How to make a gun more accurate?

JustinC · #1 01-12-2010, 06:30 PM

I am going to rebarrel my rem 700 vssf. I would like to know how to make the best shooter you can.All help would be great..Thanks

Bushrat · #2 01-12-2010, 07:03 PM

Before you rebarrel, what kind of accuracy are you getting from it now? What accuracy would you like to get from it? What are you using for ammo, how many different loads have you tried, when you shoot how many shots/groups do you shoot, what optics. What kind of set up are you using to shoot it from, concrete bench, front and rear rest etc?. How heavy is your trigger, has any work like bedding etc been done to your rifle yet?.

JustinC · #3 01-12-2010, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bushrat

Before you rebarrel, what kind of accuracy are you getting from it now? What accuracy would you like to get from it? What are you using for ammo, how many different loads have you tried, when you shoot how many shots/groups do you shoot, what optics. What kind of set up are you using to shoot it from, concrete bench, front and rear rest etc?. How heavy is your trigger, has any work like bedding etc been done to your rifle yet?.

I have tried lots of loads in it the best is just over an inch. I have a timmeny trigger set at 1.5 pounds. The problem is the bullet has to jump in to the lands. I have tried differnt oal's and it gets better but not what I am looking for.

Jerry D · #4 01-12-2010, 07:11 PM

It's already got a HS stock and is bedded.

That leaves a match barrel, aftermarket or worked over trigger and truing of the action.

Good optics might help as well depending on what your using.

JustinC · #5 01-12-2010, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D

It's already got a HS stock and is bedded.

That leaves a match barrel, aftermarket or worked over trigger and truing of the action.

Good optics might help as well depending on what your using.

I have an aftermarket trigger that brakes like glass. My scope is brand new and I have done tests with it on a shooter to make sure it was not that.

Jerry D · #6 01-12-2010, 07:36 PM

Then new barrel? Have you trued the action? That's all that's left?

BallCoeff.435 · #7 01-12-2010, 07:59 PM

Is the bore nice and clean? And is it clean right where the end of your bore-protector sits in the chamber?

What condition is the crown in?

Screws nice and tight? On the scope too?

How many shots are you firing before the individual impacts starts moving? (I'm not familiar with the barrel type/weight of the vssf).

Did you work up loads with the OAL always at the same recommended max starting length, ogive right near the lands? Can you put together a chart of muzzle velocity vs group tightness that has group tightness increasing up to a peak somewhere at a particular velocity and then decreasing, or does everything just look completely random? How does that peak tightness compare to a group with factory ammo? Are range conditions really constant for each set of test loads you're firing? (It will take a lot of shots over a range of powder weights to see how groups are affected. The barrel will get much hotter for some than others and dirtier too unless you cool and scrub regularly. Over the course of a day or week or month to complete the strings, the weather will probably change too.)

Can you get to the max OAL at all, or is your magazine length just too short?

What kind of bullets and sighting distance are you using?

How many rounds have been through that barrel in total?

==

IMHO a great barrel and truing will help; not sure now much $$ you had in mind to spend on it.

JustinC · #8 01-12-2010, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BallCoeff.435

Is the bore nice and clean? And is it clean right where the end of your bore-protector sits in the chamber?

What condition is the crown in?

Screws nice and tight? On the scope too?

How many shots are you firing before the individual impacts starts moving? (I'm not familiar with the barrel type/weight of the vssf).

Did you work up loads with the OAL always at the same recommended max starting length, ogive right near the lands? Can you put together a chart of muzzle velocity vs group tightness that has group tightness increasing up to a peak somewhere at a particular velocity and then decreasing, or does everything just look completely random? How does that peak tightness compare to a group with factory ammo? Are range conditions really constant for each set of test loads you're firing? (It will take a lot of shots over a range of powder weights to see how groups are affected. The barrel will get much hotter for some than others and dirtier too unless you cool and scrub regularly. Over the course of a day or week or month to complete the strings, the weather will probably change too.)

