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  #31  
Old 07-04-2022, 07:11 AM
TrapperRPR TrapperRPR is offline
 
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Originally Posted by TrapperMike View Post
Sold just shy of 700 beavers, averaged $20. Most of them were summer beavers.
Hi Trapper Mike. Do you mean spring/fall beaver or actual summer (nuisance) beaver? I ask because I'm new and did a bit of damage control last year. I was told not to bother skinning (I saved them for bait) because the hides were worthless. I will skin damage control beavers in future if there's a market .
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  #32  
Old 07-04-2022, 08:32 PM
TrapperMike TrapperMike is offline
 
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Do problem control for local county, farmers, highways and others. Pretty much all summer beavers. Remember how Clarence Anderson and I thought it was funny that one year we averaged $10 more for our summer beavers than our winter beavers. Guess it all has to do with who’s buying.
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  #33  
Old 07-04-2022, 10:47 PM
Marty S Marty S is offline
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No, it has everything to do with who’s sorting… especially at an internet sale. Those poor guys that ship straight to the dresser…

Classic case of “…Insert…. Turn Sideways…. Shove…”

My understanding of the “new beaver market” is a new old guy has returned to the felting business, applying pressure to the available goods thus pressuring the commodity a little. I guess his don’t go to the dresser, different process.

For felt, my understanding is the skin is soaked, bleached, plucked, restretched, then the beaver gets its underfur sheared and the underfur is saved and pressed into felt.

So probly, if the beaver doesn’t have any wool, there be very little or nothing to shave, hopefully the guy catches the problem in time.

If the beaver pelt feels padded when you push down on fur, it should have a decent amount of wool, if you push on the fur and you feel boardy hide, it has no wool and has no value to a felter. The fall beaver are like that but they have nice hair cover with the new hair, and my understanding was the Russians used to buy those for jackets, but no more. Maybe in the very near future??? Who heard my speculative theories on the weekend??!!!

Hopefully just some crafter buying them all in special lots, turning them all into mitts and selling at the local farmers market! However, likelihood ~0.01 percent… just like covid.

Last edited by Marty S; 07-04-2022 at 11:14 PM.
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  #34  
Old 07-05-2022, 12:53 PM
TrapperMike TrapperMike is offline
 
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Sorry to disagree with you Marty but if there are 30 buyers chasing the felt beavers and only 1 looking for some to use in jackets the 30 will control the prices. Probably pulling the felt hides up and the prime ones down. As for summer beaver hides having no value, I had a number of my summer hides go for $40.
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  #35  
Old 07-06-2022, 09:22 AM
Marty S Marty S is offline
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Just mix ‘em in. You get paid. FHA gets paid. End user ideally inspects his goods before tanning or processing. If so, buyer is only out the $4 USD handing fee, 8.2% commission, shipping, return shipping, and reconsignment of 11% or whatever we pay. If not and skin is processed and useless to him he can always discard, perhaps even compost!!!

Youre right, no biggie. Who would possibly care about such things? Its just a few bucks. Surely no long term implications to the industry.

Im just an idealist is all. Ideally when a guy buys skins of a certain grade, that's what he gets… such bizzarre-ism from my end in this post modern age.
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  #36  
Old 07-06-2022, 10:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperRPR View Post
Hi Trapper Mike. Do you mean spring/fall beaver or actual summer (nuisance) beaver? I ask because I'm new and did a bit of damage control last year. I was told not to bother skinning (I saved them for bait) because the hides were worthless. I will skin damage control beavers in future if there's a market .
Sorry to jump in on your conversation but your post count is too low for me to pm you.

You were told right. The absolute best grade that you can hope for with a summer beaver is III but more likely IV or V.....”Inferior pelt with little or no commercial value”. Also, due to a lack of underfur, the weight of the pelts will grade Light (LT).....”Lacks underfur, not ideal for shearing.”

I’ve never had grades that low for any of the pelts that I’ve sent to auction so I wouldn’t know what they would sell for. I can’t imagine anyone paying much for a pelt that is of little use though.

Skin one and send it in to see what you get.
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  #37  
Old 07-07-2022, 06:04 AM
Marty S Marty S is offline
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You might do ok if they just huck your summers in with the good ones, it worked for Mikey!

When buyers get burned regularly, they factor in the loss to their price paid going forward to make up for their loss. Some guys complain and try to return goods, others will even take legal action when they get supremely piddled off.

Any theories as to why suddenly so many previous heavy AB SK coyotes are going semi heavy???

Hunter Davey is referring to fur grades from a previous reality called NAFA. In our new “alternate reality” it appears that the company has eliminated such nasty grades as III’s and IV’s, and instead, according to what Mikey is articulating from his sales report, these low end beaver are making it into the IIs, GD SLTs, SLT DGD, and DGD. It would be very interesting to know how many are ending up in the I’s and I-II’s.

