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View Poll Results: 308 win vs 7mm rem mag
308 win 119 45.08%
7mm rem mag 145 54.92%
Voters: 264. You may not vote on this poll

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  #31  
Old 10-07-2021, 09:50 AM
obsessed1 obsessed1 is online now
 
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Originally Posted by Brbpuppy View Post
What makes it far from being efficient at sub 300 yards?
With a premium bullet going down in weight makes lots of sense. Because of case capacity the 308 pushes a 180 a bit slower than ideal for both drop and energy. A 165 or even 150 premium bullet such as a partition will perform just as well and penetrate just as deep..you just get much better exterior ballistics along with it because of the added velocity.
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  #32  
Old 10-07-2021, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Dean2 View Post
You are incorrect. Two 150 grain bullets with a muzzle velocity of 3000 fps have exactly the same killing power, at least to 300 yards, regardless of caliber. The slightly better B.C. and S.D. of the 7mm will make zero difference to 300 yards. Deer, elk, moose or bear, the 7mm does NOT kill better under 300 yards.
I said at range,meaning beyond 300 yds.Better to have the extra when, and if you need it rather than not. Having said that the 308 is a capable cartridge.
I can easily get 3200 in my 7mm with hand loads.
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  #33  
Old 10-07-2021, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Brbpuppy View Post
What makes it far from being efficient at sub 300 yards?
SNS2 stated that 180s are not the MOST efficient. I agree. There are better all- around choices for a 308 than 180 gr. bullets. Under 300 yds, not much difference no matter what you use, other than paying more $$ for heavier bullets. 165s or even 150s shoot flatter past that and likely expand more on impact. More mv, less recoil also.
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Last edited by gunluvr; 10-07-2021 at 10:21 AM.
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  #34  
Old 10-07-2021, 10:17 AM
Brbpuppy Brbpuppy is offline
 
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Originally Posted by gunluvr View Post
There are better all- around choices for a 308 than 180 gr. bullets. Under 300 yds, not much difference no matter what you use, other than paying more $$ for heavier bullets. 165s or even 150s shoot flatter past that and likely expand more on impact. More mv, less recoil also.
I wasn't aware of the lighter bullets being more likely to expand more at longer distances, very interesting. Well for under 300 yards, looks like I'm okay either way
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  #35  
Old 10-07-2021, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Brbpuppy View Post
I wasn't aware of the lighter bullets being more likely to expand more at longer distances, very interesting. Well for under 300 yards, looks like I'm okay either way
Due to higher velocity and deeper penatration.
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  #36  
Old 10-07-2021, 10:41 AM
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So much partially true info. Expansion and velocity are a factor but Bullet construction and design is huge and a far bigger factor. Even Barnes Solid Copper bullets have different expansion characteristics with the LRX expanding at lower velocities than the TSX. With the Nosler you will be just fine, but I do agree that 150 is the sweet spot for the 308 with Partition or Cup and Core bullets, LRX etc. Under 300 yards however the 180 grai nwill be just fine.

Just to be clear, Nosler designs every Partition bullet, regardless of caliber and/or weight, so that it demonstrates this expansion profile. The only question is, does the cartridge you are shooting provide these velocity profiles at the ranges you intend to hunt.



  • Nosler’s special lead-alloy, dual-core

    Provides superior mushrooming characteristics at virtually all impact velocities.
  • Fully Tapered Copper-Alloy Jacket

    Ruptures instantly at the thin jacket mouth, yet the gradual thickening along the bullet’s axis controls expansion and curls the jacket uniformly outward at high and low velocities.
  • Nosler’s Integral Partition

    Supports the expanded mushroom and retains the rear lead-alloy core. The enclosed rear core retains more than two-thirds of the original bullet weight for deep penetration.
  • Nosler® Partition® Bullet

    Every Partition® bullet in the Nosler® line delivers optimum length, weight and ogive design for maximum in-flight and terminal performance.
  • Special Crimp Locks

    Add strength to resist deformation under the pressure of heavy magnums.

Game Recommendations

Moose
Elk
Bear

OPTIMUM PERFORMANCE VELOCITY

1800 fps
2400 fps
3050 fps




Last edited by Dean2; 10-07-2021 at 11:10 AM.
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  #37  
Old 10-07-2021, 11:12 AM
Brbpuppy Brbpuppy is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Dean2 View Post
So much partially true info. Expansion and velocity are a factor but Bullet construction and design is huge and a far bigger factor. Even Barnes Solid Copper bullets have different expansion characteristics with the LRX expanding at lower velocities than the TSX. With the Nosler you will be just fine, but I do agree that 150 is the sweet spot for the 308 with Partition or Cup and Core bullets, LRX etc. Under 300 yards however the 180 grai nwill be just fine.

