Well I am all for boycotting AHEIA and ACA if possible now!

[skidderman]

If hunters keep insisting that their deeds be posted on social media this kind of thing is only going to get worse. I look at it this way. I won't go on facebook any more because the lefties keep shoving their agenda in my face. If I want to be on facebook I have no choice. So one spears an animal & shoves it in everyone's face on facebook. We know hunters are a minority so why do they do this? No need to blame anyone but the braggers who can't keep it to themselves. If you have done this it is you who is the problem & it's easy to fix. Just stop it!!!! If we don't the thing we call hunting will become a thing of the past.

[Full Curl Earl]

There has always been a sacrificial lamb to appease the powers, spears are it this time. And it makes perfect sense, glad they didn’t go after more common tools like guns and bows that would affect great numbers. How many people were spear hunting anyhow? Does it mean they are coming after bows next? Maybe, but not likely. I have plenty of non hunting friends and associates, and discussions about hunting typically end with “at least with a bow the animal stands a chance” , then mention spear hunting, and an odd look appears followed by “ why would you want to do that”? Even though they proved the ability to understand fair chase when it applies to bow hunting, spear hunting is just too far removed to be accepted anymore.
I am fine it was spears and not bows and guns this time. Selfish, kinda.
Taking one on the chin for the greater good of all, a better term.

[covey ridge]

I think AHEIA is the best thing that has happened to Alberta hunters and firearm owners. I will not boycott them.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by skidderman

If hunters keep insisting that their deeds be posted on social media this kind of thing is only going to get worse. I look at it this way. I won't go on facebook any more because the lefties keep shoving their agenda in my face. If I want to be on facebook I have no choice. So one spears an animal & shoves it in everyone's face on facebook. We know hunters are a minority so why do they do this? No need to blame anyone but the braggers who can't keep it to themselves. If you have done this it is you who is the problem & it's easy to fix. Just stop it!!!! If we don't the thing we call hunting will become a thing of the past.

That says it all .. to the core.

[CanadianEh]

Hunting with a spear is for Neanderthals anyways..

I believe anyone who is an ethical hunter, believes in fast, clean and effective kills. None of which are possible by throwing a spear IMHO.

[FCLightning]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

Hunting with a spear is for Neanderthals anyways..



I believe anyone who is an ethical hunter, believes in fast, clean and effective kills. None of which are possible by throwing a spear IMHO.

So you are advocating for the end to bow and arrows?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dmcbride]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

Hunting with a spear is for Neanderthals anyways..

I believe anyone who is an ethical hunter, believes in fast, clean and effective kills. None of which are possible by throwing a spear IMHO.

I think it is time to lobby against bow hunters, enough is enough.

[JDK71]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

Hunting with a spear is for Neanderthals anyways..

I believe anyone who is an ethical hunter, believes in fast, clean and effective kills. None of which are possible by throwing a spear IMHO.

Agree

[CanadianEh]

Where exactly in my post did you read that I am against bow hunting? I dont recall writing anything mentioning bow hunting at all.

I believe I used the word "Spear" which doesnt sound like or even rhyme with the word Arrow.

There is a WORLD of difference in power, speed, technology, accuracy etc.. between shooting an arrow & throwing a spear..

[nube]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

Hunting with a spear is for Neanderthals anyways..

I believe anyone who is an ethical hunter, believes in fast, clean and effective kills. None of which are possible by throwing a spear IMHO.

What a dumb statement!
You can get unethical kills with any weapon out there! I'd say the few spear kills I have seen on film actually worked pretty good

[Wolftrapper]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

I think AHEIA is the best thing that has happened to Alberta hunters and firearm owners. I will not boycott them.

I agree.

[CanadianEh]

Nube.. Id disagree with you about the intelligence of my statement.

But do agree with you that ANY form of killing an animal can be unethical, from rifle to bow to a spear. There will always be bad shots even by the best most ethical hunter. When it happens it sucks. The point is, to minimize the risk of that happening


Throwing a spear for hunting is a publicity stunt for youtube viewers.. nothing more.

[dmcbride]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

Nube.. Id disagree with you about the intelligence of my statement.

But do agree with you that ANY form of killing an animal can be unethical, from rifle to bow to a spear. There will always be bad shots even by the best most ethical hunter. When it happens it sucks. The point is, to minimize the risk of that happening


Throwing a spear for hunting is a publicity stunt for youtube viewers.. nothing more.

The same can be said about bows or rifles.

