Value of annealing

[Dmay]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

Changes the color of the brass but downs actually Anneal it

Originally Posted by Pathfinder76

Not only that, but softens it in the wrong places.

I have no expertise in this area, and certainly don't mean any disrespect.
But have to wonder....
Since this study is done by AMP, why do they not also come down on flame-annealing, which is so common, or lead-bath, which is an old method?
Have they just concentrated on nailing one competitor?
Being a conspiracy theorist, I just have to speculate.


And the color-change thing Mark....this is not accurate. I have extensively experimented with it. And the salt does not change the color...temp does. Run it at the lowest temperature that the salt melts and there is no color change. The change comes as heat is increased.

Regarding the AMP:
So one path of logic is that:
All we are doing is imparting heat into a metal. Has been done for a long time using propane flame, molten lead or salt.....and numerous other things I'm sure.
Induction heat is perhaps more accurate and precise and measurable, and I have no doubt it is a beneficial procedure to brass treatment. Plus they (at least I believe so......can we tell for sure?) customize it to the individual case you are using......to me it is a step worth taking to try and prep my brass to the every best I can....

And sorry, I guess the thread was about "Is it worth it?" That's very subjective and my view is likely much different then yours.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by Dmay

I have no expertise in this area, and certainly don't mean any disrespect.
But have to wonder....
Since this study is done by AMP, why do they not also come down on flame-annealing, which is so common, or lead-bath, which is an old method?
Have they just concentrated on nailing one competitor?
Being a conspiracy theorist, I just have to speculate.


And the color-change thing Mark....this is not accurate. I have extensively experimented with it. And the salt does not change the color...temp does. Run it at the lowest temperature that the salt melts and there is no color change. The change comes as heat is increased.

Regarding the AMP:
So one path of logic is that:
All we are doing is imparting heat into a metal. Has been done for a long time using propane flame, molten lead or salt.....and numerous other things I'm sure.
Induction heat is perhaps more accurate and precise and measurable, and I have no doubt it is a beneficial procedure to brass treatment. Plus they (at least I believe so......can we tell for sure?) customize it to the individual case you are using......to me it is a step worth taking to try and prep my brass to the every best I can....

And sorry, I guess the thread was about "Is it worth it?" That's very subjective and my view is likely much different then yours.

I agree
I would be leary of a study done by the competitor
But the testing detail is very good
Amp did more testing on the salt bath annealing than I have ever seen from the salt bath annealing company.
I tried to buy the salt bath set up, they are based out of Edmonton, but they were always sold out
Eventually I just bit the bullet and bought an amp

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by Dmay

I have no expertise in this area, and certainly don't mean any disrespect.
But have to wonder....
Since this study is done by AMP, why do they not also come down on flame-annealing, which is so common, or lead-bath, which is an old method?
Have they just concentrated on nailing one competitor?
Being a conspiracy theorist, I just have to speculate.


And the color-change thing Mark....this is not accurate. I have extensively experimented with it. And the salt does not change the color...temp does. Run it at the lowest temperature that the salt melts and there is no color change. The change comes as heat is increased.

Regarding the AMP:
So one path of logic is that:
All we are doing is imparting heat into a metal. Has been done for a long time using propane flame, molten lead or salt.....and numerous other things I'm sure.
Induction heat is perhaps more accurate and precise and measurable, and I have no doubt it is a beneficial procedure to brass treatment. Plus they (at least I believe so......can we tell for sure?) customize it to the individual case you are using......to me it is a step worth taking to try and prep my brass to the every best I can....

And sorry, I guess the thread was about "Is it worth it?" That's very subjective and my view is likely much different then yours.

AMP says fill your boots if you want to prove them wrong.

[SuperCub]

Originally Posted by 3blade

If I’m junking the brass after 3-5 firings to avoid case head separation, would annealing really make any difference?

FL size - because I’m already getting good groups and want the reload cycle speed and option to use in different guns. Brass is going to experience stress at the belt - where annealing won’t touch it. So limited brass life is a fact of life, no?

Asking not implying. I don’t know for certain

Anneal your brass every firing and use a Lee collet die. Your brass will last much longer.

