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  #31  
Old 05-27-2017, 01:50 PM
Don Andersen Don Andersen is offline
 
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Could they have been removed when originally found in Rosebud creek - probably.
Who dropped the ball - same guys who are responsible for Whirling Disease, Chronic wasting disease and on and on.


Don
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  #32  
Old 05-27-2017, 04:08 PM
JareS JareS is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Don Andersen View Post
Could they have been removed when originally found in Rosebud creek - probably.
Who dropped the ball - same guys who are responsible for Whirling Disease, Chronic wasting disease and on and on.


Don
Hmm, perhaps blame the people who put them there in the first place, not the people who are trying to keep it contained.

Prussian Carp are here because of someone importing and transporting them illegally. Unlike other Aquatic invasives that expand themselves into new jurisdictions from other places. Ie- Asian Carp moving their way up to and possibly into the Great Lakes

Getting rid of any population of the Prussian Carp may have beem partially contained by seine or gill netting but chemicals, (Rotenone) is essentially not used anymore because it kills everything and everything, causing more harm than good. Thats in lakes, ponds, etc. Will never be used again in flowing waters.
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  #33  
Old 05-27-2017, 06:29 PM
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Default Rotenone

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Originally Posted by JareS View Post
Hmm, perhaps blame the people who put them there in the first place, not the people who are trying to keep it contained.

Prussian Carp are here because of someone importing and transporting them illegally. Unlike other Aquatic invasives that expand themselves into new jurisdictions from other places. Ie- Asian Carp moving their way up to and possibly into the Great Lakes

Getting rid of any population of the Prussian Carp may have beem partially contained by seine or gill netting but chemicals, (Rotenone) is essentially not used anymore because it kills everything and everything, causing more harm than good. Thats in lakes, ponds, etc. Will never be used again in flowing waters.
Actually. What you say about rotenone is pure falsehood.

Please read up and understand it before spreading misinformation.
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  #34  
Old 05-27-2017, 06:44 PM
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We had a local golf course that had hundreds of them in a pond. When we had the big flood of 2013, that pond was flooded out. I'm sure that is not the only instance of carp being flooded into the water system.
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  #35  
Old 05-27-2017, 07:20 PM
last minute last minute is offline
 
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Default I Don't fish a lot anymore

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Nothing good will come of these fish in our waterways. They have been around for over ten years originating in the Rosebud river tributaries. The population is exploding and they will become more and more abundant.
are they not good to eat
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  #36  
Old 05-27-2017, 11:00 PM
calgarychef calgarychef is offline
 
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are they not good to eat
I tried eating some that I bowfished and they were "very not good." Perhaps if a person put them in clean water for a few days it would help them but it's hard to do that once you've run them through with an arrow.
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  #37  
Old 05-28-2017, 09:25 AM
jeprli jeprli is offline
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Not sure where you got your fish, but it should have almost sweet taste to it.

WWith so many bones they are best deep fried. Score them with a knife every 1/4" or less, dust them in seasoning flour and fry them in pig lard. Cooking oil will just dry it out to a consistency of cardboard no matter how you season it.

Last edited by jeprli; 05-28-2017 at 09:30 AM.
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  #38  
Old 05-28-2017, 01:21 PM
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Anyone heard about some plans to introduce gator gars into some of the northern states in the East coast to combat Asian carps?
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  #39  
Old 05-28-2017, 01:51 PM
Foshizzle13 Foshizzle13 is offline
 
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Anyone heard about some plans to introduce gator gars into some of the northern states in the East coast to combat Asian carps?


