For all you .375 H&H shooters

[albertacowboy]

I am saving up for a Winchester Model 70 Safari Express, and I wondered about using a sling on this rifle. I like to shoot with a sling as a steadying device, either a Model 1907 military sling or an Uncle mike's Mountain sling. I read somewhere that using a sling on a safari rifle with a barrel band swivel, as opposed to a forestock swivel as on a regular riflr, is a bad idea as it exerts abnormal pressure on the barrel and is detrimental to accuracy. This could be significant on the Model 70, which has a fully floated barrel. On the other hand, could the sling help tame recoil and muzzle rise?

I just wondered if any of you who shoot medium or big bore safari rifles like the Model 70 or Sako Kodiak have any ideas or experience on this point.

Many thanks,
Albertacowboy

[rugerparts]

There would be some detriment to accuracy using the sling the way you're describing but I wouldn't necessarily say you shouldn't. In real hunting conditions steadying your aim is far more important than barrel dynamics. That bullet packs one hell of a punch and a pretty good recoil. Steadying yourself and controlling your body while taking your shot will be important. My 375 A-bolt shoots 1" groups from the bench but as soon as I stand up I fall victim to the recoil and my grouping is worse than with my old 30-30. Still, even 3 or 4 inches off your target, most game round here will be doing back flips.

[silver]

A sling is a definite asset for shooting off hand.You will find warnings about the stock mounted sling, something about the stud cutting your forehand. My sling mounts to the stock and I havent had a problem. The barrel mounted sling might deflect the barrel a bit, but not enough to matter. Buy the rifle you want, use the sling and dont worry about it.

You could sight in your new rifle from the bench and then shoot a group with the sling and see if there is a change in the point of impact and then let us know.

[catnthehat]

Slings work, whether barrel mounted or stock mounted.
I loved using mine on the M70 I had in 375, and I use one on my Ruger single shot with a barrel band as well
The key to using them well is to use them properly and to practise using them at the range in field positions.......
Cat

[ShawnM]

Damn I wish I got that Mdl 70 Safari...

[silver]

Right now somebody is teasing me with a model 70 in 375, doesnt want to sell but will trade. All I know is that it is a model 70, I don't know if it is a safari grade or not. How much difference is there between standard and safari grade?

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by silver

Right now somebody is teasing me with a model 70 in 375, doesnt want to sell but will trade. All I know is that it is a model 70, I don't know if it is a safari grade or not. How much difference is there between standard and safari grade?

They don't make one in standard. Only Safari or Alaskan.

[PoppaW]

I would just put a sling stud in the forearm if it makes you shoot better. I have shot many bigbores with more recoil than the 375H&H and always have had studs in the stock. I have never been 'bit' by one yet.

Try it and see. Put stud in if its needed. They are cheap and easy to install.

[Big Daddy Badger]

I have a CZ 550 in 375 H&H.
I use a Vellini double sling... because the darn thing is heavy and I have buggered my shoulders. In fact... that sling goes on pretty much everything now..

Otherwise I do not find the recoil that bad i don't use sissy cushions or anything and I don't often use slings as a steadying device or to help with recoil or whatever. I just don't get any more muzzle jump than I do with my much lighter 06 or any of the others... and I'm not usually in the shoulder long enough to get tuckered.

As for the other part of the question... I'd go with putting in a sling stud on the forestock.... I think a band might bugger ya.

[Tactical Lever]

I would put the stud right on the end (facing away) if you are concerned about getting bit.

Can't quantify the amount that a barrel band under heavy sling will deviate the shot, but I have heard that it can be fairly substantial.

[Double_D]

I have had a model 70 in .375 for years and I have shot it with a sling. The point of impact does move a little with a tight sling but not enough to get excited about 1 to 2 " low to the rite on my rifle. I am left handed. The recoil on a .375 is not that bad in every position except for prone. I dont recomend prone shooting with a .375 unless you are one tuff SOB.

[albertacowboy]

Thanks for all your replies. I just found out today that for 2013 Winchester will offer the blued walnut Alaskan in .375 H&H with a forearm sling swivel stud and folding rear sight, which is perfect for me.

The company also confirmed that assembly of the rifles will be done in Portugal, but my worries are mitigated by a conversation I had with a company gunsmith, who was sure that complete barrelled actions and not loose parts will be shipped and assembled there. This process has worked without quality problems for the Browning Hi-Power, so maybe it will be okay for the Model 70. I would still be happier with an entirely USA-made Model 70, but oh well. I still like the rifle.

