270 vs 30-06

[Nate_K1500]

I shoot a 30-06 and the wife shoots her 270, I find the 270 has less kick which is good for her, I personally love the 30-06 due to it being very easy to find ammo for and the bullet grain sizing for everything from a coyote to a moose.

[dollman]

I'm a 270 fan ,but I sold mine to my father to fund my new sako black bear in 30 06 , the main reason for going to a 30 06 was ,simply the heads and ammo are easy to find In my area ,but I still like both atb Steve

[gunluvr]

Originally Posted by gunluvr

Bought a 25-06 a few years back just because the store didn't have the model I wanted in 270.Bought a 30-06 later. Now I have a 25-06 for deer and a 30-06 for moose. Got no need for a 270. Maybe I should start a thread titled..."If you could only own 2 rifles"...nah, I'm sure that's been done.

If I had bought a 270 to start with, I suppose it would have filled both needs. If there's a point to this I guess it's "Do you really only want to own just one rifle? ".

[Don_Parsons]

Me 2 with idea of 1 for all.

Load light for plingking, and heavy for thick skin.

I have 4 mains I use along with 7 others that clutter up the gun crib. 11 is too much now that I'm scaling back.

Just my idea of thining out the heard, Ha.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by Bushleague

I don't agree with this, first of all most people compare the 150 grain .270 bullet with the 180 grail .30 cal. This makes sense because the theoretical penetration of those two bullets are the same (actually the .270 is slightly higher). The whole antiquated argument that you need to compare bullets of the same weight is flawed, a 140 grain 6.5mm bullet will get massive amounts of penetration while a similar .30 cal bullet will get significantly less. When you get down into the .25 and .24 cal rounds it wouldn't even be possible, if you were to compare the .30 cal rounds up to the .338 it would be equally silly trying to compare similar bullet weights. Smaller caliber rounds allow you to shoot lighter bullets, simple as that, generally resulting in a flatter trajectory with a similar charge of powder.

.

That's interesting, because on first blush I think "Why not compare both shooting a 150g bullet?" But of course the 150 g bullet shot from the 30-06 is wider and shorter, so not aerodynamically the same. Good to remember. There's no 100% infallible way to compare the two that doesn't involve a little extrapolation of some factors.

[brimmer]

Both obviously very useful calibers. The .270 would be the slightly flatter shooting round where as the 06 is the winner in terms of versatility due to bullet weights available. When I hunt moose where there are bear around I typically run a heavier bullet and so appreciate the 06.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

That's interesting, because on first blush I think "Why not compare both shooting a 150g bullet?" But of course the 150 g bullet shot from the 30-06 is wider and shorter, so not aerodynamically the same. Good to remember. There's no 100% infallible way to compare the two that doesn't involve a little extrapolation of some factors.

Exactly.



What so few seem to understand is that .6 inch more drop will not make or break a shot if the shooter has even just average skills.

Nor will 300 more fp energy ensure a clean kill on a poor shot.

That's all the difference there is, comparing a 130 gr. 270 to a 165 gr, 30-06 at average hunting ranges.

[Kurt505]

Here is some data from this website

http://guide.sportsmansguide.com/ballisticscharts/

I used the top performing 130gr bullet for the 270, the top performing 140gr bullet for the 280, and the top performing 165gr bullet for the 30-06 because I believe these weights to be the optimum weight for its corresponding caliber.

Bullet drop is based on 200yd zero, energy and velocity numbers are at muzzle and 500yds.

270

Velocity
Muzzle: 3060
500yds: 2048

Energy
Muzzle: 2702
500yds: 1211

Bullet drop at 500yds: 38.2

280

Velocity
Muzzle: 3000
500yds: 2097

Energy
Muzzle: 2797
500yds: 1368

Bullet drop at 500yds: 38.2


30-06

Velocity
Muzzle: 2800
500yds: 1919

Energy
Muzzle: 2873
500yds: 1350

Bullet drop at 500yds: 45.0


From this you can see all three are similar in performance, 0-500yds it's likely no animal will ever notice a difference, but it goes to show the 280 isn't just hype, it does out perform both other cartridges. If you rely on factory ammo there is no point to buying a 280, but if you reload it's a great option, and even better if you Ackley it!