That sounds like a bad idea, then they eat everything else?
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  #40  
Old 05-28-2017, 09:27 PM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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Anyone heard about some plans to introduce gator gars into some of the northern states in the East coast to combat Asian carps?
Yes, also heard that. But I thought I heard it was to reintroduce into areas they were native to. And that they want to protect them with catch and release with zero limits.
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  #41  
Old 05-29-2017, 05:04 PM
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perch does do a damage to trout but not walleye or pike ,not even sturgeon
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  #42  
Old 05-29-2017, 05:34 PM
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I have a book published in the late 60's titled the fishes of alberta documenting a carp like speicies in the red deer, Saskatchewan, battle, lower bow rivers. Called a quill back large scales. Max 26 inches lond weight to 12 lbs. Look just like carp to me. Latin name Carpiodes cyprinus
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  #43  
Old 05-29-2017, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by rycoma View Post
I have a book published in the late 60's titled the fishes of alberta documenting a carp like speicies in the red deer, Saskatchewan, battle, lower bow rivers. Called a quill back large scales. Max 26 inches lond weight to 12 lbs. Look just like carp to me. Latin name Carpiodes cyprinus
Rare member of the sucker family. Would love to catch one.
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  #44  
Old 06-01-2017, 06:16 PM
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Perch and walleye are NATIVE, and part of the natural ecosystem, whereas Carp are NON-NATIVE or INTRODUCED

.
Prussian carp was not native to Eastern Europe once as well. None of Eastern European fisheries collapsed because of Prussian Carp. I think you guys are vastly overrating danger of Prussian carp.
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  #45  
Old 06-01-2017, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by EZM View Post
1 oz pet store goldfish doesn't mutate into a 3 lb Prussian carp (unless you live near a nuclear power plant maybe ..lol)
Actually it is opposite. Goldfish was selectively bred from Prussian Carp. If you check any feeder goldfish in any fish stores you will see ones which look like Prussian carp - silver colour and very little decorative features. Maybe few of those somehow made it to the waters and reversed to their natural looks after few spawns.
From Wikipedia
Goldfish can hybridise with certain other species of carp as well as C. a. gibelio. Within three breeding generations, the vast majority of the hybrid spawn revert to the wild type colour.
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  #46  
Old 06-01-2017, 06:36 PM
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Prussian carp can be bought live in many Calgary European/oriental stores. I've even seen them at Co-op. Not a big reach for some idiot who wants their nearby flood pond or stream stocked with illegals.
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  #47  
Old 06-01-2017, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by rycoma View Post
I have a book published in the late 60's titled the fishes of alberta documenting a carp like speicies in the red deer, Saskatchewan, battle, lower bow rivers. Called a quill back large scales. Max 26 inches lond weight to 12 lbs. Look just like carp to me. Latin name Carpiodes cyprinus
Ive accidentally snagged a few in the red deer when dragging rapalas looking for walleyes in the deep pools. Neat looking fishes, had to do some research the first time as i had no idea what it was
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  #48  
Old 06-01-2017, 09:04 PM
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Wish I had pictures but I got a couple quill backs out of the battle in the early 90's in the hardisty wainwright area. The crayfish were also just showing up and I was chasing a few goldeye for a couple weeks that were hanging out in a school and to this day haven't seen any even close to that size. It's not like that anymore but the fisheries people were down there and tagging our walleyes with the floy and telemetry type tags. Didn't know quill back got 12 pounds. But I caught them and they were 12 to 16 inch.s.
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  #49  
Old 06-02-2017, 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by AK47 View Post
Prussian carp was not native to Eastern Europe once as well. None of Eastern European fisheries collapsed because of Prussian Carp. I think you guys are vastly overrating danger of Prussian carp.
Vastly overrating...? plenty of good information online for research on these fish. "breed 3 to 4 times per year" "destroy substrate" "reduce oxygen levels" "outcompete native fish for food" "overpopulate water bodies"
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  #50  
Old 06-02-2017, 08:29 AM
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Originally Posted by pikeman06 View Post
Wish I had pictures but I got a couple quill backs out of the battle in the early 90's in the hardisty wainwright area. The crayfish were also just showing up and I was chasing a few goldeye for a couple weeks that were hanging out in a school and to this day haven't seen any even close to that size. It's not like that anymore but the fisheries people were down there and tagging our walleyes with the floy and telemetry type tags. Didn't know quill back got 12 pounds. But I caught them and they were 12 to 16 inch.s.
I caught a 6 lb quill back in the blind man in the early 90's also. I took it into fish and wildlife because I didn't know what it was. They wanted to mount it for the red Deer office but they wanted me to pay for it. Wasn't going to happen.
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  #51  
Old 06-02-2017, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Fishslayer99 View Post
Vastly overrating...? plenty of good information online for research on these fish. "breed 3 to 4 times per year" "destroy substrate" "reduce oxygen levels" "outcompete native fish for food" "overpopulate water bodies"
None of that happened in Europe where they were introduced as well.
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  #52  
Old 06-02-2017, 10:10 AM
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I caught a 6 lb quill back in the blind man in the early 90's also. I took it into fish and wildlife because I didn't know what it was. They wanted to mount it for the red Deer office but they wanted me to pay for it. Wasn't going to happen.


