Shooting steel shot threw an old style fixed choke

[-JR-]

I have a chance to buy a 1983 Browning over and under 12 gauge with a full choke for $800. Gun only had 3 boxes go threw it.

I can only see this gun being used for water fowl hunts where only steal can be used.

I have read that doing this will damage the choke.

Any shooters out there that shot steel shot out of an older full choke barrel ?
Did it do any damage ? How many rounds did it take ?

[huntinstuff]

I would get it changed to modified

The things that are common are a bulge near the last 3" of the barrel or an actual fracture.

Get it opened up. A good gunsmith can do it.

Trying to constrict steel with a steel barrel is normally a poor idea. You could cause the barrels to separate in an o/u.

[Frank_NK28]

A competent gunsmith will open that up for you for around $60-$100 per barrel...have it opened to M in one barrel and IC in the other and you'll have a real winning combo! By the way the old Browning O/U's(Standard Field Grade Citori) with fixed choke barrels usually fetch $600-$900 depending on condition for that reason alone. The fixed chokes make them undesirable to many hunters. At $800 it's not a steal by any means and for what it will cost you to have the barrels opened up you could buy a newer used model with screw chokes for about the same money you'll spend buying this gun and having it altered to accept steel shot.

[Smokinyotes]

I had a Ithaca skb 500 o/u 12ga. When steel shot became mandatory I took my Ithaca to wholesale sports when it was on 97st. They told me I would bulge the barrel with steel shot so I traded it off on a LH 1187. Knowing what I know now I really wished I’d kept my Ithaca and just had the choke opened up to modified.

[fps plus]

The Ithaca (SKB) have chrome lined barrels that pose another issue for opening up chokes. One needs to deal with the chrome by using a special reamer or removing the chrome before reaming .

[KegRiver]

When Steel shot came out I was spending a lot of time working bush camps and wasn't able to keep abreast of the latest news.

First fall I bought a couple of boxes of ammo for my shotgun and went hunting.
After the hunt was over I discovered the the barrel had bulged just behind the choke. I thought the barrel was weak.

I didn't have internet access at the time so it wasn't until a few years later when I did and then I learned that steel shot could do that to a shotgun.
Alas, in the mean time a sweet little 20 gauge double suffered the same fate.

[-JR-]

Thanks keg ,this was the answer I was looking for .

[dgl1948]

When steel came out I called Browning and talked to one of their fellows about using steel in my Citori. The response I got was go ahead and shoot it, you will be fine. I never did but I had it opened up and use Briley thin wall chokes in it.

[Dewey Cox]

Keep it as is and use it for upland and trap.
If you want a waterfowl gun, buy a waterfowl gun.

Edit:
I'm not saying don't buy it.
Buy it.
If you don't like it, sell it to me...

[waldedw]

NO don't shoot steel through it the way it is you WILL damage the barrels as the full chokes are to tight for steel, as I see it you have 3 choices here, buy it and use it for shooting a few clays and for upland birds where lead shot is allowed and then get yourself a waterfowl gun.

2nd choice is to buy it and have the barrels opened up to IC/M or M/M that will set you back an additional couple hundred bucks, and the thing is if it's not done absolutely correctly it could throw your POI out by a substantial amount, I personally know a fellow that had it done to an old Winchester pump and his shot pattern ended up 24" to the left at 35 yards.

3rd choice is don't buy it and look for one with factory choke tubes that you can use for whatever you like.

Let us know the outcome.

[North40Rules]

Originally Posted by waldedw

NO don't shoot steel through it the way it is you WILL damage the barrels as the full chokes are to tight for steel, as I see it you have 3 choices here, buy it and use it for shooting a few clays and for upland birds where lead shot is allowed and then get yourself a waterfowl gun.

2nd choice is to buy it and have the barrels opened up to IC/M or M/M that will set you back an additional couple hundred bucks, and the thing is if it's not done absolutely correctly it could throw your POI out by a substantial amount, I personally know a fellow that had it done to an old Winchester pump and his shot pattern ended up 24" to the left at 35 yards.

3rd choice is don't buy it and look for one with factory choke tubes that you can use for whatever you like.

Let us know the outcome.

Ed, in your opinion, what is the best type of shot to shoot through a Full Choke these days?

Thanks N40

[waldedw]

Originally Posted by North40Rules

Ed, in your opinion, what is the best type of shot to shoot through a Full Choke these days?

Thanks N40

Just my humble opinion and I am not a expert by any means but through a full choke I would only shoot lead shot, and I would not shoot steel through anything tighter than a M choke, my Beretta Optima HP chokes that are IM and F are stamped NO STEEL the C,IC,LM and M chokes are stamped OK STEEL same with Benelli chokes.