Just to be clear, Nosler designs every Partition bullet, regardless of caliber and/or weight, so that it demonstrates this expansion profile. The only question is, does the cartridge you are shooting provide these velocity profiles at the ranges you intend to hunt.



  • Nosler’s special lead-alloy, dual-core

    Provides superior mushrooming characteristics at virtually all impact velocities.
  • Fully Tapered Copper-Alloy Jacket

    Ruptures instantly at the thin jacket mouth, yet the gradual thickening along the bullet’s axis controls expansion and curls the jacket uniformly outward at high and low velocities.
  • Nosler’s Integral Partition

    Supports the expanded mushroom and retains the rear lead-alloy core. The enclosed rear core retains more than two-thirds of the original bullet weight for deep penetration.
  • Nosler® Partition® Bullet

    Every Partition® bullet in the Nosler® line delivers optimum length, weight and ogive design for maximum in-flight and terminal performance.
  • Special Crimp Locks

    Add strength to resist deformation under the pressure of heavy magnums.

Game Recommendations

Moose
Elk
Bear

OPTIMUM PERFORMANCE VELOCITY

1800 fps
2400 fps
3050 fps




Thank you for posting this.
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  #38  
Old 10-07-2021, 01:08 PM
JD848 JD848 is offline
 
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For me to ask anyone which i should take regardless of bullet choice has to up to the shooter, shot what you feel the best with and enjoy shooting and shoot the best .

No one could tell me which rifle i like best out to 300 or 100 or 500,totally up to me to learn and shoot both and then make that choice.

Many guys can shoot a 308 and 7mm RM very well or countless other cartridges. Killing out to 300 can be done with countless cartridges also.

Some can't shoot either well also ,so it's up to the one shooter to decide way before a hunt on which rifle or bullet choice, that is only ethical on the shooters part.

If you can't decide or don't know how to decide then think it all over.

Your the guy pulling that trigger, so stay in your comfort zone.

Enjoy your hunt

JD

Last edited by JD848; 10-07-2021 at 01:19 PM.
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  #39  
Old 10-07-2021, 01:19 PM
Brbpuppy Brbpuppy is offline
 
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Originally Posted by JD848 View Post
For me to ask anyone which i should take regardless of bullet choice has to up to the shooter, shot what you feel the best with and enjoy shooting and shoot the best .

No one could tell me which rifle i like best out to 300 or 100 or 500,totally up to me to learn and shoot both and then make that choice.

Many guys can shoot a 308 and 7mm RM very well or countless other cartridges. Killing out to 300 can be done with countless cartridges also.

Some can't shoot either well also ,so it's up to the one shooter to decide way before a hunt on which rifle or bullet choice, that is only ethical on the shooters part.

If you can't decide or know how to decide then think it all over.

Your the guy pulling that trigger, so stay in your comfort zone.

Enjoy your hunt

JD

Well said, thank you brother
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  #40  
Old 10-07-2021, 04:25 PM
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I’ve had several 7mm Mags over the years. They all worked very well and for killing at long distances it outshines a lot of other cartridges like the .308. Less than 300 though and it would be an either/or scenario for me but I’d probably have to lean to the .308. I wouldn’t own a 20” barrelled 7Mag because it would cut the potential for that cartridge down at long range, but a 20” barrelled .308 is a nice handy gun for under 300 yards.
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  #41  
Old 10-07-2021, 10:33 PM
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Yeah but the 7mm is a "MAGNUM" ..... if you hit it in the hoof, the heart explodes right out of it and all living creatures within 10 yards will feint from the concussion of the magnum blast.

Non-Magnums can't do that.
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  #42  
Old 10-07-2021, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by EZM View Post
Yeah but the 7mm is a "MAGNUM" ..... if you hit it in the hoof, the heart explodes right out of it and all living creatures within 10 yards will feint from the concussion of the magnum blast.

Non-Magnums can't do that.
A 6.5 Creedmoor can do that too!
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  #43  
Old 10-07-2021, 11:32 PM
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I'd use the seven iron.
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  #44  
Old 10-07-2021, 11:46 PM
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All that really matters is which rifle you're more comfortable shooting and which you shoot well. No questioning which hits harder with same bullet type in similar grains at the same yardage. Up to you if you think these things matter.

Ones a lot cheaper to shoot and performs better in semi auto rifles though so there's always that.
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  #45  
Old 10-08-2021, 09:35 AM
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Originally Posted by EZM View Post
Yeah but the 7mm is a "MAGNUM" ..... if you hit it in the hoof, the heart explodes right out of it and all living creatures within 10 yards will feint from the concussion of the magnum blast.