Are they nuts?
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  #53  
Old 06-02-2017, 10:57 AM
huntsfurfish huntsfurfish is offline
 
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None of that happened in Europe where they were introduced as well.
How do you know that? How was the fishing and were you fishing there before they were introduced?

Just being here displaces native species!
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  #54  
Old 06-02-2017, 12:23 PM
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None of that happened in Europe where they were introduced as well.
Really...so they just pulled these facts out of thin air or made them up I guess? I personally will be trusting the professionals that have studied and researched these fish for several years, as well as my own observations on how polluted the water bodies and canals are with these things.
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  #55  
Old 06-03-2017, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by huntsfurfish View Post
How do you know that? How was the fishing and were you fishing there before they were introduced?

Just being here displaces native species!
Obviously, I am not old enough to tell how was fishing before Prussian carp appeared in Europe. What I can tell is they are not dominating any bigger water areas like lakes, rivers or big reservoirs, in fact it is quite the opposite and it is rare for locals to specifically target them as there are way more dominant non predator fish like bream, roach, rudd, common carp, tench and so on. You may find them as only species in tiny little ponds where they are stunted and reach maximum to 100-200 gr at best and locals catch and use them for bait for pike or catfish fishing. Those little ponds have no value as fishing body anyway as they are used for watering or as a source of water for cattle.
Mother nature finds its way to take care of things like that, local predators like pike, burbot, trout and walleye will control Prussian carp just fine the same way like they are doing for years in Europe.
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  #56  
Old 06-03-2017, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Fishslayer99 View Post
Really...so they just pulled these facts out of thin air or made them up I guess? I personally will be trusting the professionals that have studied and researched these fish for several years, as well as my own observations on how polluted the water bodies and canals are with these things.
Can you show my any links with scientific studies on any bigger water body overtaken by Prussian carp in Europe?
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  #57  
Old 06-05-2017, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by AK47 View Post
Obviously, I am not old enough to tell how was fishing before Prussian carp appeared in Europe. What I can tell is they are not dominating any bigger water areas like lakes, rivers or big reservoirs, in fact it is quite the opposite and it is rare for locals to specifically target them as there are way more dominant non predator fish like bream, roach, rudd, common carp, tench and so on. You may find them as only species in tiny little ponds where they are stunted and reach maximum to 100-200 gr at best and locals catch and use them for bait for pike or catfish fishing. Those little ponds have no value as fishing body anyway as they are used for watering or as a source of water for cattle.
Mother nature finds its way to take care of things like that, local predators like pike, burbot, trout and walleye will control Prussian carp just fine the same way like they are doing for years in Europe.
These fish are piled up by the hundreds of thousands in all the SRD canal systems. I have pictures and videos of these fish reaching 15" and almost 2 pounds. These canal systems are directly connected to almost every LARGE lake and reservoir in southern Alberta. They are not isolated to "tiny little ponds" and are in the Bow river, South Saskatchewan, Oldman and more. I believe you know little to nothing about these fish from your comments. Time will tell what impact these fish will have on our fisheries as I am no expert and I think its safe to say neither are you.
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  #58  
Old 06-05-2017, 11:16 AM
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Default From the Journal of Management of Biological Invasions

