hmm wonder what happened in oregon????

[Bowhntr4life]

Originally Posted by winged1

The video tells a very different story than the 'eye witness'.

You probably need to watch it again and listen to the entire audio. You're right, it doesn't show the first part closely where they shot at him at the first stop, but this is why he suddenly took off and continued to speed up. If he was shot at before he put his hand to his pocket, this seems very clearly aligned with her testimony. He's a rancher. He knows how to use a handgun... As any true American does. If he had violent intentions, he would've come out of his vehicle guns blazing.

The footage conveniently cuts out as well to not show the aftermath of the shooting into and at the wrecked vehicle. That wouldn't be good publicity for the government in any way. If even half of the audio was present, it would match her story.



I don't claim to know exactly what happened, but I can see how her story could match. The government has conveniently kept a tight lip on the details, except limited footage on the incident. Between the footage, an actual witness from someone in the car, and my knowledge about the family and their credibility, we really don't have anything else to go off of at this point.

Americans are armed in this case because they fear their government and know they'll overstep their bounds. If the NDP were doing something similar here in Alberta and it was legal to bear arms on such land and we were the victims, I guarantee most of us would be armed; not because we have violent intentions, but because we know corruption will not provide justice regardless.

I personally wouldn't take that risk in the first place... But I guess that depends on what freedoms were being stripped from my family.

In this case... It was something they were willing to fight for, right or wrong.

[winged1]

Originally Posted by Bowhntr4life

You probably need to watch it again and listen to the entire audio. You're right, it doesn't show the first part closely where they shot at him at the first stop, but this is why he suddenly took off and continued to speed up. If he was shot at before he put his hand to his pocket, this seems very clearly aligned with her testimony. He's a rancher. He knows how to use a handgun... As any true American does. If he had violent intentions, he would've come out of his vehicle guns blazing.

The footage conveniently cuts out as well to not show the aftermath of the shooting into and at the wrecked vehicle. That wouldn't be good publicity for the government in any way. If even half of the audio was present, it would match her story.


I don't claim to know exactly what happened, but I can see how her story could match. The government has conveniently kept a tight lip on the details, except limited footage on the incident. Between the footage, an actual witness from someone in the car, and my knowledge about the family and their credibility, we really don't have anything else to go off of at this point.

Americans are armed in this case because they fear their government and know they'll overstep their bounds. If the NDP were doing something similar here in Alberta and it was legal to bear arms on such land and we were the victims, I guarantee most of us would be armed; not because we have violent intentions, but because we know corruption will not provide justice regardless.

I personally wouldn't take that risk in the first place... But I guess that depends on what freedoms were being stripped from my family.

In this case... It was something they were willing to fight for, right or wrong.

The rear window is intact the entire time. It's strategicly cleared to expose the contents. The officer on the left aims and shoots the victim, but visually does no other shooting. Strange as the account was that a large number of rounds struck the left side of the vehicle. There is no partial audio from the helicopter, unless you want to hear helicopter. The claim was upwards of forty vehicles involved. Your distant association has absolutely no bearing on the reported facts.

Americans are armed in this case because they are radicals. No one wanted them there. The were looking for a fight and they found one. The more Americans that carry guns to thier protests, the more people die.

[Bowhntr4life]

Originally Posted by wags

And video evidence, and words spoken by the individual....

You're absolutely right. Hopefully my comments have brought some light to the situation, but none of us know for sure... Including me.

It's hard to stand united as passionate outdoorsman when the truth is so difficult to discern. For that reason, I have nothing else to add.

I hope that when we do need to stand together on important issues for Albertans and outdoorsman... WE DO!!!

[Bowhntr4life]

Originally Posted by wags

And video evidence, and words spoken by the individual....

Originally Posted by Bowhntr4life

You're absolutely right. Hopefully my comments have brought some light to the situation, but none of us know for sure... Including me.

It's hard to stand united as passionate outdoorsman when the truth is so difficult to discern. For that reason, I have nothing else to add.

I hope that when we do need to stand together on important issues for Albertans and outdoorsman... WE DO!!!

Sorry, I meant to quote the following:

The only facts we have are that,
a father is dead, and

None of us were there.

We are forming conclusions and judgments based on speculation,
and information from people with 'self interest',
all of whom are probably willing to lie.

'There are two sides to every pancake.'

But don't let any of this stop the circus.

