour. Parts can be all over the place. You aren't getting parts at cost at an independent shop either. They inflate the prices on those too.

This right here!

[trigger14]

From a 20 year ford tech, this is my favourite quote. “ If i do a job in 30 minutes, its because i spent 20 years learning how to do that in 30 minutes, You owe me for the years, not the minutes.”

Just as mentioned above, i have seen 10 minute jobs turn into a 4 hour job from lack of experience and knowledge. Be thankful you had an experienced technician working on your truck and it was repaired in a professional and in a very timely manor.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[204ruger]

The flat rate conversation has come up quite often here and it’s usually the same people voicing their distaste for it.

It’s no different than getting a price to replace siding on your house, the job should take them 3 days they figure so your labour quote is 1500$ But they get it done in two and u still pay the 1500$ And are happy they are out of your life sooner than you thought. You’ll tell everyone about the siding company you had do the job and how quick and professional they were. Same thing for the mechanic that charges 300$ for a 3hr job that took 2 hours but he’s a arse hole for doing it.

The difference is the siding job is quoted in one lump sum and the auto repair is in hours so you see that and if you know it only took 2 your unhappy.

[tbiddy]

Took it to the shop and they diagnosed the motor is shot. Just waiting to get the quote.

[tri777]

Originally Posted by tbiddy

Took it to the shop and they diagnosed the motor is shot. Just waiting to get the quote.

Washer pump replacement..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ivvpez104t4

[tbiddy]

Originally Posted by tri777

Washer pump replacement..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ivvpez104t4

It’s not the pump. The wipers don’t work.

[tri777]

Originally Posted by tbiddy

It’s not the pump. The wipers don’t work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-r6MzhgwPxY

[RandyBoBandy]

Originally Posted by tbiddy

It’s not the pump. The wipers don’t work.

X2

[Dean2]

Originally Posted by tbiddy

It’s not the pump. The wipers don’t work.

Actually, according to what the OP posted originally, both weren't working and they both quit at the same time.

[tbiddy]

Originally Posted by Dean2

Actually, according to what the OP posted originally, both weren't working and they both quit at the same time.

I don’t know if they work in conjunction with each other but when I press the button I don’t get any washer fluid AND the wipers don’t work. They told me there is power going to the motor but the motor is dead. I guess we’ll see if replacing the motor works.