Seems to me AK47 that the risks here are very real, especially considering our native species do not reproduce at the same rate and may not be prolific enough to eat that many carp...so your European comparison is foolish, especially when you read about how cane toads have transformed a large swath of Australia since their introduction for comparison.



http://www.reabic.net/journals/bir/2...Elgin_etal.pdf



"The impacts of C. gibelio on native fish
communities and aquatic ecosystems in Southern
Alberta have not been estimated. However, the
negative impacts described in Europe, Asia, and
the Middle East suggest impacts in Alberta could
be substantial. The establishment of C. gibelio in
Europe has caused multiple fishery declines,
particularly with native cyprinids (Economidis et
al. 2000; Gaygusuz et al. 2007). C. gibelio have
a gynogenetic reproductive strategy that results
in reproductive competition that may reduce
native cyprinid population size (Tarkan et al.
2012). In Alberta, the May – August spawning
period of many native cyprinids overlaps with C.
gibelio’s, and increase the likelihood of reproductive
competition and subsequent population decline
(Nelson and Paetz 1992; Kottlat and Freyhof
2007). Direct competition for pelagic zooplankton
and benthic invertebrates may also reduce native
cyprinid populations (Lusk 2010). Additionally,
by removing pelagic zooplankton, C. gibelio can
weaken the top-down control zooplankton excerpt
on phytoplankton, resulting in turbid water.
Furthermore, consumption of lake benthos stirs
up bottom sediments, which can contribute to
increased turbidity. The irrigation canals, small
prairie streams, and shallow lakes also typically
lack piscivorous fish, leading to a lack of predation
on C. gibelio.
First detected in a single lake in 2006, C.
gibelio has since been documented as occurring
in parts of three adjacent major drainage basins
in the Canadian province of Alberta. Because
sampling effort has been uneven, additional
sampling may reveal an even broader distribution
and greater abundance. The potential consequence
of this uncontrolled spread is especially high
since the Oldman and South Saskatchewan River
basins border the Milk River, which is part of the
Mississippi River basin. A recent risk assessment
and climate match model conducted by the U.S.
Fish and Wildlife Service concluded that C.
gibelio has a moderate to high climate match with the U.S.A. states that border Alberta and
that the United States is at high risk of invasion
(U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service 2012). This suggests
that southern Canadian provinces with similar
climates are equally vulnerable to invasion. In
the absence of management efforts to control
their populations and spread, C. gibelio is likely
to continue spreading into new basins, causing
unknown consequences to native biota, ecosystems,
and economies."
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  #59  
Old 05-10-2022, 01:34 PM
landwalker landwalker is offline
 
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Some of the posts are getting racial, disgusting.

By reading thru carp thread and combined with my own observation, believe it started from feeder fish from pet store, they were used to feed fishes like Piranha, the price was like $10 for 50.

Then some people bought back and put them into water pond on private land, with a flood, everything is out of control.
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  #60  
Old 05-10-2022, 09:20 PM
smitty9 smitty9 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Sundancefisher View Post
totally false and you can't get further from the truth.

Unfortunately these illegal introductions are from people who think they are smart but are not and are causing irreparable damage for generations to come.

Totally selfish and self-serving and wrong beyond belief because people do it for themselves and kid themselves thinking they are doing it to help everyone. It continue to astounds that people post like you however I thank you since it provides an opportunity to teach since others are not brave enough to at least post what they believe to be correct.

I just hope you can learn and pass along that moving any fish around is extremely bad and to not do it.

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^this x 1000
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