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04-13-2021, 09:55 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Photo radar question
Hey all,
So, driving down Deerfoot this morning, i come across a photo radar vehicle travelling in the left lane going 100KM and decided to pass him. I was increasing my speed and looked back to see a flash. Is this even legal or possible? Never heard of this ever before happening to anyone.
Thoughts?
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04-13-2021, 10:12 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 9,677
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Legal, who knows what the cities allow. They seem to be ok with pylons on a busy bridge or hide behind bushes or bus shelters here in Edmonton.
I would wonder how both traveling at similar speeds could get an accurate reading on your speed(assuming you think it was you that set it off). Maybe the sensor was still activated and you triggered the flash. I guess you wait for the surprise in the mail.
Seems like an easy one to beat if you do get it.
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04-13-2021, 10:27 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,155
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That is interesting given that you mention the photo radar vehicle was traveling in the left lane. The photo radar cameras are angled to the left at around 20-23 degrees, so if you passed on the right side, you likely weren't even in the beam.
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Only accurate guns are interesting.
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04-13-2021, 10:49 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 5,634
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It wasn’t probably even a flash that you have seen but rather the sun reflection.
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04-13-2021, 10:59 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 11,858
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Bad news is …. it's not that technical or complex for todays laser technology to determine your speed of travel accurately even if the camera vehicle is also moving.
Bad news is ….. it's probably perfectly legal, and you were speeding so if this is the case, you will likely get the ticket
I haven't seen this before, and it sucks to see they are doing that - travelling slow in the left lane to force people to pass you could be a form of entrapment IMO - not sure if the judge would agree with me though.
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04-13-2021, 10:59 AM
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 679
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Maybe they can manually trigger the flash. Probably a feeble attempt at shaking his finger at you for passing him.
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04-13-2021, 11:02 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
That is interesting given that you mention the photo radar vehicle was traveling in the left lane. The photo radar cameras are angled to the left at around 20-23 degrees, so if you passed on the right side, you likely weren't even in the beam.
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Sorry my bad, he was in the right lane and I was in the left...
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04-13-2021, 11:03 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATF
Maybe they can manually trigger the flash. Probably a feeble attempt at shaking his finger at you for passing him.
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I was thinking the same thing..LOL
He looked a little grumpy as I passed
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04-13-2021, 11:05 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sooner
Legal, who knows what the cities allow. They seem to be ok with pylons on a busy bridge or hide behind bushes or bus shelters here in Edmonton.
I would wonder how both traveling at similar speeds could get an accurate reading on your speed(assuming you think it was you that set it off). Maybe the sensor was still activated and you triggered the flash. I guess you wait for the surprise in the mail.
Seems like an easy one to beat if you do get it.
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This was my main concern is how exactly they can do it travelling at similar speeds. I also thought about fighting it if something does come in the mail..LOL
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04-13-2021, 11:06 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinhits
I was thinking the same thing..LOL
He looked a little grumpy as I passed
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It probably takes a grumpy person to do that job.
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Only accurate guns are interesting.
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04-13-2021, 11:07 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KGB
It wasn’t probably even a flash that you have seen but rather the sun reflection.
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Nope, definetly a flash.
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04-13-2021, 11:07 AM
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Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,535
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Wouldn't surprise me one bit if they are taking the show on the road.
The operator can flash the light anytime he wants, just honk at a stationary photo truck or van and there's a good chance they will flash the light at you. It's just a scare tactic. I honk at them all the time.
My guess is that's what happened.
If they are taking the show on the road it's easy for them to tell how fast your going, cop cars have had them for years that tell the differentiated speed, it figures how fast your going while taking into account how fast the cop car is going. It's old technology.
Pretty sure all RCMP cars have them, that's how they clock you when going the opposite direction as you on the highway.
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04-13-2021, 11:11 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
It probably takes a grumpy person to do that job.
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HAHAHA...True dat
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04-13-2021, 11:32 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: On the border in Lloydminster
Posts: 8,369
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Strikes fear in the hearts of the speeders LOL
They were talking about moving radar few years ago I thought it was struck down now with the deficit the way is is they might be looking at more revenue.
Like shooting fish in a barrel
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Si vis pacem, para bellum
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04-13-2021, 11:35 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: WMU 303
Posts: 8,493
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Their job is to record vehicles exceeding the speed limit. I don't know why it wouldn't be legal. It's certainly possible.
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04-13-2021, 11:42 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 330
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New radars can detect your speed whether you're approaching from behind the vehicle, passing, or headed towards eachother. Found this out the hard way, annoyingly on hwy 40 with about 300m of pavement left before it went gravel.
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"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."Jiddu Krishnamurti
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04-13-2021, 11:48 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,155
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Regular radar units have two antennas that allow them to track two speeds, including the speed of the vehicle the radar unit is in. These radar units are also aimed directly forward or rearward, as they are designed to measure the speed of vehicles pretty much in line with them.
Photo radar units are made to be used while stationary, so they don't need a second antenna, to measure a second speed. As well, the camera is angled around 20-23 degrees to the left, since the photo radar vehicle often parks in parking lots, well back from the street. So if photo radar was to be used in a moving vehicle, they would need to design a unit for this.
