Are hunting rifles over scoped?

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by W921

Just refresh my memory
So with a bigger objective bell on the scope you gain shooting light.
Higher magnification dont you loose shooting light unless your bell or objective lense is big enough?
Do you gain light with a bigger scope main tube?

Bigger objective lens = brighter
Higher magnification = dimmer
Bigger main tube = more elevation adjustment
Zeiss Victory glass = don’t matter what magnification you use, it’s better than a leupold.

[Jerry D]

A 50mm objective is only brighter then a 40mm or a 36 or a 32 at higher magnifications.

At low magnification the straight tubes will be the same brightness at the big bells.

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[260 Rem]

I would be interested hearing the rationale used by those showing preference for a fixed magnification over a variable that includes but is not limited to the same power.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

I would be interested hearing the rationale used by those showing preference for a fixed magnification over a variable that includes but is not limited to the same power.

So far from what I can tell the argument is if you have a variable scope you lose the ability to find an object while looking through said scope due to having your scope cranked to full magnification. I think you also lose the ability to set your scope to a low magnification???

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

I assume the factory set parallax on a F 6-36mm is 150 yds ...which would translate into a fair bit of potential for error at even 300?

Here it is at 400 on Tuesday. Parallax is pretty easy to control with your eye.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Zeiss Victory glass = don’t matter what magnification you use, it’s better than a leupold.

Cat

[Jerry D]

I much prefer a simple variable scope in the 2-7 x 32 range.


Vortex had a nice 1.5-8x32 and the same reason it is discontinued is the same reason I dont buy vortex. Or is it a reason I should buy a fixed power?

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[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Cat

Sorry Cat, after playing with optics of all shapes, sizes, and price range, I’ve found Zeiss victory glass to be the clear winner 😁

[Nyksta]

Originally Posted by chuck

Here it is at 400 on Tuesday. Parallax is pretty easy to control with your eye.

I think shooting a tripod mounted laser could improve your groups...

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by sns2

As I said earlier...minutiae.

Chuck is not a shrinking violet, and can take people disagreeing with him without his feelers getting hurt. From what I have seen of his hunting pics, the territory he and his son hunt seems to be pretty wide open. If so, I think that other than simplicity, his choice of scopes is not a good one at all.

Ya he’s definitely very familiar with his gear
Seems to work well for him
Everyone’s needs are a little different though

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by Jerry D

A 50mm objective is only brighter then a 40mm or a 36 or a 32 at higher magnifications.

At low magnification the straight tubes will be the same brightness at the big bells.

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I’ll bet you that I can see a lot better at dawn and dusk at 4x with a zeiss 3-12x56 victory than you can with a Leupold 4x36 or 6x36

[Jerry D]

Thats 2 different scopes not the same quality. All things being the same, at 1 power a 24mm will be as bright as a 56mm

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[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Jerry D

Thats 2 different scopes not the same quality. All things being the same, at 1 power a 24mm will be as bright as a 56mm

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What would be the same quality in a fixed power scope?

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Jerry D

Thats 2 different scopes not the same quality. All things being the same, at 1 power a 24mm will be as bright as a 56mm

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And who uses fixed 1x scopes?

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

And who uses fixed 1x scopes?

Everyone who doesn’t have one.

[Jerry D]

The post became large scopes and difference in light gathering and brightness between bell sizes at various powers.

Bigger bells are only brighter at higher powers. At lower powers the brightness is the same as smaller bell scopes.

If your shooting at lower power ranges at dawn and dusk, you don't necessarily need a highe bell.

https://www.leupold.com/leupold-core...yths-explained

Read myth 2. Its coming from leupold so zeiss may argue otherwise.

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[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Jerry D

https://www.leupold.com/leupold-core...yths-explained

Read myth 2. Its coming from leupold so zeiss may argue otherwise.

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My point is the glass will be more brilliant if it comes from Zeiss than if it comes from Leupold because it has higher quality lens and coatings. I would venture to say a Zeiss Victory scope set at 10x would be on par with a fixed 4x power Leupold, if not maybe even brighter, but when you crank that Zeiss down to 2.5x it would definitely out perform the fixed power Leupold. At 16oz there is only 4 or 5 oz difference in weight between a 40mm fixed compared to a 50mm variable.