Best if you just hunt with one of these, eh!

https://www.tracking-point.com/

[slickwilly]

Its called PR, guys. The video that inspired this whole thing was a clean kill by all accounts. But it still ripped that bear damn near in half. Nobody outside of hunting is going to like that, and even a good chunk of hunters didn't.

Am I going to risk the opinion of the whole sport to defend a tiny minority? No way.

If you feel like getting to within 5 yards is the way to do it, you can do it with a gun or bow. The spear doesn't add anything except gore.

[1899b]

Originally Posted by nube

What a dumb statement!
You can get unethical kills with any weapon out there! I'd say the few spear kills I have seen on film actually worked pretty good

But you can up your chances for an unethical kill or decrease the chance. What side do you want to be on? What next?? Try and stone one to death??

[Mulehahn]

I would argue that within its effective range a spear is one of the cleanest and most efficient tools available A 2" hole through an animal, not including blade diameter is pretty effective. Bloody, but effective. Much more so than other choices.

And for those who think this is a result of the video, that video was simply a coup de grace. The banning of spears and Atlatls was underway long before 2016 (4 years at a minimum); lead from within our hunting ranks. But make no mistake, the Antis are watching and have seen it can be done. Who knows what will be next but make no more mistake there will be a next, and a a next, and a next. Soon those teaching new hunter and those who spend money raised from tags and licenses will have no more sacrificial lambs for you to offer up and will be forced to come for your techniques.

[Yaha Tinda]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

None of which are possible by throwing a spear IMHO.

Really? Even is the critter is ten feet away? What about three feet away? Would it be ethical and humane and safe then?

[CanadianEh]

Originally Posted by Yaha Tinda

Really? Even is the critter is ten feet away? What about three feet away? Would it be ethical and humane and safe then?

If you are talking about holding onto the spear and thrusting it through an animals heart, undoubtedly that would be very effective. If you manage to get a nice calm bear who wouldnt attack back, stand completely still and let you hit it directly in the heart. Would it be "safe" Nope.

Since that scenario is beyond the realm of reality........ No.

Originally Posted by Mulehahn

I would argue that within its effective range a spear is one of the cleanest and most efficient tools available A 2" hole through an animal, not including blade diameter is pretty effective. Bloody, but effective. Much more so than other choices.

Id take you up on that argument..

First off, Just a question in response. If you were withing a spears killing range with a big bear, what would you rather have in your hand.

a.) A spear
b.) A gun

Im guessing you would say a spear, since it is "one of the cleanest most efficient tools available. " I am not sure many people on this earth would consider it a fitting definition of a spear ( removing the fact that you are also throwing it)


Once you get into THROWING a heavy spear things go down hill very very fast. I would challenge anyone to pick up a spear and go try and throw it at a pie plate sized target with ANY level of accuracy, even from only 10 feet. sure you may be able to do it on occasion when really slowing down and throwing it gingerly at the target.

Now take into account, you would have to do it probably with a massive amount of effort. Tossing a spear isnt like throwing a dart in your basement with just the flick of your wrist. There is a large amount of strength required, whole body & arm movement to exert enough force onto a much heavier spear to make it move fast enough to penetrate deeply. I am not a statistician, but the likelihood of a failed shot with ALL these and more variables is exponentially higher than a bow or rifle. Thus making it far less ethical.

A inexperienced person could pick up a modern compound bow /w release and very likely make a Lethal 40 yard shot to hit a pie plate even if they had NO experience with a bow. Or Pick up a rifle and likely hit a pie plate at 150 yards.

[Yaha Tinda]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

If you are talking about holding onto the spear and thrusting it through an animals heart, undoubtedly that would be very effective. If you manage to get a nice calm bear who wouldnt attack back, stand completely still and let you hit it directly in the heart. Would it be "safe" Nope.

Since that scenario is beyond the realm of reality........ No.

The restriction deals with all big game animals not just bears, so the safety issue is moot.

Beyond your reality perhaps. Just like the Minister has failed to learn before making conclusions, so have you and many others.

[CanadianEh]

Originally Posted by Yaha Tinda

The restriction deals with all big game animals not just bears, so the safety issue is moot.

Beyond your reality perhaps. Just like the Minister has failed to learn before making conclusions, so have you and many others.

So what have I missed Yaha?

[CF8889]

Does anyone have the numbers? Like how much force is needed to be lethal at 10 yards? 15 yards? 20yards? How tough is it to generate that force? Can your average hunter do it?

What's the law for bows? 40lbs to hunt big game? How do you enforce a similar law for spears?