__________________
~Men and fish are alike. They both get into trouble when they open their mouths.~

[Donkey Oatey]

Originally Posted by Bowhntr4life

Sorry, I meant to quote the following:

The only facts we have are that,
a father is dead, and

None of us were there.

We are forming conclusions and judgments based on speculation,
and information from people with 'self interest',
all of whom are probably willing to lie.

'There are two sides to every pancake.'

But don't let any of this stop the circus.

Sorry but now that video has been released we all can now say we are there.

We can see what happened and it doesn't match up with any of the stories.

For someone that keeps saying you don't know what happened or can't speculate you sure have done a ton of both.

Paging a spin doctor in aisle 4.

[Bowhntr4life]

Originally Posted by wags

And video evidence, and words spoken by the individual....

Originally Posted by Bowhntr4life

You're absolutely right. Hopefully my comments have brought some light to the situation, but none of us know for sure... Including me.

It's hard to stand united as passionate outdoorsman when the truth is so difficult to discern. For that reason, I have nothing else to add.

I hope that when we do need to stand together on important issues for Albertans and outdoorsman... WE DO!!!

Sorry, I meant to quote the following:

The only facts we have are that,
a father is dead, and

None of us were there.

We are forming conclusions and judgments based on speculation,
and information from people with 'self interest',
all of whom are probably willing to lie.

'There are two sides to every pancake.'

But don't let any of this stop the circus.

__________________
~Men and fish are alike. They both get into trouble when they open their mouths.~

[Mb-MBR]

Do not want to want to speak ill of the dead but the immortal words of Mike Tyson reminds of this when he ......................"evey body got a plan till you punch them in the mouth".

Some would argue he followed through with his plan and others would say he didn't.....Should have planned better are my thoughts.

[Bowhntr4life]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

Sorry but now that video has been released we all can now say we are there.

We can see what happened and it doesn't match up with any of the stories.

For someone that keeps saying you don't know what happened or can't speculate you sure have done a ton of both.

Paging a spin doctor in aisle 4.

I'll agree with you on that to some degree. Good to hear both sides of the equation regardless and my opinion is definitely adding to the speculation, as admitted earlier.

I appreciate your humour regardless. Thanks for the laugh!

[Bowhntr4life]

Originally Posted by Mb-MBR

Do not want to want to speak ill of the dead but the immortal words of Mike Tyson reminds of this when he ......................"evey body got a plan till you punch them in the mouth".

Some would argue he followed through with his plan and others would say he didn't.....Should have planned better are my thoughts.

I will say my opinion hasn't changed much on the circumstances of this shooting. I still want the the full truth...and the video footage is only half the story. We can haggle this to death. It comes down to who we trust. Do we need trust the government, the media, the family, etc. If you fully trust the media, you're fools! The media is always owned by someone and it's often in bed with government officials running the show to control the agenda. I'm not running from a fight when a winner is impossible to declare because it's subject to opinion. That's when you must realize it's best to just stop fighting period because you're wasting energy.

I've dealt with the US government my whole life and my experience makes it difficult to trust them as I've watched them screw everyone in my family in various ways... And no, I've never ONCE asked for a handout from the US government, so lets not even go there. That's an entirely different can of worms.

Cheers!

[TBD]

Originally Posted by Bowhntr4life

If you fully trust the media, you're fools! The media is always owned by someone and it's often in bed with government officials running the show to control the agenda.

Why did Canada's MSM hate Harper - he wouldn't play their Game.

Watch in the coming years as they condition the gen pop for liberal gov't policy change - watch to see where the next governor general appt comes from - if it's an EX CBC hack you know the fix is in.

TBD


PS ... take a look at gov't communications and media expenditures even at the municipal level it's staggering what they spend.

[qwert]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

Sorry but now that video has been released we all can now say we are there.

We can see what happened and it doesn't match up with any of the stories.

For someone that keeps saying you don't know what happened or can't speculate you sure have done a ton of both.
snip

Video can be easily edited, Photoshopped and GCIed, by those with the resources.

We see what we want to see.

Even eye-witness testimony is notoriously unreliable.

I admit that 'I don't know what happened', because "I was not there".

I have not speculated about anything, and am not about to start now.

What I do believe is that "in any conflict, the first casualty is truth".
I doubt we will ever get any truth, or proof.

Just like 'we see what we want to see', and 'we believe what we want to believe',
or more accurately,
we continue to believe what 'cognitive dissonance' and 'confirmation bias' allows us to.