Many thanks,
Albertacowboy

[rugerparts]

Originally Posted by pesky672

I have a CZ 550 in 375 H&H.
I use a Vellini double sling... because the darn thing is heavy and I have buggered my shoulders. In fact... that sling goes on pretty much everything now..

Otherwise I do not find the recoil that bad i don't use sissy cushions or anything and I don't often use slings as a steadying device or to help with recoil or whatever. I just don't get any more muzzle jump than I do with my much lighter 06 or any of the others... and I'm not usually in the shoulder long enough to get tuckered.

As for the other part of the question... I'd go with putting in a sling stud on the forestock.... I think a band might bugger ya.

I have that rifle in .308 and I wish my .375 was a 550. That's a substantial rifle. Its weight is the best medecin for recoil. Do they do anything different in 375 other than a longer action. My 308 didnt have open sights on it. Do they put them on the 375?

[silver]

Originally Posted by ShawnM

They don't make one in standard. Only Safari or Alaskan.

So last night I was sitting by the woodstove reading my copy of the gun blue book and I got to the Winchester section. Winchester made a .375 in standard grade from 1946 to 1963, they have a .375 in the model 70 in super grade but it was discontinued in 1960. The super grade african is listed in .458 only. They have .375 in the model 70 alaskan but it was made from 1960 to 1963.

My book is 1996 vintage so there is a lot of recent history absent. If there is someone with more recent info, I would like to see it.

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by rugerparts

I have that rifle in .308 and I wish my .375 was a 550. That's a substantial rifle. Its weight is the best medecin for recoil. Do they do anything different in 375 other than a longer action. My 308 didnt have open sights on it. Do they put them on the 375?

The weight does help but its a bear to cart around all day

Yes it has ( don't know the right term) staged open sights...for shooting different distances.... just a series of v-sights. The same sort of thing you see on other dangerous game/africa rifles.

Otherwise it was purpose and calibre built which was part of the reason I bought it. Rather than have a two round magazine I have a 4 round mag because the action is larger.

Seems like everyone else trys to squeeze big bullets into actions built with something smaller in mind and that seemed more like buying something that had been converted than a ground up rifle.

[silver]

Originally Posted by rugerparts

I have that rifle in .308 and I wish my .375 was a 550. That's a substantial rifle. Its weight is the best medecin for recoil. Do they do anything different in 375 other than a longer action. My 308 didnt have open sights on it. Do they put them on the 375?

I do believe they put the express sight on the 375 but there is something to look out for, that is the drop in the stock. My brno 602 has the straighter north american style stock and it works well with a scope, but I cant get my eye low enough to use the iron sights, when I try to use them I usually shoot high. The european style or lux stock has more drop and will let you use the iron sights but it may give you more recoil.

[Big Daddy Badger]

Originally Posted by silver

I do believe they put the express sight on the 375 but there is something to look out for, that is the drop in the stock. My brno 602 has the straighter north american style stock and it works well with a scope, but I cant get my eye low enough to use the iron sights, when I try to use them I usually shoot high. The european style or lux stock has more drop and will let you use the iron sights but it may give you more recoil.

I tried to get one with a hags back but ended up with the American... no problem using those sights though...on mine.

[6.5 shooter]

If you want to shoot with the sling then practice with the sling! It will alter your point of impact but so will a sling on the stock.

Watch a good friend of mine at the range one day with a super accurate rifle and he couldn't figure out how he could get 3 in one hole then every once in a while he would throw one out of the group. I watched him for a bit and noticed then when he started getting a really good group he would tense up a bit and pull down on his sling a little bit harder. I suggested he remove the sling....and presto problem solved.

So sometimes the simple things will give you the most grief, shoot the way you will in the field and good hunting.

P.S. Awesome round

[nitro-express]

Originally Posted by 6.5 shooter

If you want to shoot with the sling then practice with the sling! It will alter your point of impact but so will a sling on the stock.

Watch a good friend of mine at the range one day with a super accurate rifle and he couldn't figure out how he could get 3 in one hole then every once in a while he would throw one out of the group. I watched him for a bit and noticed then when he started getting a really good group he would tense up a bit and pull down on his sling a little bit harder. I suggested he remove the sling....and presto problem solved.

So sometimes the simple things will give you the most grief, shoot the way you will in the field and good hunting.

P.S. Awesome round

On some rifles the POI/POA will change more than others. I've experienced a change of several inches on some guns. The sling can put a significant force on the rifle. Reinforcing the forend and bedding the action stiffen the rifle, lessens the effect. Free floating vs a bedded tip, all influence this. Using the sling also changes the recoil momentum, changes POI.

