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  #1  
Old 02-05-2019, 03:29 PM
ShortsideK ShortsideK is offline
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Default Does size really matter?

I'd like to hear from those that have found that changing the size of a fly pattern (during a fishing session) has made a noticeable and significant difference in your success.

We all have our "go to" patterns/sizes and always manage to catch some fish on them.

Myself, I can't remember intentionally changing the size of any fly while fishing, usually just going to a different pattern or technique.
Supposedly it can make a big difference.
Maybe I should be doing more of it.
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Old 02-05-2019, 03:49 PM
Smoky buck Smoky buck is offline
 
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It makes a difference in my opinion. In pressured waters going really small or really big compared to what others are using can make a difference. Streamer fishing I often use bigger patterns in dirty water then I do in clear water. Sometimes you need to match a hatch closely or go slightly bigger so your fly sticks out from the abundance of natural food

I change the size of my pattern for a number of reasons to increase my success
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Old 02-05-2019, 07:25 PM
kilgoretrout kilgoretrout is offline
 
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Default Pattern

There are days when it does not seen to matter ie usually throwing streamers in high water when placement within a foot of the bank and line control is way more important than pattern but there other times when trout are working perhaps to emergers where the right pattern and size is the difference between catching fish and being skunked. At the end of the day its usually not what you are using but what you do with it and when...... Of course if you are fishing for cutties there is less of a thought process to go through.....
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Old 02-05-2019, 07:39 PM
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newflyfisherman newflyfisherman is offline
 
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I spend a lot of time nymphing. In my experience the size of the fly and the way it is presented matter more than the pattern itself.

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Old 02-05-2019, 08:37 PM
Engels Engels is offline
 
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I believe presentation trumps both fly size and pattern.


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Old 02-05-2019, 09:32 PM
Mr Flyguy Mr Flyguy is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kilgoretrout View Post
There are days when it does not seen to matter ie usually throwing streamers in high water when placement within a foot of the bank and line control is way more important than pattern but there other times when trout are working perhaps to emergers where the right pattern and size is the difference between catching fish and being skunked. At the end of the day its usually not what you are using but what you do with it and when...... Of course if you are fishing for cutties there is less of a thought process to go through.....
Ha ha, that's what she said the other night!
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Old 02-05-2019, 11:23 PM
commieboy commieboy is offline
 
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I find it matters when fishing dry fly. Nymphing, less so.
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Old 02-06-2019, 07:27 AM
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newflyfisherman newflyfisherman is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by commieboy View Post
I find it matters when fishing dry fly. Nymphing, less so.
Depends on the water I suppose, but in my experience I've had trout that would turn their nose up to a size 18 pheasant tail but would clobber a size 22. Lots of factors like how pressured the fish are, and what insects are present in the water. If there is a lot of bugs to choose from size isnt as important. But in early spring when you have only baetis and midges really present in the river size plays a huge role

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  #9  
Old 02-06-2019, 09:13 AM
Jayhad Jayhad is offline
 
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I pretty much streamer fish 99% of my time, a few years ago I experimented with bumping up the size of my streamers to get limit the size of small fish. I found that I went from a 6 to 4 to 2, I now use the size 2 all the time as it cuts out a lot of the fish under 18"
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  #10  
Old 02-06-2019, 03:18 PM
scel scel is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShortsideK View Post
I'd like to hear from those that have found that changing the size of a fly pattern (during a fishing session) has made a noticeable and significant difference in your success.

We all have our "go to" patterns/sizes and always manage to catch some fish on them.

Myself, I can't remember intentionally changing the size of any fly while fishing, usually just going to a different pattern or technique.
Supposedly it can make a big difference.
On the Bow River, there are 2 hatches where getting the right size is critical (and an honourary 3rd). The first is a trico hatch. I have seen them as big as a sz20, but mostly 22 or smaller. The Bow River fish seem to key in on a very specific profile.

The second hatch is BWO. I feel there are 2 or 3 species. The bigger ones tend to hatch in spring. I always start off with a sz16, but almost never catch fish until I downsize to an sz18 (in spring) or a sz20 (in fall). In most cases, I usually start with a parachute pattern because it is easiest to see, but almost always catch 70%+ of my fish on a comparadun, which neither floats particularly well nor is easy to see.

Honourary 3rd are mid August caddis. It just seems as the summer trickles on, the size of the caddis fly shrinks (until monster October caddis). Sz12 will work in the early season, but sz16 is more appropriate later in the year.
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  #11  
Old 02-06-2019, 03:48 PM
ShortsideK ShortsideK is offline
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Hmmm...
Lots to consider.
I will definitely give more consideration to the size of my flies when things aren't going well.
I fish mainly size 14 and 16, but have tied many smaller sizes of the same patterns. I'll have to give the size 20s and smaller more time in the water.

Even with my limited effort, I still manage >700 fish/year, mostly sub-surface.
It's not often where I fish that the fish are very picky, but it has happened. I usually attribute it to the time of day and/or water temperature.