The Paradox of Fools And Wise Men
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves,
and wise people so full of doubts.” - Bertrand Russell

He also said, "I am not prepared to die for my beliefs, because I might be wrong."

[Unregistered user]

Originally Posted by winged1

Americans are armed in this case because they are radicals. No one wanted them there. The were looking for a fight and they found one. The more Americans that carry guns to thier protests, the more people die.

The British said the same thing 250 years ago which is the reason the U.S. constitution was written the way it was, to protect the people from going down the road to hell they are currently travelling. Americans regard themselves as citizens of their country not subjects of a ruler as Canadians and other Brit-inspired people around the world do. It's hard to judge from afar.

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by Bowhntr4life

Americans are armed in this case because they fear their government and know they'll overstep their bounds. If the NDP were doing something similar here in Alberta and it was legal to bear arms on such land and we were the victims, I guarantee most of us would be armed; not because we have violent intentions, but because we know corruption will not provide justice.

Oh give me a break. If the majority of people were so scared of our government they had to carry guns to protect themselves in this country they'd leave.

If this truck was being shot at you'd think one of the bullets would hit the back window ....

There's a lot of apologies for the actions of these people. I wonder if the tinfoil mafia was for or against Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown or Tamir Rice.

[Donkey Oatey]

Originally Posted by qwert

Video can be easily edited, Photoshopped and GCIed, by those with the resources.

You lose all credibility with one single sentence.

Invest in tin foil. Demand is going to drive the price through the roof.

[Bowhntr4life]

[QUOTE=fitzy;3124822]Oh give me a break. If the majority of people were so scared of our government they had to carry guns to protect themselves in this country they'd leave]

You're right, in Canada they would. In the US, where would they leave to? Their closest options with similar culture is Canada and Australia.

I LOVE Canada, but I'm a hardcore outdoorsman that embraces horrible weather. Most Americans don't feel that way nor would they ever consider leaving because they're still happy and the alternatives, in their eyes, aren't any better.

A family who is renting a decent home from a sucky landlord is generally willing to deal with the Landlord as long as the family is generally happy. Distrust in the government is shared by the majority south of the border, but the Pro's of living in the US outweigh their distrust in the Government.

As long as they continue to feel that way, that's less people flocking into Canada, which I think all Albertans are ok with.

[Crankbait]

after they shoot finn, they keep shooting the vehicle. was finn alone or with others? watch the footage on enlarged version and watch the vehicle, it's definitely being shot. and don't fast forward, watch it all. I wonder if the meeting was a ruse to get them going up the immaculately clean road???

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAGxDWKrjPQ

edit: yes there are others surrendering in the rest of the vid, posted the vid before it finished.

[Purple Farmer]

If that video is genuine and unedited, Leo shoots him in the back and no attempt to triage, well if Yatim was attempted murder, so is this.

[avb3]

Originally Posted by Purple Farmer

If that video is genuine and unedited, Leo shoots him in the back and no attempt to triage, well if Yatim was attempted murder, so is this.

Huh?

Triage with a truck full of terrorists that are armed? Maybe you would be so inclined, but pal, you'd be on your own.

And it was clear in the frame by frame that the terrorist reached for something in the area his holster was. Twice even.

Dumb terrorist!

[albertadeer]

How hard is it to lay down with your hands spread out?


Seems like simple logic, you don't want to get shot? Lay down hands out...

[Crankbait]

Originally Posted by Purple Farmer

If that video is genuine and unedited, Leo shoots him in the back and no attempt to triage, well if Yatim was attempted murder, so is this.

it appears medical help for fin happens after the others exit the vehicle. the footage is from the fbi youtube page. though I guess anyone can name themselves fbi, not sure why.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by Bowhntr4life

I will say my opinion hasn't changed much on the circumstances of this shooting. I still want the the full truth...and the video footage is only half the story. We can haggle this to death. It comes down to who we trust. Do we need trust the government, the media, the family, etc. If you fully trust the media, you're fools! The media is always owned by someone and it's often in bed with government officials running the show to control the agenda. I'm not running from a fight when a winner is impossible to declare because it's subject to opinion. That's when you must realize it's best to just stop fighting period because you're wasting energy.

I've dealt with the US government my whole life and my experience makes it difficult to trust them as I've watched them screw everyone in my family in various ways... And no, I've never ONCE asked for a handout from the US government, so lets not even go there. That's an entirely different can of worms.

Cheers!

I for one am curious about how many family members you deem wronged by the US government and a description of each.