Can you get to the max OAL at all, or is your magazine length just too short?

What kind of bullets and sighting distance are you using?

How many rounds have been through that barrel in total?

==

IMHO a great barrel and truing will help; not sure now much $$ you had in mind to spend on it.

The problem with the barrel is when they chambered the barrel in the factory they cut the jump to the lands to big so it does not matter how much you make your bullet longer it will be out of the case befor it will touch the lands. This is a heavybarrel that is fluted.

I want to blue print my action, glass bed(it has a bedding block already) rebarrel it. I herd there was a bunch more stuff to make it really shot but I dont know. I am wondering what all of this costs as well. The Barrell I am looking at is a gaillard 28" barrel.

260 Rem · #9 01-12-2010, 09:37 PM

What caliber are you shooting...what is the twist...to what caliber do you plan to re-barrel? I would suggest you skim bed the action. Once that is done, make sure your gaurd screws are torqued evenly. Try your best loads again. Some bullets shoot best with some "jump" so you may have to experiment with that a bit. Most of the Rem heavy barrels like yours will shoot under 1MOA with some coaxing. Try to set the bearing surface on the bullet shank so it contacts at least 2/3 of the neck. I also wonder if you have shot the brass repeated times and may have developed a "donut" at the neck/shoulder junction.
If you decide to rebarrel, you should have the action trued.

JustinC · #10 01-12-2010, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

What caliber are you shooting...what is the twist...to what caliber do you plan to re-barrel? I would suggest you skim bed the action. Once that is done, make sure your gaurd screws are torqued evenly. Try your best loads again. Some bullets shoot best with some "jump" so you may have to experiment with that a bit. Most of the Rem heavy barrels like yours will shoot under 1MOA with some coaxing. Try to set the bearing surface on the bullet shank so it contacts at least 2/3 of the neck. I also wonder if you have shot the brass repeated times and may have developed a "donut" at the neck/shoulder junction.
If you decide to rebarrel, you should have the action trued.

The cases are on there second fireing it is a 200swift with a 1 in14 twist. I have played with OAL to what you are saying. I will try to get it bedded better and re torque the bolts. This gun is almost brand new with maybe 120 shell through it and no I let it cool down so it is not getting over heated.

Bushrat · #11 01-13-2010, 07:42 AM

What bullets have you been shooting in it?

JustinC · #12 01-13-2010, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bushrat

What bullets have you been shooting in it?

I have tried 50gr V-max,50gr ballistic tips, 55gr Ballistic tips,55gr blitzkings,55gr berger varmits.

Bushrat · #13 01-13-2010, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustinC

I have tried 50gr V-max,50gr ballistic tips, 55gr Ballistic tips,55gr blitzkings,55gr berger varmits.

If you can't get some of them to shoot good then something is wrong. Most factory remington barrels are long throated but they still seem to shoot well. As others have said I'd tinker with the bedding and the action screw tension see if it makes a difference. Make sure the crown is good and you have a good solid rest when shooting. If none of that works then maybe a new barrel is in order.

JustinC · #14 01-13-2010, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bushrat

If you can't get some of them to shoot good then something is wrong. Most factory remington barrels are long throated but they still seem to shoot well. As others have said I'd tinker with the bedding and the action screw tension see if it makes a difference. Make sure the crown is good and you have a good solid rest when shooting. If none of that works then maybe a new barrel is in order.

Thanks for the help I am going to go load up some dierent loads and test them this weekend I will let you know how it goes.

JustinC · #15 01-14-2010, 06:01 PM

I was out tonight and shot a couple shells and my bud asked me to take off the simms vibration dampaner. My groups went from over 2" to 0.563"at 100yards. Let me tell you how mad I was about it being that thing.So now I can play with what I have got to get a even tighter group.

getatmewolf · #16 01-14-2010, 06:29 PM

Wow good to know. Thats a big difference. Anybody else have similar results with the vibe dampener?