Thanx for the suggestions.
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Old 02-06-2019, 03:57 PM
Engels Engels is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scel View Post
On the Bow River, there are 2 hatches where getting the right size is critical (and an honourary 3rd). The first is a trico hatch. I have seen them as big as a sz20, but mostly 22 or smaller. The Bow River fish seem to key in on a very specific profile.

The second hatch is BWO. I feel there are 2 or 3 species. The bigger ones tend to hatch in spring. I always start off with a sz16, but almost never catch fish until I downsize to an sz18 (in spring) or a sz20 (in fall). In most cases, I usually start with a parachute pattern because it is easiest to see, but almost always catch 70%+ of my fish on a comparadun, which neither floats particularly well nor is easy to see.

Honourary 3rd are mid August caddis. It just seems as the summer trickles on, the size of the caddis fly shrinks (until monster October caddis). Sz12 will work in the early season, but sz16 is more appropriate later in the year.
Scel,

When the dry flies are getting that small and hard to see, have you ever tied the small dry fly as a "dropper" from another,easier to see dry fly?
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Old 02-06-2019, 08:10 PM
scel scel is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Engels View Post
When the dry flies are getting that small and hard to see, have you ever tied the small dry fly as a "dropper" from another,easier to see dry fly?
I have tried this. When fishing tricos and olives, it is almost always sight fishing---never a blind cast.

Your first comment in that presentation is the most important aspect, I agree 100%. When size/fly becomes important, the fishing has become technical, and presentation is still the most important aspect, but now errors in presentation are far more significant.

At least on the Bow River, at least 80% of the time, the only good shots at BWO/trico fish is from almost straight downstream. In the case of these 2 hatches, the fish are usually tight, rising fairly rhythmically. So, to time the rhythm properly, I find best success landing the fly 40-60cm in front of the riser. I find the point fly lands too close to the rising fish, if it does not straight up spook the fish, it will throw the riser off its rhythm. If it is too far away, it is difficult to time the cast, and now there is a leader running directly over the fish.

I also find a point fly tends to screw with the drift of the dropper. It does not matter much when it is a sz16 caddis behind a big foam bug, but it does matter when it is a sz20 mayfly sitting in the film.

So, maybe other people might have more luck, but I definitely find a decrease in efficacy when using a indi-fly.
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  #14  
Old 02-06-2019, 09:36 PM
Engels Engels is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scel View Post
I have tried this. When fishing tricos and olives, it is almost always sight fishing---never a blind cast.



Your first comment in that presentation is the most important aspect, I agree 100%. When size/fly becomes important, the fishing has become technical, and presentation is still the most important aspect, but now errors in presentation are far more significant.



At least on the Bow River, at least 80% of the time, the only good shots at BWO/trico fish is from almost straight downstream. In the case of these 2 hatches, the fish are usually tight, rising fairly rhythmically. So, to time the rhythm properly, I find best success landing the fly 40-60cm in front of the riser. I find the point fly lands too close to the rising fish, if it does not straight up spook the fish, it will throw the riser off its rhythm. If it is too far away, it is difficult to time the cast, and now there is a leader running directly over the fish.



I also find a point fly tends to screw with the drift of the dropper. It does not matter much when it is a sz16 caddis behind a big foam bug, but it does matter when it is a sz20 mayfly sitting in the film.



So, maybe other people might have more luck, but I definitely find a decrease in efficacy when using a indi-fly.


What you are saying totally makes sense. Good to know. I’m usually a sub surface guy at this point in my fly fishing “career” and have found that as long as you have a good presentation and get it in the zone trout will usually eat it. Some of the nymphs I fish don’t resemble much of anything in the river and trout still smash it throughout the year (rainbow warrior for example) I totally understand that when the fish are feeding up too, size plays a bigger factor. Real good insight scel!




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  #15  
Old 02-07-2019, 03:10 PM
Mr Flyguy Mr Flyguy is offline
 
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The only thing that is really important, IMHO, is the size of the fish:

one 20" trout = ten 8 to 10" dinkies
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  #16  
Old 02-08-2019, 11:11 PM
Maxwell87 Maxwell87 is offline
 
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It matters forsure, streamers a little less important with size. Nymphing and dries the difference in a few fish or keeping your “average” vs gets lots or “all of them” can be critical at times.

It is all in what you are after. I think a lot of us get lazy and accept we get what we get. if your on point with your presentation and tactics with a larger pattern you will get some but not most or all.

Going a size smaller than what you think can be valuable in most situations. To us the patterns and bugs look small. Friends/clients often say “It dosnt matter, I can’t tell so they can’t” But put it to scale for the trout we target. A size 20 nymph is the size of a dorito or a 16 could be chicken wing size!?! Those are large enough food items for us to be picky and our loves don’t depend on it
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Old 02-09-2019, 09:18 AM
Mr Flyguy Mr Flyguy is offline
 
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I'm going to have to stick to nothing smaller than #14. By the time I try to finish tying on a #18 or #20 the bite will be over and the sun will be down!

Or maybe I have to stop using 10 lb tippet?
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