You can shave weight in a lot of places on a rifle, but in my opinion the optics aren’t the place to do it. Ymmv.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

My point is the glass will be more brilliant if it comes from Zeiss than if it comes from Leupold because it has higher quality lens and coatings. I would venture to say a Zeiss Victory scope set at 10x would be on par with a fixed 4x power Leupold, if not maybe even brighter, but when you crank that Zeiss down to 2.5x it would definitely out perform the fixed power Leupold. At 16oz there is only 4 or 5 oz difference in weight between a 40mm fixed compared to a 50mm variable.

You can shave weight in a lot of places on a rifle, but in my opinion the optics aren’t the place to do it. Ymmv.

Mine does. Heavy optics add weight yes. But more importantly it’s where they add it. Use what you will.

[Pathfinder76]

The notion that I can’t hunt open country with a fixed six power scope is asinine.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by chuck

The notion that I can’t hunt open country with a fixed six power scope is asinine.

I don’t think anyone is saying you can’t, they’re saying you would be better equipped seeing what you’re shooting at if you’re going to be taking 400-500yd shots. In low light conditions you won’t be making a 500yd shot, at least I don’t. When I’m hunting whitetail I’m trophy hunting so having a variable scope with a minimum 10x is a must for me.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

I don’t think anyone is saying you can’t, they’re saying you would be better equipped seeing what you’re shooting at if you’re going to be taking 400-500yd shots. In low light conditions you won’t be making a 500yd shot, at least I don’t. When I’m hunting whitetail I’m trophy hunting so having a variable scope with a minimum 10x is a must for me.

If you must, you must.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by chuck

If you must, you must.

And I feel better prepared while in the field.


While I have you here, what exactly happens when a person is over scoped? I honestly don’t know the symptoms and may be a victim unknowingly?

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Sorry Cat, after playing with optics of all shapes, sizes, and price range, I’ve found Zeiss victory glass to be the clear winner 😁

i've owned lots of Zeiss scopes and shot with a bunch more as well as Night Force and S&B,and others and frankly once you get up there to the upper models it is what one prefers not what it better IMO.
I much prefer Leupold scopes if I have to shoot with one .
The exception is at the range , if I have time, I switch out whatever is on the rifle and put my big 9-36X / 34mm IOR Valdada on
Cat

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

And I feel better prepared while in the field.


While I have you here, what exactly happens when a person is over scoped? I honestly don’t know the symptoms and may be a victim unknowingly?

And I feel better prepared with a light low mounted scope on a 7 3/4 lb rifle. To me a rifle that handles well that is easy to put into service is invaluable for hunting.

[dave99]

My 6.5CM wears a z5 3-18x, and my 30.06 has a z3 3-9x.

I fully admit that the 18x is over scoped for hunting, but I sure love seeing the hits when doing work on paper at 300 yards without reaching for the spotter. Have not had any issues with tracking or quality out of either scope, although they are not exactly entry level scopes.

My issue with fixed 6x is target acquisition at close range. I would much prefer an over scoped 3-18x set to 3x while still hunting thick bush than a fixed 6x.


Am I the only one?


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[Pathfinder76]

I’ve shot game inside 10 yards with mine. Zero issues.

[W921]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

I would be interested hearing the rationale used by those showing preference for a fixed magnification over a variable that includes but is not limited to the same power.

The idea is a fixed power scope has less moving parts or has less to go wrong with than a variable.
I have had no problems with my small Leopold variables so I'm thinking its not really an issue.
I do believe that the bigger the overall physical size of the scope, the more likely it is to break or get damaged. With horses this really matters.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by chuck

And I feel better prepared with a light low mounted scope on a 7 3/4 lb rifle. To me a rifle that handles well that is easy to put into service is invaluable for hunting.

The rifle on the bottom weighs in under 8lb with a sling and full magazine. I have a picture of it on the scale but for some reasons imagur isn’t uploading it. Once it loads I’ll post the scale pic. On a side note, I’ve never had any other rifle handle as well as that one, and I’ve got 100% confidence in this setup. It has never failed me and I don’t foresee any problems in the future either.

It doesn’t matter the size of your scope, it’s the ring height that matters and I don’t feel impeded using medium rings.



It’s working now

[dave99]

Originally Posted by chuck

I’ve shot game inside 10 yards with mine. Zero issues.

That is great. But more a testament to your skill as a rifleman than suitability of the 6x scope for that purpose.

I know many experienced hunters that would struggle with 6x at 10yds under pressure of quick target acquisition. Myself included.

I totally agree with you that a low mount is important.


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[Pathfinder76]

Kurt, use what you like. But I wouldn’t consider a 3-9/10 40mm scope as being over scoped.