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

That's interesting, because on first blush I think "Why not compare both shooting a 150g bullet?" But of course the 150 g bullet shot from the 30-06 is wider and shorter, so not aerodynamically the same. Good to remember. There's no 100% infallible way to compare the two that doesn't involve a little extrapolation of some factors.

Sectional density is the de bunker of all this differing diameter vs. bullet weight, arguments. If the construction is the same, and the diameter differs, compare section densities.

There's no way a 130, .30 cal will perform on game the same as a 130, .277 cal.

Trajectory is but one part of this debate.

[stob]

'06 cuz I've known / seen Moose that could tell the difference

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Dick284

Sectional density is the de bunker of all this differing diameter vs. bullet weight, arguments. If the construction is the same, and the diameter differs, compare section densities.

There's no way a 130, .30 cal will perform on game the same as a 130, .277 cal.

Trajectory is but one part of this debate.

One can argue all day about sectional densities and ballistic coefficients and the like.

Bottom line, will they both kill a critter at normal hunting ranges in a reasonable amount of time if they hit a vital spot?

If the discussion were about competitive shooting where fractions of an inch makes all the difference, then such considerations are everything.

But for hunting they are mostly a useless distraction.

If margins that small will make the difference, then one should not be pulling the trigger.

I submit that to do so is both irresponsible and damages the image of all hunters.

[bradcgm]

30-06 is like Crown Royal... its available everywhere and gets the job done, 270 is like Canadian Club... Still very available and will also get the job done and 280 is for guys who like to make their own because its cheaper in the long run!

I run a 30-06 because I am quite confident that it will take down anything that I point it at with good placement.

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

One can argue all day about sectional densities and ballistic coefficients and the like.

Bottom line, will they both kill a critter at normal hunting ranges in a reasonable amount of time if they hit a vital spot?

If the discussion were about competitive shooting where fractions of an inch makes all the difference, then such considerations are everything.

But for hunting they are mostly a useless distraction.

If margins that small will make the difference, then one should not be pulling the trigger.

I submit that to do so is both irresponsible and damages the image of all hunters.

If one were to use a 130, cup core .30 cal bullet on big game, I'd wager they'd see less than stellar terminal ballistics when animals are hit, because the cup core offerings are varmint bullets after all. Your argument is flimsier than a cheap lawn chair.
The same can be said for running 100grain .277's on game, as the cup core pills are frangilbly designed, they will not perform any where the same as a 100grain .243 cal bullet.

Sectional density matters, far more than Ballistic Coefficent, and is very poorly understood, by far too many people.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by bradcgm

30-06 is like Crown Royal... its available everywhere and gets the job done, 270 is like Canadian Club... Still very available and will also get the job done and 280 is for guys who like Wisers Deluxe because they know enough to appreciate the subtle differences of a finer product!

I run a 30-06 because I am quite confident that it will take down anything that I point it at with good placement.

I fixed it for you

[mudbug]

Either one with the right bullet and proper placement will have the desired effect
So it's more a matter of fit etc and which one you prefer shooting

[Okotokian]

This is like having two Nobel laureates in physics argue the gravitational explanation of how my glass smashed on the floor when all I wanted to know was who pushed it off the table. LOL

You go guys!

[catnthehat]

Enough already!
Cat

[Don_Parsons]

Just a thought and it is an idea from Long range hunting & shooting.

Pick the bullet that is to be launched, and the shell casing behind it that is going to send it on its way.

Simple too see what a 100gr too 200gr is going to do from each case,,, factory loads since the numbers ft-per second with ft-lbs are worked out. Pick 3 brands of factory made bullets too come up with the happy medium.

One can see that this 130gr is better from this caliber then that, 150 from this unit, 165 in this caliber, looks like the 180gr works better from this case. The 200gr really shines on specs with that big casing.

This perhaps is why we have so many different calibers to choose from, it gives us the best results from this caliber or that.

Big difference in some calibers, and very little between others.

Another thing that is adding better down range ballistics is the quality of the bullets hitting the market.

So one bullet size in comparison to how it performs in each rifle caliber too the others.

LRHS had a good point when looking at it from 1 of the many ways each of us choose to compare.

Pal Don more wrong than right.

