Stratmore and Chestamere police go MAD

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Ranets

Thank you for bringing some common sense to a good thread that has seemingly turned into a LEO bashing parade. Sure there are members on the force that should not be there, but really how many people work anywhere that doesn't have people that shouldn't be there or know how to do their job properly. And for those who believe the police approached the scene too aggressively, just how do you think someone is going to react to a call of shots being fired at someone. It is a lot easier being an armchair quarterback and say how it should of happened and who done what wrong after hearing only one side of a multiple sided story. For all of those who think that LEO's make too much, feel free to join any law enforcement agency or the military and rake in some of that easy cash for sitting on your a@# and eating doughnuts.

First off, I’m not a cop basher, I’m a bad cop basher. Yes this is a bad cop bashing thread, if you’re offended by people taking cops to task for improper actions you should have read the title and moved on.

Being a good cop is something you are born with, it takes a special person to be a good cop. The fact that cops have a recruiting program tells me that not all cops are cut out to be cops, but rather coherst into being a cop.

Go back and read up on the thread where the cop run over the deer. I was supporting the cops in that thread, I’m not a cop basher. This one though, I don’t think the cops are the good guys in this situation.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by 204ruger

So what your saying is you were there to know exactly what happened and his story and the police story and the hunters story all match up to what took place that day.

What’s the matter? You said there was “a lot of discrepancies in the home owners story”, can’t remember any of them now???

You made the statement, are you just making stuff up? I’m saying you are.

I guess you could say I’m calling you out.

[204ruger]

Originally Posted by 204ruger

So what your saying is you were there to know exactly what happened and his story and the police story and the hunters story all match up to what took place that day.

It is never mentioned what happened on the property when the cops first showed up and before the home owner came outside. Was there a gunshot that the cops heard when they were at the neighbors or did they just come flying in guns drawn ready for takedown? Somehow I kinda doubt it but hey here we are having the conversation about cops that have a power trip and poor David and his family let’s make a gofund me for them.

[204ruger]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

What’s the matter? You said there was “a lot of discrepancies in the home owners story”, can’t remember any of them now???

You made the statement, are you just making stuff up? I’m saying you are.

I guess you could say I’m calling you out.

Hm saying there is no reason for the cops to be handling themselves the way they did but not giving anything to back up why they shouldn’t be, from the time he was unloading groceries to bathing with his kids to cops pointing assault rifles at his head it had to get there somehow and not just a cop on a power trip. Why don’t we know what the hunters were doing at that time. He told his wife to video it we never see any footage from her.
Call me out that’s fine it’s just my opinion of the story everyone else is aloud to have one but I’m not.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by 204ruger

Hm saying there is no reason for the cops to be handling themselves the way they did but not giving anything to back up why they shouldn’t be, from the time he was unloading groceries to bathing with his kids to cops pointing assault rifles at his head it had to get there somehow and not just a cop on a power trip. Why don’t we know what the hunters were doing at that time. He told his wife to video it we never see any footage from her.
Call me out that’s fine it’s just my opinion of the story everyone else is aloud to have one but I’m not.

Did you mean you are having a hard time believing his story and how the events lead up to the finale? I can understand that, but you said there was discrepancies in his story, which I haven’t heard any discrepancies. There is a difference between not understanding why he did what he did and a discrepancy in his story, so I was interested in where his story varied.

I by no means am saying you don’t deserve your opinion, it’s just as valid as anyone else, I was just curious as to what you meant, I don’t think you necessarily meant a discrepancy in his story but rather take issue with his recollection of events.

[vcmm]

Originally Posted by ctd

First off, the Police had a shots fired call in this guys situation. Their response was in response to that. Then the guy hung the phone up on them. hmmm

In my first situation I almost got mauled by the police dog along with one step away from being shot. All for matching the height of the person. Not even the same clothes. I understood where he was coming from. It was dark and they were looking for douche bag. (I actually thought I was being mugged thank me lucky charms I didnt run)
I have never been easy with a person pointing a firearm at me. Especially a Police Officer (I know their their level of training and not very impressed).
But when one does this I comply with their directions. Why because I have done nothing wrong. Being resistive to a armed person usually does not end well. Add the stress of a shots fired call an this is the response.

As for the Officer pulling his gun on me because he was alone and close to retirement. He had been attacked 6 or so months earlier during a traffic stop and was almost killed during a simple not so simple traffic stop. So I think he is justified in his actions. As many on here state better to be Judged by 12 then carried by 6.