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Only accurate guns are interesting.
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04-13-2021, 11:49 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 330
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New radars can detect your speed whether you're approaching from behind the vehicle, passing, or headed towards eachother. Found this out the hard way, annoyingly on hwy 40 with about 300m of pavement left before it went gravel.
__________________
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."Jiddu Krishnamurti
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04-13-2021, 03:08 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Stony Plain, AB
Posts: 528
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The technology has been available for at least 20 years. One unit accurately determines the radar car's speed, usually by aiming at the road just in front of the vehicle. Second unit measures your speed relative to the radar car's speed. Add the two units together gives your speed. Done deal.
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04-13-2021, 03:32 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jednastka
The technology has been available for at least 20 years. One unit accurately determines the radar car's speed, usually by aiming at the road just in front of the vehicle. Second unit measures your speed relative to the radar car's speed. Add the two units together gives your speed. Done deal.
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I am talking about a photo radar vehicle travelling from one location to another. Not a police radar gun in the vehicle while doing there patrols.
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04-13-2021, 05:36 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 3,343
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Keep us posted and how much $
Dodger.
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Freedom comes with responsibility and integrity. Not stupidity and self entitlement.
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04-13-2021, 05:48 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 24,071
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinhits
I am talking about a photo radar vehicle travelling from one location to another. Not a police radar gun in the vehicle while doing there patrols.
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How do you know he was going from one to the next? Are you sure they have not implemented roving photo radar? I was on the Henday yesterday and got a warning about 'mobile speed camera ahead' that came from my phone I was using for navigation.
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Only dead fish go with the flow. The rest use their brains in life.
Originally Posted by Twisted Canuck
I wasn't thinking far enough ahead for an outcome, I was ranting. By definition, a rant doesn't imply much forethought.....
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04-13-2021, 05:51 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dodger
Keep us posted and how much $
Dodger.
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Will do...
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04-13-2021, 05:53 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 4,340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette
How do you know he was going from one to the next? Are you sure they have not implemented roving photo radar? I was on the Henday yesterday and got a warning about 'mobile speed camera ahead' that came from my phone I was using for navigation.
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I am assuming so Ken. I guess I will have to wait for the mail..LOL
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04-13-2021, 06:01 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette
How do you know he was going from one to the next? Are you sure they have not implemented roving photo radar? I was on the Henday yesterday and got a warning about 'mobile speed camera ahead' that came from my phone I was using for navigation.
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The photo radar cameras do not work like police radar, in that they can only track one speed, the speed of the target. The police radar has two antennas, so it can track the target, and the speed of the vehicle that it is in. As well, the photo radar cameras sit at about a 22 degree angle in the vehicle, so they can can park well off the street and still track passing vehicles. The readings they produce are based on that angle, so if they are mobile and in a curve, the readings could have considerable error due to cosine angle. And unlike police radar that is aimed straight ahead, cosine error with a camera mounted at an angle can cause a reading that is higher than actual. So even if they could track two speeds, there would be a lot of room for error. If they want to come up with a moving unit,they would have to design a complete new unit just for mobile applications, and as of yet, that hasn't happened.
__________________
Only accurate guns are interesting.
Last edited by elkhunter11; 04-13-2021 at 06:14 PM.
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04-13-2021, 06:06 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: WMU 303
Posts: 8,493
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This should provide some insight
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04-13-2021, 09:02 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jednastka
The technology has been available for at least 20 years. One unit accurately determines the radar car's speed, usually by aiming at the road just in front of the vehicle. Second unit measures your speed relative to the radar car's speed. Add the two units together gives your speed. Done deal.
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Longer than 20 years ago. I was running radar back in the '90s, and I had that capability.
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04-14-2021, 07:17 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Airdrie
Posts: 514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sooner
Legal, who knows what the cities allow. They seem to be ok with pylons on a busy bridge or hide behind bushes or bus shelters here in Edmonton.
I would wonder how both traveling at similar speeds could get an accurate reading on your speed(assuming you think it was you that set it off). Maybe the sensor was still activated and you triggered the flash. I guess you wait for the surprise in the mail.
Seems like an easy one to beat if you do get it.
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They have been doing mobile readings for years with the car mounted radar units, can't see it being any less effective with the photo radar.
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04-14-2021, 07:23 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: At the end of the Thirsty Beaver Trail, Pinsky lake, Alberta.
Posts: 24,615
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I did this once...crawled up on a unmarked cop car....passed and got lite up...yup...ticket too .....cop said what were you thinking as I said I knew it was a unmarked car but yet still passed....should have just hunkered back and let another fool take the lead
ohh well life lessons some just learnt the hard way
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04-14-2021, 07:28 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccmckee
They have been doing mobile readings for years with the car mounted radar units, can't see it being any less effective with the photo radar.
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You need to look at the differences between police radar, and photo radar cameras, they were designed for different applications, so they have different capabilities.
__________________
Only accurate guns are interesting.
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