This should be a most interesting topic at the 7th annual Canadian Coyote Conference, this year being held at Winter Harbour, BC on Sept 5-8. By all means, give Oli a call and see if hes got an extra boat and bring your buddies. (Do note, no more scopalamine patches being made, what was touted as an incredible and safe drug by the WHO in 2017 has now been eliminated. Golly.. why would they do a thing like that? Theories? I have one. Tragic! So anyways, do bring your prescription anti nausea meds… we looking to git us some ALBACORES!!! plus the usual)
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  #38  
Old 07-07-2022, 07:17 AM
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South west trappin RG South west trappin RG is offline
 
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Here is a interesting note that needs some thought marty. How did my 45 coyotes that were last few days of October an first week of November, 15 of them grade as HVY ? They were at best semi lol I shouldn’t complain. Mabe got lucky like MM an his beavers. Good luck at Winter Harbour it’s a fisherman's paradise there.
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  #39  
Old 07-07-2022, 08:23 AM
Marty S Marty S is offline
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Thats easy, its called high elevation coyotes. They prime early.
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  #40  
Old 07-07-2022, 11:02 AM
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South west trappin RG South west trappin RG is offline
 
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Coyotes from Buffalow
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  #41  
Old 07-07-2022, 11:06 AM
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South west trappin RG South west trappin RG is offline
 
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2400 ft my Mt line is all over 5000
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  #42  
Old 07-07-2022, 03:19 PM
kingrat kingrat is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by South west trappin RG View Post
Here is a interesting note that needs some thought marty. How did my 45 coyotes that were last few days of October an first week of November, 15 of them grade as HVY ? They were at best semi lol I shouldn’t complain. Mabe got lucky like MM an his beavers. Good luck at Winter Harbour it’s a fisherman's paradise there.
i had 15 coy that i footholded at end of oct and all but 2 went hvy.
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  #43  
Old 07-07-2022, 03:53 PM
204ruger 204ruger is offline
 
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I’m convinced there can’t be much rhyme or reason to the way coyotes are graded or sold. I always did better on my mid October to mid next November coyotes at the first sale then I did with my later “more prime” coyotes in the second sale at nafa mind you but doesn’t it seem backwards none the less.
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  #44  
Old 07-07-2022, 04:20 PM
Marty S Marty S is offline
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One thing i do know from the grading aspect, no two sales alike.

Basically subjective grading to reflect market conditions or to manipulate market results. The NAFA people were masters at it
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  #45  
Old 07-07-2022, 05:29 PM
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Whether a coyote grades hvy or semi has nothing to do with the primness of the fur. The type of fur determines that. Larger Eastern and Mid-Western coyotes are considered Semi because they have coarse guard hair and non-uniform color (usually darker). Smaller Western coyotes are pale in color, have more uniform guard hairs and have a softer, more silky feel.

WRT to Western Heavies grading Semi, I don't totally understand that one. I think that it may have something to do with the fur degrading to a point that it starts to resemble Semi fur. I base that on usually getting Semi grades on my later February caught coyotes.

ALSO, to confuse things even further, I think that there's a Hvy-Semi grade that they use in addition to just Semi (can't remember. Maybe NAFA?).

In summary, sub-sub-species in different regions have different types of fur.

I trap in #8 and my yotes are dark HVY= Northern Coyotes. AB Trappers in #10 seem to catch lighter coloured HVY = Plains Coyotes.

8. Canis latrans incolatus (Northern Coyote)
10. Canis latrans latrans (Plains Coyote)
11. Canis latrans lestes (Mountain Coyote)
17. Canis latrans thamnos (Northeastern Coyote)
20. Canis latrans “var” (Eastern Coyote)

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  #46  
Old 07-07-2022, 06:10 PM
Marty S Marty S is offline
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Wow! Thats quite the picture! I luv it!!!

Makes zero sense to what goes on in the real fur world but it sure looks nice! Thanks for that Dave!
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  #47  
Old 07-07-2022, 08:25 PM
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Camdec Camdec is offline
 
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I’m assuming with the volume involved at times that the grading varies immensely. Maybe good or bad if it’s done on a Monday or a Friday. I’ve had a few select beaver and I’ve never caught one through the ice. All spring fall. That being said I’ve had some tanned and sheared so maybe the guidelines for primeness need some tweaking or maybe it just varies by region more than I think.
One thing for sure is I could never be a fur grader because on numerous occasions I’ve been surprised by grades…both good and bad.
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  #48  
Old 07-08-2022, 07:54 AM
TrapperMike TrapperMike is offline
 
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Had a number of my beavers go select or 1-11. Highest priced ones were graded 3x- 2x RR XDK-BRN.
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  #49  
Old 07-08-2022, 09:17 AM
Marty S Marty S is offline
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No doubt but undoubtably you had early spring goods in the mix, aka prime?

Too bad you didnt put your summer stuff in a second account, or did you only have summer goods on the sale? How long did it take you to accumulate 700 skins?

Dave, definitely just take that last one with a grain of salt, but in my defense things were sounding pretty hoaky. Is that a word? Hoakey?