I know there are chokes out there that are designated F and are OK for steel but if you put a caliper on them you will see that they are no where near as tight as the old F chokes and very close in fact to a M choke constriction.

Rule of thumb is that a choke designated as M for lead will be F for steel, as I said before we shoot over decoys and I use an IC choke with steel shot, I used and M a couple times but it really chews up the birds if they are inside 30 yards

I know there is other shot out there tungsten, bismuth etc but I am not familiar with them or their properties so can't comment if they are OK to shoot in an old style F choke, I have never shot them primarily because they are $70 a box and I refuse to pay that for waterfowl ammo.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by waldedw

Just my humble opinion and I am not a expert by any means but through a full choke I would only shoot lead shot, and I would not shoot steel through anything tighter than a M choke, my Beretta Optima HP chokes that are IM and F are stamped NO STEEL the C,IC,LM and M chokes are stamped OK STEEL same with Benelli chokes.

I know there are chokes out there that are designated F and are OK for steel but if you put a caliper on them you will see that they are no where near as tight as the old F chokes and very close in fact to a M choke constriction.

Rule of thumb is that a choke designated as M for lead will be F for steel, as I said before we shoot over decoys and I use an IC choke with steel shot, I used and M a couple times but it really chews up the birds if they are inside 30 yards

I know there is other shot out there tungsten, bismuth etc but I am not familiar with them or their properties so can't comment if they are OK to shoot in an old style F choke, I have never shot them primarily because they are $70 a box and I refuse to pay that for waterfowl ammo.

Bismuth is fine in a full choke, I use it for sharptail at Camp Waimwright, and it behaves very similar to lead. It is expensive, but a box lasts me multiple years at Camp Wainwright.

[North40Rules]

Originally Posted by waldedw

Just my humble opinion and I am not a expert by any means but through a full choke I would only shoot lead shot, and I would not shoot steel through anything tighter than a M choke, my Beretta Optima HP chokes that are IM and F are stamped NO STEEL the C,IC,LM and M chokes are stamped OK STEEL same with Benelli chokes.

I know there are chokes out there that are designated F and are OK for steel but if you put a caliper on them you will see that they are no where near as tight as the old F chokes and very close in fact to a M choke constriction.

Rule of thumb is that a choke designated as M for lead will be F for steel, as I said before we shoot over decoys and I use an IC choke with steel shot, I used and M a couple times but it really chews up the birds if they are inside 30 yards

I know there is other shot out there tungsten, bismuth etc but I am not familiar with them or their properties so can't comment if they are OK to shoot in an old style F choke, I have never shot them primarily because they are $70 a box and I refuse to pay that for waterfowl ammo.

So you use steel while duck and goose hunting?

[waldedw]

Originally Posted by North40Rules

So you use steel while duck and goose hunting?

Yes of course, steel is mandatory for migratory birds or tungsten or bismuth

[North40Rules]

Originally Posted by waldedw

Yes of course, steel is mandatory for migratory birds or tungsten or bismuth

Which in your opinion has more knockdown power between the three and which one most resembles lead?

I have not used tungsten or bismuth yet.

[catnthehat]

I hand load either Bismuth or Nice Shot in my vintage doubles, several of them are very tightly choked .
I also use ITX but it is very expensive candy hard to get now.
Of all the different shot available, I much prefer Bismuth over any of them.

I have no problem killing geese and ducks over decoys with it even on my muzzle loaders.
It does get expensive, but factory steel, Hevi Shot. Or multi metal ammo is not cheap either .
I don't have to worry about old guns choked for load when I use Bismuth.
Cat

[ward]

Originally Posted by North40Rules

Which in your opinion has more knockdown power between the three and which one most resembles lead?

I have not used tungsten or bismuth yet.

Kent’s tungsten matrix is the closest to lead as far as density. It works very well. Just very expensive.

[ward]

Originally Posted by dgl1948

When steel came out I called Browning and talked to one of their fellows about using steel in my Citori. The response I got was go ahead and shoot it, you will be fine. I never did but I had it opened up and use Briley thin wall chokes in it.

Briley thin walls is the way to go with the old fixed choke Brownings. The nice handling of the thin barrels with the versatility of a multi choke gun.

Just checked the price on Briley’s homepage. $600 US plus some shipping charges gets you five thin wall chokes. Pretty much the cost of the gun.

[North40Rules]

Originally Posted by ward

Kent’s tungsten matrix is the closest to lead as far as density. It works very well. Just very expensive.