[^v^Tinda wolf^v^]

I've never fired a 30-06 but going from my experience with the 270 it's insanely accurate and flat. I've made several kill shots with mine but my highlight shot was actually on a gopher. 234 yards from the prone position, the gopher had his head sticking out of the hole. When I made my shot the bullet left a perfect horizontal tornado like dust cloud a couple inches off the ground the whole length of the shot and took his head clean off on impact. Looked like a clip out of the matrix. I also like the fact that it's reasonably priced and easy to find. My favorite bullet is Winchester 150 grain. I used federal for a bit but found the shorter bullet would snag when loading on occasion and the brass chipped off leaving debris everywhere.

[Norwest Alta]

Thirty odd six sounds much cooler then two seven zero or two eight zero.

[raab]

If its just for deer why not a 25-06? I've seen that round drop more then 1 deer in its tracks.

If it has to be between the 270 and the 30-06 for only deer hunting, I'd go 270. Less recoil, flatter trajectory, and fast bullet which creates lots of damage. In saying that either one is more then suitable for deer.

[Don_Parsons]

Difference in 270 and 30-06 ammo.

Federal fusion 150G.
Muzzle diff is 50 ft per second/ ft-lbs diff is 134.
500 yards M is 79 ft per second/ 101 ft-lbs
Diff in drop 0@200 is 0.8" at 500 yards

Hornady 150gr Inter Lock SP.
Muzzle diff is 70 ft per second/ 134 ft-lbs
500 yards M is 229 ft per second/ 276 ft-lbs
Diff in drop 0@200 is 4.5" at 500 yards.

So rifle kick is less than a lb if the rifles have the same weight and barrel length. Bullet trajectory averages out to a few inches over 500 yards.

All this information is gathered from the Federal & Hornady reload manuals on line.

Yes the 270 is flatter shooting this round, more so when using the 130's and 140's,,, not in the 165 and 178gr.

I haven't looked at the difference of the 165gr, 175gr and 180gr between 270 & 30-06, maybe this is where the 06 starts its gains in the long range area.

I'll do some sight seeing on Long range hunting and shooting forum too see what I come up with.

Kinda kool to see 4.5" and 0.8" drop between the too groups of bullets Federal and Hornady rounds in 150gr's

Pal Don

[lannie]

Originally Posted by Norwest Alta

Thirty aught six sounds much cooler then two seven zero or two eight zero.

.

[t.tinsmith]

30/06,.270 and 25/06 .The father,son and holy ghost of my hunting religion.All are effective,efficient and affordable.Just choose a good quality bullet for game your hunting..this is the key imo

[Don_Parsons]

^^^ + 2

[Webstar]

Go to the 270 WSM with 150 gr Gamekings.

[sinawalli]

Hit it in the vitals and caliber won't matter. Dead is dead.

[philthygeezer]

From reading many of the old masters I've often thought that the .270 Win and .375 H&H would be an ideal pair of rifles to hunt the world (in a couple of Model 70s for me). Everything from lighter and fast antelope loads to heavier and slower very large game loads within a recoil range that most can stand. Both can go flat and both can load heavier bullets with good results on game heavier than some give them credit for.

However, I'm also enticed by the ability to use a variety of .30 caliber bullets at varying velocities in .308 Win and .30-06 Sprg. The .375 would still be the other half though.

Pick your favourites and enjoy them. Enjoy the history behind the cartridges you shoot, as hunting can be tradition too. And support your local wildlife association!

[wolf308]

Easy. Get the 270 and an m1 garand. Triple Win

[Don_Parsons]

I've been spending time reviewing 270 & 30-06 on Long range hunting & shooting forum, interesting stuff on the ballistics Web sight too that explain the performance of each Cartrage too detail with different lengths of barrels using many factory loads,,, they even get into reloading of what each case too trajectory "could" do in the grand plan if one chooses to reload bullets.

Today there are many new bullets that perform good from different calibers, game size, distance is plays a roll in down range bullet performance. Way over my know how, so I remain with frugal priced bullets too gett'er done.

As mentioned above, the two calibers are good picks, OP mention that his pal would be shooting the lighter bullets, so pick that category that best fits that area.

I too think the same thing as light bullets lesson the recoil in a way, but its hard for me "personally" too not leave the option open for particular rifle too add heavier bullet if needed... "Just me as it has nothing to do with OP."

Pal Don at letting the Web fill the gap of helpful information when needed.