Last edited by Marty S; 07-08-2022 at 09:25 AM.
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  #50  
Old 07-08-2022, 06:29 PM
TrapperMike TrapperMike is offline
 
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Pretty well all summer, start in May. Took 2 years to accumulate these hides.
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  #51  
Old 07-08-2022, 07:26 PM
Big Grey Wolf Big Grey Wolf is offline
 
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Dave did excellent job of scientifically explaining our coyote variations.
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  #52  
Old 07-18-2022, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotekiller View Post
Ended up selling 12 coyotes out of 65. 32.75 average, 6 for $40, 5 for $29 and 1 for 8$
checked today, it updated again saying I sold 35 out of 65 coyotes for a average of 29.96
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  #53  
Old 07-18-2022, 03:22 PM
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Same here shows almost all mine sold now for a 28 and change ave. Ouch.
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  #54  
Old 07-19-2022, 10:09 AM
Big Grey Wolf Big Grey Wolf is offline
 
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Wow, All my marten have now sold, even got a $62.50 3X in shock, even got top lot fisher, also whole 30% of coyotes at $26 average. Good times are hear again!
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  #55  
Old 07-19-2022, 01:40 PM
Powder monkey Powder monkey is offline
 
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Good times yep. Lol
The fha fire sale on coyotes has begun.
I’m sure we will hear all the usual bs about why we should be happy to have gotten anything in these tough economic times. Blah blah blah
Doesn’t mean should be happy selling select coyotes for 70 can.
Also don’t know how I had 23 damaged coyotes(I didn’t) but that’s what they graded them so they could sell for 6-10 bucks.
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  #56  
Old 07-19-2022, 08:39 PM
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Checked my acct ,.sold 17 of 42 now...best was $70 ,6@ $62 .with an Ave of $42...could be worse.

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  #57  
Old 07-20-2022, 11:37 AM
TrapperRPR TrapperRPR is offline
 
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I just checked my account and some of my coyotes have moved as well. What sold for me were my 2 damaged and all of the C-D and Ds. None of my Cs sold; I'm hopeful that they will bring a higher price when they do sell. Also, only my #1 castoreum sold. The largest portion of my castoreum was #2 with a small amount of #3 and all of that is still unsold.
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  #58  
Old 07-21-2022, 09:01 AM
Marty S Marty S is offline
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My average on coyotes was lower than Cam’s but I sold 2/3 of mine privately and in doing so probably over half of what I had in FHA was less desirable goods, tho the very top end was out of both.

Very difficult in finding anybody to sell private this year, even the fur buyers didn’t want goods.

I spoke to a high level source, very entrenched in the industry, yesterday who believes this is a false or short term low, and that W Can. coyotes could easily rebound and should. I agree with him, it is called supply and demand. It is tough out there right now tho, China’s “permanent covid lockdown/economic warfare” thingy causing catastrophic damage to the western world economy plus our big brand name fashion leaders out, so how can it rebound? I see an immediate short harvest coming this winter with China hopefully waking up, Russian currency going ballistic with Putin tying the Rouble to gold, and the fact that W Can coyote is always a very desirable trimming item, thus a shortage is just around the corner? Although it is likely that GFW’s customer in China still has a ton of goods? Perhaps they all Russia bound??? The rate that the Rouble shot up was undoubtedly alarming to western economic powers, did they anticipate? No idea but they most certainly seem to have reacted? To what end will the effect be, the west printing money at an alarming rate while the dark side’s currency gaining rapidly as backed by gold. What a backwards world we in.

I see a Chinese fur pipeline to Russia happening very quickly, Russia has become very sanction proof and has taken steps long ago to reduce it’s dependence upon the west, with fur being a very desired item and Russia getting the goods that it desires. No doubt very contrary to what is preached in mainstream media, but they no longer give accurate news and we are forced to find conservative news platforms if we want real news these days.

My whole Russia speculation is my speculation, haven’t heard such from anybody else and didn’t discuss with my fur expert yesterday. But their buying power had exceeded pre Crimea invasion power recently, a very noteworthy developement.

Meanwhile, people still love to wear their coyote trimmed parkas around the world. Just talk to folks that frequent the streets of New York, Chicago, Toronto, Montreal, etc. The fashion folk trying to lead away from coyote but the people still love!

Meanwhile, many Chinese buyers fantasizing about buying coyotes for $3 no doubt!

My clearance at the sale was 50%. Do note tho there was supposed to be 90,000 coyotes at the last sale, another gross exaggeration as there were actually 80,000 coyotes, and of those 80,000 there was significant carryover from the previous sale. That is a far cry from a 120,000 coyote inventory of a single NAFA sale with no carryover when the market was hot.

Just tell me straight up please… NAFA is extinct, no real pressing need for the twisted truths! No need to confuse everybody with the Marten/Sable over-information and such. It would be much appreciated tho to see Section 1 and Section 3 averages?

Much to discuss with Marky at the Canadian Coyote Conference in September, Winter Harbour, don’t miss it!!!
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