Just checked it our $68.00 for a box of 10 rounds, $6.80 per shell shipping not included, I pay $1.50 per shell for my .30-06.

So basically 1 Costco BBQ chicken per shell

Crazy!

[David Henry]

Since the arrival of steel shot for waterfowl hunting (about 30 years now) I have altered many barrels. I have also collected a few samples of barrels that were never opened up for steel and were damaged as a result, mostly double barreled guns.
As a rule the full choke should be reamed to no more restriction than modified or half choke and preferably to Improved or quarter choke. The forcing cone just ahead of the chamber can be quite abrupt from some manufacturers and this should be slightly advanced and tapered at the same time.
Some full choke barrels after years of use with steel show no signs of expansion and others measure differently with a visible swell toward the muzzle. My guess would be that the harder the composition of the barrel steel the better it is to resist the column of steel shot traveling through the choke section.
If I was faced with the dilemma of taking a nice Browning Citori field gun and irreversibly changing it just to shoot a few boxes of steel in the fall at ducks and such I would hesitate and consider my options. I think I would purchase one of the more modern shotguns with a barrel or barrels that were manufactured with overbore dimensions and interchangeable chokes with a 3 1/2" chamber. Something with a soft touch comb, good recoil pad, plastic stock covered with your choice of camouflage pattern. My understanding is that such a shotgun can be found for a fairly reasonable price depending on your budget, and you will still be able to show up for a pheasant shoot with your Citori under your arm and it will hold it's value for years to come in it's unaltered state. D.H.

[CMichaud]

Originally Posted by David Henry

Since the arrival of steel shot for waterfowl hunting (about 30 years now) I have altered many barrels. I have also collected a few samples of barrels that were never opened up for steel and were damaged as a result, mostly double barreled guns.
As a rule the full choke should be reamed to no more restriction than modified or half choke and preferably to Improved or quarter choke. The forcing cone just ahead of the chamber can be quite abrupt from some manufacturers and this should be slightly advanced and tapered at the same time.
Some full choke barrels after years of use with steel show no signs of expansion and others measure differently with a visible swell toward the muzzle. My guess would be that the harder the composition of the barrel steel the better it is to resist the column of steel shot traveling through the choke section.
If I was faced with the dilemma of taking a nice Browning Citori field gun and irreversibly changing it just to shoot a few boxes of steel in the fall at ducks and such I would hesitate and consider my options. I think I would purchase one of the more modern shotguns with a barrel or barrels that were manufactured with overbore dimensions and interchangeable chokes with a 3 1/2" chamber. Something with a soft touch comb, good recoil pad, plastic stock covered with your choice of camouflage pattern. My understanding is that such a shotgun can be found for a fairly reasonable price depending on your budget, and you will still be able to show up for a pheasant shoot with your Citori under your arm and it will hold it's value for years to come in it's unaltered state. D.H.

David - hope I am not hijacking but would you consider a wing master magnum with FF a good candidate for opening up or adding removable chokes to?

Brand new Remington barrels seem to be unobtanium now

Appreciate your experience - thanks

[fps plus]

One can modify a fixed choke 870 bbl to accept removable chokes

[dgl1948]

Originally Posted by ward

Briley thin walls is the way to go with the old fixed choke Brownings. The nice handling of the thin barrels with the versatility of a multi choke gun.

Just checked the price on Briley’s homepage. $600 US plus some shipping charges gets you five thin wall chokes. Pretty much the cost of the gun.

Yikes. When I had mine done years ago the thin walls were priced right in line with all the others.

[David Henry]

Opening up a Remington 870 Magnum full choke barrel to accept steel shot would make sense in my books. Older 870's measure a smaller O.D. at the muzzle than the new barrels with removable choke tubes which limits the options for choke tube installation. I used to install Colonial Arms thin wall tubes in these older barrels and as previously mentioned Briley has some skinny tubes that will work out as well. D.H.

[CMichaud]

Originally Posted by David Henry

Opening up a Remington 870 Magnum full choke barrel to accept steel shot would make sense in my books. Older 870's measure a smaller O.D. at the muzzle than the new barrels with removable choke tubes which limits the options for choke tube installation. I used to install Colonial Arms thin wall tubes in these older barrels and as previously mentioned Briley has some skinny tubes that will work out as well. D.H.

Thanks!

[Apatrickson]

I have a Remington 1100 with a fixed full choke and would like to get it reamed out so that I can use it for waterfowl, however I haven’t been able to find a gunsmith who is willing to do it, does anybody know of some that would or have done it for you in the past. Thanks

[catnthehat]

Pretty sure Rod Hendrickson is still doing chokes, or you could mail the barrel down to fps plus and he could do it
Cat