As for being handcuffed, nope I was not cuffed. ( almost shot and or eaten by the dog) but Nor did I try to run away, film, hang up my phone, roll up my window, yell swear or be biligerant in any way shape of form to the Officers.

being left face down in the dirt may have something to do with the Police having to deal with all the occupants of the house, searching the house along with securing the perimeter. That should only take mere minutes for a expert correct.
being at the station until 1am and not being given a ride home is unfortunate and his Lawyer can go after them for that.

I am willing to bet had his intial response not been to hang up the phone, had he of brought everyone in the house to greet the Police things may have been different. But they were not, things escalated from a high priority shots fired call to a un-coopertive suspect.

"As for the Officer pulling his gun on me because he was alone and close to retirement. He had been attacked 6 or so months earlier during a traffic stop and was almost killed during a simple not so simple traffic stop. So I think he is justified in his actions. As many on here state better to be Judged by 12 then carried by 6. "
SHOULD not be on the job if he's that nervous holding a firearm!!
Thats how people die.

[vcmm]

Originally Posted by kurt505

i wonder if you’d have the same attitude if they arrested your wife, arrested your brother, tore off your car door, let your kids run around naked outside while you’re cuffed face down in the dirt, hauled you to the station for a few hours with no shirt then said “oops, wrong guy” then said “good luck on finding your way home”???

I highly doubt it.

Remember, this guy did nothing illegal, he was in his house tending to his children when all this went down. The cops could have done the exact same thing they did to you, question him on the scene before turning it into a scene. It’s one thing to secure the area, they went beyond that. They were probably psssst at his attitude so they did the old “oh ya? Well i’ll show you what i can do! Kicking his fence down is clearly abuse, and an example of the attitude the cops had that night.

It’s acceptable for a civilian to lose hose cool, but it’s not acceptable for a cop to lose there cool. They are put in a protected position of power, they have rights the average citizens don’t have, they have training to handle volition situations. When they show that they can’t handle themselves in a professional manner then it’s time to answer phone calls at the police station instead of losing your cool on the public.

bingo!!!

[Ranets]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

First off, I’m not a cop basher, I’m a bad cop basher. Yes this is a bad cop bashing thread, if you’re offended by people taking cops to task for improper actions you should have read the title and moved on.

Being a good cop is something you are born with, it takes a special person to be a good cop. The fact that cops have a recruiting program tells me that not all cops are cut out to be cops, but rather coherst into being a cop.

Go back and read up on the thread where the cop run over the deer. I was supporting the cops in that thread, I’m not a cop basher. This one though, I don’t think the cops are the good guys in this situation.

As a matter of fact my son was the one who called the police in Lethbridge when the deer was absolutely improperly killed and yes the officer should have been reprimanded for his improper decision and actions. But this thread is about a shots fired call, not running over a deer. Do I personally think that all officers are cut out for the job, absolutely not. But like any other profession that is mandated by government criteria in their hiring practices certain bad apples make it through and last time I checked nobody is being coerced into a job they don't wish to be in. I am not saying that there may not have been some inappropriate actions by certain officers at the scene but then again the home owner could have reacted in a more controlled manner than hollering at a large group of armed officers who have only heard that shots were fired at a person at this point emotions and adrenaline are extremely high and right or wrong could have ended with disastrous results especially with children present. Also if it was just a case of a peeved off anti-gun neighbor, then they should be criminally charged and prosecuted. But unless any of us were actually there we can only make assumptions after "hearing" only one side of the story and not knowing or observing the situation for ourselves we can only guess as to what actually happened.

[vcmm]

Originally Posted by Ranets

As a matter of fact my son was the one who called the police in Lethbridge when the deer was absolutely improperly killed and yes the officer should have been reprimanded for his improper decision and actions. But this thread is about a shots fired call, not running over a deer. Do I personally think that all officers are cut out for the job, absolutely not. But like any other profession that is mandated by government criteria in their hiring practices certain bad apples make it through and last time I checked nobody is being coerced into a job they don't wish to be in. I am not saying that there may not have been some inappropriate actions by certain officers at the scene but then again the home owner could have reacted in a more controlled manner than hollering at a large group of armed officers who have only heard that shots were fired at a person at this point emotions and adrenaline are extremely high and right or wrong could have ended with disastrous results especially with children present. Also if it was just a case of a peeved off anti-gun neighbor, then they should be criminally charged and prosecuted. But unless any of us were actually there we can only make assumptions after "hearing" only one side of the story and not knowing or observing the situation for ourselves we can only guess as to what actually happened.