Non-Magnums can't do that.
The 7mm Remington Magnum is what it is and the 308 cannot compete with it ballistically on any level. Is it a practical advantage out to 300 yards on an Elk? Probably not. But there is a difference.
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  #46  
Old 10-08-2021, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by fordtruckin View Post
I had a 7mag and sold it. Was never a fan of it. My personal opinion is for the small gain in velocity and energy you pay for it in recoil, the necessity to have a longer barrel to actually benefit from the extra powder and of course the cost being a magnum. For me personally it doesn’t make it worthwhile to own one. Now I hunt only with a .308 and have not had any issues. For the animals you mentioned a .308 will be more than adequate no point beating yourself up with a magnum and carrying the longer barrel to get the same results. Of course that’s my opinion only.

What he said . Sold my 7mm years ago and now my only 2 big game rifles are both in 308.
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  #47  
Old 10-08-2021, 08:34 PM
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I had a 7mag and sold it. Was never a fan of it. My personal opinion is for the small gain in velocity and energy you pay for it in recoil, the necessity to have a longer barrel to actually benefit from the extra powder and of course the cost being a magnum. For me personally it doesn’t make it worthwhile to own one. Now I hunt only with a .308 and have not had any issues. For the animals you mentioned a .308 will be more than adequate no point beating yourself up with a magnum and carrying the longer barrel to get the same results. Of course that’s my opinion only.

Kinda meh. My 7mm's don't kick any harder than my 270's but rifle brand, stock style, weight and fit has everything to do with it. 7RM, 30-06 and 270wsm recoil is a wash with 270 and 308 a pound or 2 less all shooting similar loads.

Only 7mm recoil that ever made me pay attn was a TIKKA T3 and I'd never own one in anything over 6.5 for that reason. Just horrible considering 7mm is still a decently mild recoil.

7STW is a whole different breed of course. Best of the 7's imo.
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  #48  
Old 10-08-2021, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by 270person View Post
Kinda meh. My 7mm's don't kick any harder than my 270's but rifle brand, stock style, weight and fit has everything to do with it. 7RM, 30-06 and 270wsm recoil is a wash with 270 and 308 a pound or 2 less all shooting similar loads.

Only 7mm recoil that ever made me pay attn was a TIKKA T3 and I'd never own one in anything over 6.5 for that reason. Just horrible considering 7mm is still a decently mild recoil.

7STW is a whole different breed of course. Best of the 7's imo.
Agreed. I shot 7 rem mags for years because to me they kicked less than an 06 and about the same as a 270. I REALLY like the 7 rem mag, but it doesn't change the fact that under 300 yards the difference in performance is totally irrelevant. The reason I shot the 7 rem then the 7 ultra was because I was shooting stuff at 700 to 1200 yards. That is where u see the difference in bc and the performance that goes with it. That said u will not change my mind that at 300 and under the 308 is every bit as capable. I have been a big boomer fan my whole life, including loving the 375 and the 460 Bee, but I still fully understand how little the relative performance differences matter at normal hunting ranges for most hunters and the easier to shoot guns are a far better idea for 90 percent of hunters. Very few people shoot enough to be better off with a magnum.
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  #49  
Old 10-08-2021, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Dean2 View Post
Agreed. I shot 7 rem mags for years because to me they kicked less than an 06 and about the same as a 270. I REALLY like the 7 rem mag, but it doesn't change the fact that under 300 yards the difference in performance is totally irrelevant. The reason I shot the 7 rem then the 7 ultra was because I was shooting stuff at 700 to 1200 yards. That is where u see the difference in bc and the performance that goes with it. That said u will not change my mind that at 300 and under the 308 is every bit as capable. I have been a big boomer fan my whole life, including loving the 375 and the 460 Bee, but I still fully understand how little the relative performance differences matter at normal hunting ranges for most hunters and the easier to shoot guns are a far better idea for 90 percent of hunters. Very few people shoot enough to be better off with a magnum.
Shoot "far" enough you mean?
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  #50  
Old 10-08-2021, 10:24 PM
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I'd go .308 just for the short action
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  #51  
Old 10-09-2021, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Dean2 View Post
Agreed. I shot 7 rem mags for years because to me they kicked less than an 06 and about the same as a 270. I REALLY like the 7 rem mag, but it doesn't change the fact that under 300 yards the difference in performance is totally irrelevant. The reason I shot the 7 rem then the 7 ultra was because I was shooting stuff at 700 to 1200 yards. That is where u see the difference in bc and the performance that goes with it. That said u will not change my mind that at 300 and under the 308 is every bit as capable. I have been a big boomer fan my whole life, including loving the 375 and the 460 Bee, but I still fully understand how little the relative performance differences matter at normal hunting ranges for most hunters and the easier to shoot guns are a far better idea for 90 percent of hunters. Very few people shoot enough to be better off with a magnum.
I agree 98%. I just prefer the 7mm cartridge and the extra oomph it offers at all yardages. I'm not concerned about the minor differences in recoil, powder usage, belt decoration, etc. Realistically speaking it might not kill thin skinned game any more effectively at the yardage being discussed but I feel more confident shooting mine so there I go.

