Your Idea's, to face lift our current Draw System

[209x50]

The actual number in 1971 was 159934

[hal53]

Originally Posted by 209x50

The actual number in 1971 was 159934

Total licenses??, where are you finding this info????

[Pikebreath]

Wow, this thread appears to be headed for some kind of postings record by the looks of it!

So we all know draw wait times are getting longer but the number of hunters has significantly declined in the past 40 years. This is only possible becuz draw participation has increased at a much higher rate than that the drop in hunter numbers. It becomes pretty obvious the solution is to discourage draw participation.

I know dropping the 999 option has been discussed already and this certainly is one option that would lower overall draw participation. I am in favor of axing the 999.

I haven't read the whole thread, so I am not sure if this has been mentioned yet,,, but how about basing priority by zone rather than by license? For example you apply twice unsuccessfully for mule buck in 100, you would have a P2 for 100. If you decide to apply for a different zone you enter that draw as a P0.

This would also level the playing field when a new zone is put into the draw such as we see with the new elk seasons popping up through the 100s and 200s.

Eliminating the 999 and basing priority by zone would force applicants to make "serious choices" in their draws rather than manipulating future draw options to their benefit through priority building.

And for the record, I am as guilty as anyone for priority building having used the 999 option many times,,, and prior to the 999 option, applying in zones with little chance of success just to build priority.

[hal53]

Originally Posted by Pikebreath

Wow, this thread appears to be headed for some kind of postings record by the looks of it!

So we all know draw wait times are getting longer but the number of hunters has significantly declined in the past 40 years. This is only possible becuz draw participation has increased at a much higher rate than that the drop in hunter numbers. It becomes pretty obvious the solution is to discourage draw participation.

I know dropping the 999 option has been discussed already and this certainly is one option that would lower overall draw participation. I am in favor of axing the 999.

I haven't read the whole thread, so I am not sure if this has been mentioned yet,,, but how about basing priority by zone rather than by license? For example you apply twice unsuccessfully for mule buck in 100, you would have a P2 for 100. If you decide to apply for a different zone you enter that draw as a P0.

This would also level the playing field when a new zone is put into the draw such as we see with the new elk seasons popping up through the 100s and 200s.

Eliminating the 999 and basing priority by zone would force applicants to make "serious choices" in their draws rather than manipulating future draw options to their benefit through priority building.

And for the record, I am as guilty as anyone for priority building having used the 999 option many times,,, and prior to the 999 option applying in zones with little chance of success just to build priority.

so... I can 999 every zone I wish for a draw at $3.00 bucks??, thinking that might increase the draws wait time???,sorry just re-read your thoughts..., I still say, the problem is people shotgun applying and entering their wives , kids and rand parents, and the "pseudo " residents that are applying. A little bit of tightening up on these rules would be a start. ,,, and I am still waiting for 209's answer as to where he is getting his numbers from....don't think I will wait up...they do not make sense

[brownbomber]

Originally Posted by hal53

so... I can 999 every zone I wish for a draw at $3.00 bucks??, thinking that might increase the draws wait time???,sorry just re-read your thoughts..., I still say, the problem is people shotgun applying and entering their wives , kids and rand parents, and the "pseudo " residents that are applying. A little bit of tightening up on these rules would be a start. ,,, and I am still waiting for 209's answer as to where he is getting his numbers from....don't think I will wait up...they do not make sense

You forgot pets and other people's children ( use them if they've ever spent the night... trial adoption didnt pan out)

[elkhunter11]

I haven't read the whole thread, so I am not sure if this has been mentioned yet,,, but how about basing priority by zone rather than by license? For example you apply twice unsuccessfully for mule buck in 100, you would have a P2 for 100. If you decide to apply for a different zone you enter that draw as a P0.

So what happens to your priority points, if they close the season in that particular WMU? Or what happens if they change to a split season in that WMU? Which season do your priority points apply to?

[ceedub]

I'm late wading into this thread, but I do have some recollection of hunting back in the seventies while growing up down in the County of Flagstaff.

You could buy 3 tags from the list of 4 species, WT, MD, Moose or Elk, or....