The home owner is a civilian. Leo's are supposed to be trained???
I was just following orders!

[Ranets]

Originally Posted by vcmm

The home owner is a civilian. Leo's are supposed to be trained???

And parents are supposed to put the safety and well being of their children first and foremost not worry about taking a video in a volatile situation. And the last time I checked LEO's are still human and therefore fall prey to human emotions. And as for the training anyone can feel free to step up and take the training and then when you are put in a possible life or death situation you can go give all "suspects" a big hug. News flash LEO's make mistakes but I guess if you have never made a bad decision in your life then it entitles you to make a decision based solely on a one sided story. If the officers were in the wrong then the home owner can get a lawyer and be compensated that would beat putting your family through unnecessary stress and fear as a husband and father you should be able to swallow some of your pride and attempt to deal with a volatile situation with a degree of maturity and not go off half cocked like a teenager.

[trophybook]

What would a fair settlement amount be for the situation?

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by trophybook

What would a fair settlement amount be for the situation?

Home owner said he wanted an apology for his wife and kids. Probably that and replace the gate?

[NinjaHunter]

Originally Posted by Ranets

And parents are supposed to put the safety and well being of their children first and foremost not worry about taking a video in a volatile situation. And the last time I checked LEO's are still human and therefore fall prey to human emotions. And as for the training anyone can feel free to step up and take the training and then when you are put in a possible life or death situation you can go give all "suspects" a big hug. News flash LEO's make mistakes but I guess if you have never made a bad decision in your life then it entitles you to make a decision based solely on a one sided story. If the officers were in the wrong then the home owner can get a lawyer and be compensated that would beat putting your family through unnecessary stress and fear as a husband and father you should be able to swallow some of your pride and attempt to deal with a volatile situation with a degree of maturity and not go off half cocked like a teenager.

And those "mistakes" that LEO makes are very deadly. Usually ending in innocent civilians dying.

And what happens when LEO mistakenly kill civilians? Nothing. They get fired and then re-hired elsewhere. Sweep under the rug.

So, no. "being mature" doesn't help when a real possible ending is someone lying on their own blood because of a "mistake" of a LEO.

Accepting a "sorry" isn't going to cut it. And no amount of money compensated will bring a person back to life.

[RandyBoBandy]

[vcmm]

Originally Posted by Ranets

And parents are supposed to put the safety and well being of their children first and foremost not worry about taking a video in a volatile situation. And the last time I checked LEO's are still human and therefore fall prey to human emotions. And as for the training anyone can feel free to step up and take the training and then when you are put in a possible life or death situation you can go give all "suspects" a big hug. News flash LEO's make mistakes but I guess if you have never made a bad decision in your life then it entitles you to make a decision based solely on a one sided story. If the officers were in the wrong then the home owner can get a lawyer and be compensated that would beat putting your family through unnecessary stress and fear as a husband and father you should be able to swallow some of your pride and attempt to deal with a volatile situation with a degree of maturity and not go off half cocked like a teenager.

When they make mistakes people are hurt or die. Blue shield or yellow legs.
What about the children???????????

[brendan's dad]

Lots of good theories floating around this thread, at least a dozen of you should be applying for ASIRT

[vcmm]

Their here??

[Ranets]

Originally Posted by NinjaHunter

And those "mistakes" that LEO makes are very deadly. Usually ending in innocent civilians dying.

And what happens when LEO mistakenly kill civilians? Nothing. They get fired and then re-hired elsewhere. Sweep under the rug.

So, no. "being mature" doesn't help when a real possible ending is someone lying on their own blood because of a "mistake" of a LEO.

Accepting a "sorry" isn't going to cut it. And no amount of money compensated will bring a person back to life.