"For the stories shall set us free"

[Purple Farmer]

Originally Posted by avb3

Huh?

Triage with a truck full of terrorists that are armed? Maybe you would be so inclined, but pal, you'd be on your own.

And it was clear in the frame by frame that the terrorist reached for something in the area his holster was. Twice even.

Dumb terrorist!

in the area his holster was? Terrorist? Read my post again and go have a snickers, I have no dog in this fight, but, it appears you need to be right.

[avb3]

Originally Posted by Purple Farmer

in the area his holster was? Terrorist? Read my post again and go have a snickers, I have no dog in this fight, but, it appears you need to be right.

Yup, anyone who takes over a government building and is armed, who says on national TV that he won't be taken alive, I consider a terrorist.

[Sundancefisher]

[QUOTE=Bowhntr4life;3125175]

Originally Posted by fitzy

Oh give me a break. If the majority of people were so scared of our government they had to carry guns to protect themselves in this country they'd leave]

You're right, in Canada they would. In the US, where would they leave to? Their closest options with similar culture is Canada and Australia.

I LOVE Canada, but I'm a hardcore outdoorsman that embraces horrible weather. Most Americans don't feel that way nor would they ever consider leaving because they're still happy and the alternatives, in their eyes, aren't any better.

A family who is renting a decent home from a sucky landlord is generally willing to deal with the Landlord as long as the family is generally happy. Distrust in the government is shared by the majority south of the border, but the Pro's of living in the US outweigh their distrust in the Government.

As long as they continue to feel that way, that's less people flocking into Canada, which I think all Albertans are ok with.

It is true "trust" in the government is way down.

http://www.people-press.org/2015/11/...ent-1958-2015/

However the trust people talk about is trust:

1. To run the economy
2. To handle international relations
3. To combat terrorism
4. To not partisan bicker
5. To put running a good country first

Etc.

The trust you elude to is to not:

1. turn on the people
2. Destroy democracy
3. Take away constitutional rights

Etc

The latter is not what the majority think is happening.

The conspiracy theorist, wing nuts and fanatics and those that oppose laws they feel are unfair to them personally are the only believers from what I have seen and read.

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by Purple Farmer

If that video is genuine and unedited, Leo shoots him in the back and no attempt to triage, well if Yatim was attempted murder, so is this.

I respectfully disagree. He's shot as he's turning back and forth moving his hand towards what has been reported to be a loaded 9mm. Of course no triage this group stated on TV their intentions if guns were involved. Once everybody was in custody he was seen too.

If he stands still hands up there's no problems.

[TrueGrit]

They shot him in the back with a 308 his hands where up and they shot him with a bean bag so when he reached down ,which is a normal reaction to touch the spot where there is pain that was when they murdered him ,truely unbeleivable whats going on ,this land is going to china and russia that is being taken away BLM corruption

[deerguy]

Originally Posted by avb3

Huh?

Triage with a truck full of terrorists that are armed? Maybe you would be so inclined, but pal, you'd be on your own.

And it was clear in the frame by frame that the terrorist reached for something in the area his holster was. Twice even.

Dumb terrorist!

Originally Posted by avb3

Yup, anyone who takes over a government building and is armed, who says on national TV that he won't be taken alive, I consider a terrorist.

You just make up your own definitions to further your sick and twisted left wing agenda? How do you walk up right having no spine? Must be a medical phenomenon

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by TrueGrit

They shot him in the back with a 308 his hands where up and they shot him with a bean bag so when he reached down ,which is a normal reaction to touch the spot where there is pain that was when they murdered him ,truely unbeleivable whats going on ,this land is going to china and russia that is being taken away BLM corruption

Really??? And where did you pull this info from? How far out was the 308? Have you seen a deer get shot before? A 308 in the back puts him on his face in the snow.
What's really unbelievable is what some of you guys in the tinfoil mafia will buy into to further your conspiracy theories

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by deerguy

You just make up your own definitions to further your sick and twisted left wing agenda? How do you walk up right having no spine? Must be a medical phenomenon

Look it up. That group is the definition of domestic terrorist. They could could have very easily left all their guns at home. Everybody is safe.

[deerguy]

Originally Posted by fitzy

Look it up. That group is the definition of domestic terrorist. They could could have very easily left all their guns at home. Everybody is safe.

They are legally allowed to carry firearms tho, no different then you carrying keys or a wallet. And no, this group is not the definition of domestic terrorist. You can't just stare something that is blatantly wrong and expect others to go with it.