I am not for blindly banning spear hunting.. but I am also not going to support something because some guy wants to do it and we are both hunters so I have to support him.

[gitrdun]

[Yaha Tinda]

Originally Posted by CF8889

Does anyone have the numbers? Like how much force is needed to be lethal at 10 yards? 15 yards? 20yards? How tough is it to generate that force? Can your average hunter do it?

What's the law for bows? 40lbs to hunt big game? How do you enforce a similar law for spears?

I am not for blindly banning spear hunting.. but I am also not going to support something because some guy wants to do it and we are both hunters so I have to support him.

The mass of the average spear generates much more KE than a 40lb long bow.

The cutting surface on a spear is far greater than that of any archery broadhead, including the newest mechanicals.

What else is there?

[CF8889]

Do you have actual numbers? Or proof to back up your claim. You may very well be right. But I need more then just some guy on the internet telling me so

How much more force is needed to push such a large cutting surface through far enough to penetrate the vitals? Again, I have zero knowledge of this. But I am curious. Hammering a small nail into a piece of wood is easier then hammering a nail 10x the size into the same wood. Does the spear/arrow work like that too?

[CanadianEh]

Originally Posted by Yaha Tinda

The mass of the average spear generates much more KE than a 40lb long bow.

The cutting surface on a spear is far greater than that of any archery broadhead, including the newest mechanicals.

What else is there?

That logic doesn't work Yaha..

The mass of an average 4x4 would also generate much more Kinetic energy than a spear. Doesn't mean would would be exert enough force to able to ethnically use it to kill an animal. Even with a 10" cutting head far larger than any spear available.

[huntinstuff]

On the bright side, it doesnt affect everyone


Now to ban bows.

They are little spears.

Wait until someone videos a deer limping around with an arrow sticking out of its ass.

That’s next

And, to make it all the more nefarious, I’d bet an anti hunter would shoot a deer in the ass with an arrow just to make that video.

[Yaha Tinda]

The information is readily available on the net, 25-65 ft lbs medium to large game. (that may vary with jurisdiction)

[CF8889]

http://www.thudscave.com/npaa/articles/howhard.htm

Some info here

[dmcbride]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

If you are talking about holding onto the spear and thrusting it through an animals heart, undoubtedly that would be very effective. If you manage to get a nice calm bear who wouldnt attack back, stand completely still and let you hit it directly in the heart. Would it be "safe" Nope.

Since that scenario is beyond the realm of reality........ No.



Id take you up on that argument..

First off, Just a question in response. If you were withing a spears killing range with a big bear, what would you rather have in your hand.

a.) A spear
b.) A gun

Im guessing you would say a spear, since it is "one of the cleanest most efficient tools available. " I am not sure many people on this earth would consider it a fitting definition of a spear ( removing the fact that you are also throwing it)


Once you get into THROWING a heavy spear things go down hill very very fast. I would challenge anyone to pick up a spear and go try and throw it at a pie plate sized target with ANY level of accuracy, even from only 10 feet. sure you may be able to do it on occasion when really slowing down and throwing it gingerly at the target.

Now take into account, you would have to do it probably with a massive amount of effort. Tossing a spear isnt like throwing a dart in your basement with just the flick of your wrist. There is a large amount of strength required, whole body & arm movement to exert enough force onto a much heavier spear to make it move fast enough to penetrate deeply. I am not a statistician, but the likelihood of a failed shot with ALL these and more variables is exponentially higher than a bow or rifle. Thus making it far less ethical.

A inexperienced person could pick up a modern compound bow /w release and very likely make a Lethal 40 yard shot to hit a pie plate even if they had NO experience with a bow. Or Pick up a rifle and likely hit a pie plate at 150 yards.

I have been trying to spear a deer from a tree for a few years. My comfort range is about 1-2 yards from the base of the tree. Meaning I can hit a tennis ball at that range.

I decided to take up spear hunting for the challenge, not for any kind of blood lust. I can go shoot a deer with a rifle in less then 1 hour and arrow a deer in 1 day if I really wanted to. Big bucks not included.


I haven’t actually thrown the spear at a deer yet. Lots of deer within that range but the deer were on edge and I didn’t feel I could make a ethical throw knowing the deer could move before impact.

The facts are, it comes down to ethics and being proficient with ones tool of choice.

And yes spears are very capable of killing big game animals fast and humane.

http://www.thudscave.com/npaa/articles/howhard.htm

[bezzola]

I agree with banning spears alot of people cant shoot a bow or rifle properly.
Give them a spear there will be wounded animals everywhere.