So not being mature and letting your temper get the best of you would work better in that situation?? Because that is always the best way to defuse a volatile situation. And please let us know how many "innocent" civilians have been killed by LEO's in this country, and then enlighten me with statistics showing that the officer was fired and rehired and not fired charged and incarcerated. The only part of your statement I do agree with is that no amount of money or compensation will bring a person back to life, so that is why someone should be able to control their emotions and actions enough not to escalate a situation, especially when your own children are present. Allowing yourself to loose control in a situation like that, right or wrong, is completely self centered and selfish just because your feelings got hurt. Don't get me wrong, if any or all the officers were out of line they should absolutely held accountable for their actions also. But let's try to at least have more than one persons word so we can see both sides of the story
before trying and convicting anyone on either side of the story. I don't know about you, but I do know that I am willing to eat a little crow and get my feelings hurt if the safety and well being of my wife and children is at stake.
Could our courts and legal system use some improving, absolutely yes and I think if you were to ask any LEO that question they would agree, but for now this is the only system we have so unless someone has an actual feasible idea on how to improve it. Putting self videos out on social media trying to sensationalize your situation does no one any good on either side if the situation, all it does accomplish is make it more difficult for anyone to remain unbiased and figure out the truth of what actually took place which in most cases is somewhere in between all sides of the story not just one or the other.

[vcmm]

Originally Posted by Ranets

So not being mature and letting your temper get the best of you would work better in that situation?? Because that is always the best way to defuse a volatile situation. And please let us know how many "innocent" civilians have been killed by LEO's in this country, and then enlighten me with statistics showing that the officer was fired and rehired and not fired charged and incarcerated. The only part of your statement I do agree with is that no amount of money or compensation will bring a person back to life, so that is why someone should be able to control their emotions and actions enough not to escalate a situation, especially when your own children are present. Allowing yourself to loose control in a situation like that, right or wrong, is completely self centered and selfish just because your feelings got hurt. Don't get me wrong, if any or all the officers were out of line they should absolutely held accountable for their actions also. But let's try to at least have more than one persons word so we can see both sides of the story
before trying and convicting anyone on either side of the story. I don't know about you, but I do know that I am willing to eat a little crow and get my feelings hurt if the safety and well being of my wife and children is at stake.
Could our courts and legal system use some improving, absolutely yes and I think if you were to ask any LEO that question they would agree, but for now this is the only system we have so unless someone has an actual feasible idea on how to improve it. Putting self videos out on social media trying to sensationalize your situation does no one any good on either side if the situation, all it does accomplish is make it more difficult for anyone to remain unbiased and figure out the truth of what actually took place which in most cases is somewhere in between all sides of the story not just one or the other.

Your really sounding starting to sound like a SJW. Never answering a question by belittling others with your comments. More question's without answering any other question

[Oldan Grumpi]

Originally Posted by trophybook

What would a fair settlement amount be for the situation?

A formal public apology and the resignation of the officer in command at the scene. At least that would send a message throughout the force that ‘goon squad’ tactics are unacceptable.

At the same time, we all know damn well that’ll never happen. If the home owner is reading this, the guy standing the farthest back was the officer in command, the guy hollering the loudest and being the most belligerent was the 2 IC trying to impress the OIC. The rest were probably just flunkies, being taught how to be a hard ass. Hopefully they weren’t issued live ammo.

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by Oldan Grumpi

A formal public apology and the resignation of the officer in command at the scene. At least that would send a message throughout the force that ‘goon squad’ tactics are unacceptable.

At the same time, we all know damn well that’ll never happen. If the home owner is reading this, the guy standing the farthest back was the officer in command, the guy hollering the loudest and being the most belligerent was the 2 IC trying to impress the OIC. The rest were probably just flunkies, being taught how to be a hard ass. Hopefully they weren’t issued live ammo.

Hahahahahaha!

Did you get your extensive police training and knowledge from watching the "Dukes of Hazard"?

[Oldan Grumpi]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

Hahahahahaha!

Did you get your extensive police training and knowledge from watching the "Dukes of Hazard"?

No.

[fishnguy]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

You did the same thing yourself and yet you condem his actions? Maybe he didn’t realize the severity of the situation on the first phone call?

I didn’t do the same thing. It was long time ago when I was younger and... call it stupid. It was a noise complaint and probably a fair one (a party). I talked to the two cops, who showed up quite a bit after the noise was over, for at least ten minutes before I said that they could proceed however they chose to and to have a good night and that I did not see a point to continuing the conversation and closed the door. To my surprise, they just left. Very different from what happened at David’s place. First, I just got married and we didn’t have kids involved in the situation. Second, it was a noise complaint.