You could buy 1 any species/any sex tag. If you purchased that tag you couldn't buy any others. This gave you an opportunity to shoot the first animal of any species you ran into and you were done for the season.

I remember hunting more in the seventies, but shooting less. There was a doe season but I think it was a 2 day season in late November, well after buck season had been underway. Seasons weren't nearly as long either, I remember waiting until the 7th or 8th of November for the opener.

There may be less hunters than historical numbers, but with draws, supplemental tags and extended seasons some guys are taking 6 or 7 deer a season. That's the part that gets my blood boiling.

No priority for the few draws that there were. I remember drawing Camp Wainwright many years in a row but couldn't draw a Cypress Hills Elk tag or Antelope tag to save myself. I was for the 999 option when it was first introduced, but in the long run, I think it's reduced the success of everyone overall.

-Craig

[sheepguide]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

So what happens to your priority points, if they close the season in that particular WMU? Or what happens if they change to a split season in that WMU? Which season do your priority points apply to?

If the season closes where you put in your SOL! It's a draw. You take your chances where you put in. If zone 300 elk closes now are my points transferable to another zone? If 437 sheep has a die off and the zone closed are the priority points good for other zones. Not transferable now not transferable later.

If they split the season in a zone you could keep your points into the part of the zone you choose. But then stay with that split.

[elkhunter11]

If they split the season in a zone you could keep your points into the part of the zone you choose.

Do you really think that it would make sense to have to contact every person with priority if they split the seasons, or even split a wmu for the purpose of a hunt? Given that hundreds of people could be involved,I really don't see that happening. It makes much more sense to use the draw code for establishing priority.

[sheepguide]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Do you really think that it would make sense to have to contact every person with priority if they split the seasons, or even split a wmu for the purpose of a hunt? Given that hundreds of people could be involved,I really don't see that happening. It makes much more sense to use the draw code for establishing priority.

Why contact everyone?? The split would have to be noted in he new draw book so people know of the change. Right there in the draw book could state your previous priorities are good for either part A or part B.
Do they call everyone now if there is a change in zones or draws??

[Pikebreath]

You are currently allowed to apply in up to three zones,,,, Perhaps that would not have to change and you can build priority in up to 3 zones. If you are unsuccessful you would have bumped your priority in 3 zones. Then if one zone closes you still have priority in 2 other zones. Once drawn, you start as P0 in all zones.

At any rate, eliminating the 999 and building priority by zone would force applicants to be far more "serious" in their draw applications.

Additionally, it would be much easier predicting when you would be drawn in a zone. You would know the size of the priority pool you are in and have a much better idea of how many applicants are ahead of you.

[sakogreywolf]

Originally Posted by Pikebreath

Wow, this thread appears to be headed for some kind of postings record by the looks of it!

So we all know draw wait times are getting longer but the number of hunters has significantly declined in the past 40 years. This is only possible becuz draw participation has increased at a much higher rate than that the drop in hunter numbers. It becomes pretty obvious the solution is to discourage draw participation.

I know dropping the 999 option has been discussed already and this certainly is one option that would lower overall draw participation. I am in favor of axing the 999.

I haven't read the whole thread, so I am not sure if this has been mentioned yet,,, but how about basing priority by zone rather than by license? For example you apply twice unsuccessfully for mule buck in 100, you would have a P2 for 100. If you decide to apply for a different zone you enter that draw as a P0.

This would also level the playing field when a new zone is put into the draw such as we see with the new elk seasons popping up through the 100s and 200s.

Eliminating the 999 and basing priority by zone would force applicants to make "serious choices" in their draws rather than manipulating future draw options to their benefit through priority building.

And for the record, I am as guilty as anyone for priority building having used the 999 option many times,,, and prior to the 999 option, applying in zones with little chance of success just to build priority.

IMO, the benefits of 999 far out way any negatives, and I suspect I would never be comfortable with losing that option.

As for building priority by zone rather than licence, and then losing all priority if you change zones....................sigh. There are too many things that can change in life, beyond a persons control that could force them to a zone other than the one they originally intended. Losing priority because you were forced to move for example, is not reasonable grounds to lose all of your priority.