JustinC · #17 01-14-2010, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by getatmewolf

Wow good to know. Thats a big difference. Anybody else have similar results with the vibe dampener?

my other hunting partner did. that is why we took it off.

Pathfinder76 · #18 01-14-2010, 06:52 PM

My question is. Why would anyone consider putting one of those dumb things on a barrel in the first place?

JustinC · #19 01-14-2010, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck

My question is. Why would anyone consider putting one of those dumb things on a barrel in the first place?

To tighten your groups like they say they do..... Why do you handload???? Same thing.

longshot270 · #20 01-14-2010, 07:20 PM

I am not sure how you put it on or if it had instructions, but with those I thought you had to tinker with it as well once you put it on. Such as put it in one spot do some shooting and then move it and shoot some more until you find the sweet spot. But that might be what you did I don't know. I knew a guy who had one who said it worked great.

catnthehat · #21 01-14-2010, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustinC

I was out tonight and shot a couple shells and my bud asked me to take off the simms vibration dampaner. My groups went from over 2" to 0.563"at 100yards. Let me tell you how mad I was about it being that thing.So now I can play with what I have got to get a even tighter group.

You had a dampener on it??!!

Those things are the work ofr the devil hisself, something somebody dreamed up to sell to someone who thought they needed it!

Good that you heaved it......
Cat

Artist · #22 01-14-2010, 07:38 PM

I have a Limbsaver Barrel De-resonator on my .257WBY. It was just one of the many components that went into accurizing the rifle. To be honest, I have no clue if it does anything. What I do know however is that the rifle shoots sub-moa as far as I've been able to test it (800 yds) so the de-resonator certainly isn't hurting anything. If you research them a bit, apparently a key factor is where specifically the de-resonator is placed on the barrel - but again - can't say for sure

I would tend to be a bit leary of them on a thin "whippy" barrel. One thing it is good for is protecting your barrel when you lean it up against something!

JustinC · #23 01-14-2010, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Artist

I have a Limbsaver Barrel De-resonator on my .257WBY. It was just one of the many components that went into accurizing the rifle. To be honest, I have no clue if it does anything. What I do know however is that the rifle shoots sub-moa as far as I've been able to test it (800 yds) so the de-resonator certainly isn't hurting anything. If you research them a bit, apparently a key factor is where specifically the de-resonator is placed on the barrel - but again - can't say for sure

I would tend to be a bit leary of them on a thin "whippy" barrel. One thing it is good for is protecting your barrel when you lean it up against something!

That looks like a nice custom gun.

Artist · #24 01-14-2010, 09:00 PM

Actually - not a "custom" rifle - just a rebarelled Savage with a few bells and whistles!

Pathfinder76 · #25 01-14-2010, 09:08 PM

That "de-resonator" could pass for the bell and the whistle.

Pathfinder76 · #26 01-14-2010, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustinC

To tighten your groups like they say they do..... Why do you handload???? Same thing.

Funny stuff that is.

JustinC · #27 01-14-2010, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuck

Funny stuff that is.

come on I just rassin you back.

Rackmastr · #28 01-14-2010, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by catnthehat

You had a dampener on it??!!

Those things are the work ofr the devil hisself, something somebody dreamed up to sell to someone who thought they needed it!

Good that you heaved it......
Cat

x2....

Artist · #29 01-14-2010, 09:14 PM

Yea - I'm thinking of buying a couple of more of those de-resonators - one for each leg of the Harris Bi-pod to help dampen the harmonics of the bipod legs.

And then, maybe one for the scope too!

In all honesty, some of that stuff is simply "try-and-see". What works for one may not work for the next.

JustinC · #30 01-14-2010, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Artist

Yea - I'm thinking of buying a couple of more of those de-resonators - one for each leg of the Harris Bi-pod to help dampen the harmonics of the bipod legs.

And then, maybe one for the scope too!

In all honesty, some of that stuff is simply "try-and-see". What works for one may not work for the next.

Ive got one you want it? It is for a real barrel not one of those "wimppy" ones.