[DLab]

Originally Posted by SuperCub

Anneal your brass every firing and use a Lee collet die. Your brass will last much longer.

See your other post suggesting this.

[TrapperApprenteye]

Heating the brass or any metal for the most part to a specified temperature at a specified rate, helps increase/restore the ductility (elasticity) and malleability of a metal. Think of it as rejuvenating the crystalline structure of said metal. Simple metallurgy.. causing it to be less brittle. Intense heat would being the best or most efficient way to do it. For me anyway.

I know nothing of a salt bath, yet it seems it simply would not have the desired effects that a flame does. I’m going to research it, but i think i already know the answer to that.

Stay safe whichever route you take

[TrapperApprenteye]

Has anyone attempted to anneal the head or entire case? Experimented with the structural integrate post full case annealing?

I’m new to actually annealing brass cases. As a Jman Welder & Inspector both visual and destructive/non destructive.. im rather familiar with metallurgy, yet I’m always learning.
I’ve seen videos where the annealer then quenches the case in a can of water. Blows my mind tbh the act of doing so. And I’ll probably never do it no matter what anybody attempts to tell me. Just don’t do it. Let it cool air cool.

Still learning ..

[marky_mark]

Doing the case head would make it too soft
As for quenching, everything I’ve ready said that it makes no difference for brass

[32-40win]

I can see where an AMP would be of value in doing mass amounts of cases you want accurately done perhaps, for competition use, along with their press, the press would be fun to play with. Then again, I could blow 10K in a hurry and not get all of what would be nice to have or try out these days, the stuff that is available now for reloading is a bit mindboggling.

Before I retired, I bought an Annealeez V2, only just finally getting to actually using it, so, we'll see what it does for me, or not. Doesn't hurt to try it out, not too terribly priced, but the ROI is a long one even at that..
Bit surprised that someone hasn't found a way to cheapen the induction units yet, and still give the functionality of the AMP, sure someone will figure it out one of these days, see a few wannabees out there, that ain't, so far.

[DLab]

I'm going to give this a try for an induction unit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLRgDZeYQ-M

2nd. vid with tips and tricks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkqN4iA0NjM

Price is right.

[32-40win]

That setup seems pretty decent, doesn't look to be beyond an electrical putz's skillset either. There is always someone out there that can figure it out, and it seems like he has. He went into the cooling of the unit, which was something I'd seen as being an issue on them, looks like he probably solved it.

[bingo1010]

Originally Posted by TrapperApprenteye

Has anyone attempted to anneal the head or entire case? Experimented with the structural integrate post full case annealing?

I’m new to actually annealing brass cases. As a Jman Welder & Inspector both visual and destructive/non destructive.. im rather familiar with metallurgy, yet I’m always learning.
I’ve seen videos where the annealer then quenches the case in a can of water. Blows my mind tbh the act of doing so. And I’ll probably never do it no matter what anybody attempts to tell me. Just don’t do it. Let it cool air cool.

Still learning ..

never anneal anywhere near the head/entire case...... you will have a catastrophic failure if fired.... just past the shoulder of the case is the area that needs to be annealed

[Faststeel]

Like many of the shooting and loading options that are available in the market place, people buy what they can afford. I got an AMP annealer because I could afford to buy one. same with a labradar.....

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by TrapperApprenteye

I’ve seen videos where the annealer then quenches the case in a can of water. Blows my mind tbh the act of doing so. And I’ll probably never do it no matter what anybody attempts to tell me. Just don’t do it. Let it cool air cool.

Still learning ..

Quenching an annealed brass case in water does nothing to the metallic structure of the case because it is brass, not a ferrous metal.
The only thing it does is it cools the brass quickly, it does not change the integrity of it.
However I do not like getting water in my cases at all , so I simply lay them on a soft cloth after annealing them.
Cat

[waynewjw]

https://gongjoe.com/products/v3-mach...ealing-machine

I use this. Easy setup and great results. Bought last fall $305. A few long range shooters, F1 Class guys in my club and they all anneal to get longer brass life and consistent results. I’m just a rookie starting to annealing but so far I like the Gong Joe. I annealed 100 brass in maybe an hour….didn’t time it.