As for the discrepancies, there were some in the guy’s story. Maybe, and it’s a maybe, you can attribute it to stress. I have seen people talking weird stuff in a stressful situation. Nonetheless, there were discrepancies. One of them was that in one video he says that he was giving the kids a bath when he heard extreme shouting and looked out the window (in the bathroom while giving the kids a bath? Could be) and saw lots of police at his neighbour’s house. Then, he was going to call the neighbour to make sure everything was ok (would he really, after what he said about the neighbour closer to the end of the video? Could be) and that is when he heard his phone ring and it was the police. In the other video, he said he was putting the groceries away with his wife when the phone rang and it was the police. Could be stress, I don’t know. Keep in mind that in the former video he also said that before giving his kids a bath, he finished unloading the groceries and did some chores in the yard, etc. It’s all from the two videos I saw, I didn’t make any of it up.

He also said that his brother had nothing to do with it (and that he helped him with the chores in the yard, before the bath for the kids), yet he refused to come out of the house for an extended period of time, at least half an hour of which was due to the kids being in the bath. That’s also from Dave’s story, I didn’t make it up.

I don’t know, maybe his story is true, maybe it ain’t. I have two kids, fyi, one will turn 2 in September and the other just turned 5 in May. I do have a little bit of perspective on how the bath time goes.

Moreover, you say if it was my wife and kids. I would not put my wife and kids in a situation like this. At least I would like to believe so. To begin with, there ain’t no way I would ask my wife to leave the kids in the tub (be it with my brother/sister or anyone else) so that she could film me going out and following other demands of the police. That just doesn’t make any sense. By the way, I also want to see the video that she filmed and all the name calling and whatnot.

And honestly, what would you personally do if you were in Dave’s shoes when the events were unfolding? I highly doubt we would even hear about the story.

[fishnguy]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

Lots of good theories floating around this thread, at least a dozen of you should be applying for ASIRT

Lol.

[fishnguy]

Originally Posted by Oldan Grumpi

A formal public apology and the resignation of the officer in command at the scene.

And you decided that based on the story the guy told in his video on Facebook? Lol.

[SnipeHunter]

Originally Posted by Rig-Rat

I know all the focus is on how this was handled and it's crazy for sure, but if the call was bogus and meant to get even with the guy from a previous event. I would hope the caller it's self is getting some heat or if anyone is pizzed at someone just call something in. Much been reported on that part of the story? Whole thing is crazy.

Reading between the lines, sounds like the neighbours felt they could claim bullets were falling somewhere on their property.

[SnipeHunter]

Originally Posted by Oldan Grumpi

A formal public apology and the resignation of the officer in command at the scene. At least that would send a message throughout the force that ‘goon squad’ tactics are unacceptable.

At the same time, we all know damn well that’ll never happen. If the home owner is reading this, the guy standing the farthest back was the officer in command, the guy hollering the loudest and being the most belligerent was the 2 IC trying to impress the OIC. The rest were probably just flunkies, being taught how to be a hard ass. Hopefully they weren’t issued live ammo.

You're just evoking Ruby Ridge, My Lai & a thousand other similar events. This situation may have been uniquely different where they were simply motivated by everyone's safety.

[Talking moose]

If it is determined to be true, that the woman phoned in falsely, I might drive down there and beat her up. No promises. See how busy work is.

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

First off, I’m not a cop basher, I’m a bad cop basher. Yes this is a bad cop bashing thread, if you’re offended by people taking cops to task for improper actions you should have read the title and moved on.

Being a good cop is something you are born with, it takes a special person to be a good cop. The fact that cops have a recruiting program tells me that not all cops are cut out to be cops, but rather coherst into being a cop.

Go back and read up on the thread where the cop run over the deer. I was supporting the cops in that thread, I’m not a cop basher. This one though, I don’t think the cops are the good guys in this situation.

Some days one has to wonder, is the RCMP an impartial police force or a monster that needs to be reigned in ??? A lot of really clumsy and unbelievable apology here. Amazing they can stand there spouting this with a straight face. this guy deserves all the compensation he can get and more.

https://globalnews.ca/news/5487490/w...eleased-today/

Grizz

[Oldan Grumpi]

Originally Posted by fishnguy

And you decided that based on the story the guy told in his video on Facebook? Lol.

Certainly not. I’m saying that on the proviso that the home owners story is true. In this case an allegation has been made and must be held as ‘true with caution’ until proven or disproven.

That’s the problem we have here - eight pages of posts from people who don’t have any idea of what actually happened, making assumptions and arguing their purely imagined positions.

But, I guess that’s the Internet for you. I’m done. This thread is too much like talking to recalcitrant teenagers.