No different than why I switch over to a .358 cartridge when hunting in grizz country. Might not be the perfect solution and I realize my 7's are capable, BUT, if I'm unlucky enough to be in a one shot max situation at inside 50 yds and it's chew or be chewed I want to at least provide a bigger headache for my dance partner. There's no questioning a 225-250 grain bullet at 25-2600 fps will do that.

Kinda like why Africa hunters use 375 Ouch and Ouches and bigger to shoot a spotted kitty out of a tree at 25 yards when a 30-06 would likely get the job done.
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  #52  
Old 10-09-2021, 10:46 AM
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Shoot "far" enough you mean?

No recognition for more energy and faster projectiles at all yardages my good man?
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  #53  
Old 10-13-2021, 09:13 AM
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If you havent bought the ammo for the 308 yet, a suggestion of 165 Partitions.
The increased velocity for a 165 vs the 180 will bring a flatter shooting round and more energy for your under 300yd shooting. An elk will not feel the difference. I put down a huge cow moose with 140 gr partitions with my 7x57, the 308 will work just fine.
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  #54  
Old 10-13-2021, 10:32 AM
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Bring both if possible , then you have a back up is something happens to one ,
I use 165 gr in my 308, shot moose , bear , deer, coyotes
I use 150 gr in 7mm , shot moose bear deer, for coyotes I use 120 gr
More than once I have lent my back up gun to other people when they have had a mishap
Last time the guy had his stock break in half , all though he didn’t shoot any thing, he could continue hunting for the rest of the trip with my spare gun
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  #55  
Old 10-13-2021, 10:53 AM
Brbpuppy Brbpuppy is offline
 
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Originally Posted by colt45 View Post
Bring both if possible , then you have a back up is something happens to one ,
I use 165 gr in my 308, shot moose , bear , deer, coyotes
I use 150 gr in 7mm , shot moose bear deer, for coyotes I use 120 gr
More than once I have lent my back up gun to other people when they have had a mishap
Last time the guy had his stock break in half , all though he didn’t shoot any thing, he could continue hunting for the rest of the trip with my spare gun
Not a bad idea, can always leave one at the cabin. How did your buddy manage to snap his stock in half? Was it plastic/polymer?
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  #56  
Old 10-13-2021, 07:43 PM
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I voted 308.
Based on everything you said, the confidence in what you’re shooting is key. It lacks nothing for the purposes you describe and you prefer it.
If you had no big game rifle and were looking for the better cartridge for elk, I’d lean towards 7 rem mag between those two, but would it really make much difference? Probably not
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  #57  
Old 10-13-2021, 09:57 PM
colt45 colt45 is online now
 
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Originally Posted by Brbpuppy View Post
Not a bad idea, can always leave one at the cabin. How did your buddy manage to snap his stock in half? Was it plastic/polymer?
It was a plastic polymer type
Too young guys were quadding one guy stopped , the other guy never and his quad hit the other guys gun sticking out the back of the quad and it snapped the stock
First guy was down in a dip and stopped and second quys quad front hit the stock
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  #58  
Old 10-14-2021, 11:06 AM
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I voted 308 but just take whichever you shoot better.
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  #59  
Old 10-14-2021, 01:13 PM
Brbpuppy Brbpuppy is offline
 
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Originally Posted by colt45 View Post
It was a plastic polymer type
Too young guys were quadding one guy stopped , the other guy never and his quad hit the other guys gun sticking out the back of the quad and it snapped the stock
First guy was down in a dip and stopped and second quys quad front hit the stock
Bad luck right there.

Oh dang, 7mm pulls ahead in the poll. I didn't think it would lol.
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  #60  
Old 10-14-2021, 01:36 PM
M.C. Gusto M.C. Gusto is offline
 
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Darn near every time i take another rifle besides my 300wsm i see a target well out of range of my ex. 7mm-08. So if your not strictly in bush and a 300 yard shot is possible take the 7mm.
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