I tested enough to come to the conclusion that I will not use it on a scoped rifle. Instead I practiced shooting off hand, learning how to breath and steady myself. Instead of a target, I used a gong at 100 yards, instant feedback.

On an open sighted rifle, using a sling has more of a positive influence than a negative one, at least that's what I found. Crossed shooting sticks may be the #1 way to go.

[calgarychef]

Slings with barrel bands are super sexy looking...don’t forget the “purty” factor.

[Dean2]

Even being a 6 year old thread, this is still a good topic.

My Ruger 375 has a barrel band. The 20" barrel is NOT floated. I do not see any material difference using the sling or not as to POI off sticks. Off hand I group much better with the sling but it does hit right and lower of where I do free hand by a couple of inches each. Off my knee it hits same place as it does using the sling standing. I am left handed also.

I have never played with the sling shooting off a bench but I also don't bench that gun a lot. It will easily do 3/4" 3 shot groups but it isn't what you would call really pleasant to shoot off the bench. I do use a sissy pad on the bench, for the rest, no brake and a Limbsaver recoil pad that I replaced the factory butt plate with.

I had it out at the range the other day, cold bore hits exactly the same place as the next two, which to me is a big deal on a hunting rifle. I find cold bore consistency with follow-up shoots to be much improved with a fully bedded, rather than floated barrel. It also helps a lot to foul the barrel with 3 to 10 rounds and leave it fouled for the whole season, when it comes to cold bore consistency. Sighted in 3.5" high at 100, with 270 TSX it is pretty much point and shoot to 350 yards. Makes a great Elk and Moose gun, while doing surprisingly little damage to smaller game.

[raised by wolves]

I do not like the barrel band. No science behind it for me. I just do not like the aesthetics of the rifle's appearance.

My 375 is a Sako 85 Bavarian, but I took it out of the original stock and dropped it into a laminate with sling studs and a Limbsaver Grind-to-Fit recoil pad. I can shoot comfortably just resting the stock on my hand as the extra weight from the laminate stock helps to tame the recoil. I do at times wrap the sling around my forearm to stabilize for the longer shots. Even with the previous Bavarian stock, that was significantly lighter than the laminate, the recoil did not drive the sling studs into my hand.. The recoil was never quite so violent. So, in summary, make the rifle comfortable for you.

[Oldan Grumpi]

I’ve used a very lightweight .375 H&H SAKO L61R for a long time. It fits me perfectly, and recoil is not an issue at all. As far as I’m concerned, fit (as in drop, cast off and length of pull) is everything!

Yes, a sling if any kind helps a bunch when shooting off hand, but what helps even more is shouldering up against a tree or resting up against, or over, any solid object you can find. It’s not cheating!

[KUDUHNTR]

I have a brno cz 550 in .375, no barrel band though, I have shot it off hand with a sling, and off the bench with no sling, did not find any big difference, except more accurate of the bench of course!

When I hunted in Africa with this rifle, got used to using sticks, and now have the primos shooting set up.

Although I have not been back To Africa for a few years, I did use this to shoot a few deer, works just as good as any other of my rifles, maybe a little overkill??!!

With careful shot placement, did not find it to be any more damage than some of my .30 calibers.

It it a heavy rifle, with little to no recoil, real pleasant to shoot !

I like the look of the barrel band though, could not justify the higher cost to find a vintage shooter, or a new one etc.

Hope this might help in some way !

[Dean2]

KDHUNTER

You can have a seated on Barrel band installed on your CZ for about 100 bucks including the part. If you use the self clamping version they only cost about $30. I really like the barrel band on the short barreled guns. It makes it so the barrel does not catch on tree branches and the like while you are walking. I don't know that it makes as much difference on the longer barrel but they are a nice classic looking set up.

https://grovtec.com/products/420-470...two-piece-band

There is also a full band version of the clip on.

[KUDUHNTR]

Hey Dean!
Thanks for the info, I will check it out!
The barrel band, gives it that nostalgic look!

Originally Posted by Dean2

KDHUNTER

You can have a seated on Barrel band installed on your CZ for about 100 bucks including the part. If you use the self clamping version they only cost about $30. I really like the barrel band on the short barreled guns. It makes it so the barrel does not catch on tree branches and the like while you are walking. I don't know that it makes as much difference on the longer barrel but they are a nice classic looking set up.

https://grovtec.com/products/420-470...two-piece-band

There is also a full band version of the clip on.