If no registry, would private sales increase?

[PGH]

If the government scraps the long gun registry (which they plan on this fall) then do you think that private sales of long guns would increase?

I think they will. Having bought/sold rifles, I found it easier to deal with shops who do the paperwork for the buyer/seller. But, if we no longer have to register long guns it would make for a smoother transaction on the private market because of no paperwork.

What do yout think? I'm just looking for opinions and there is no right or wrong answer to this...

[sikwhiskey]

In the beginning, yes there will be a freeforall, but when it settles out, It will be about the same, most people who are interested in firearms already own and register them. You will see Quite a few that come up for sale "NEVER REGISTERED". I can't wait for all the goodies out there that have never seen the light of day because of the Registry.

[elkhunter11]

If I want a gun, I don't let the registry stop me from buying it, but I expect that it will make a difference to some people.

[PoppaW]

The day the law passes all my guns will be sold. Wink wink

[elkhunter11]

The day the law passes all my guns will be sold. Wink wink

That goes without saying.Of course I won't remember who I sold them to, but I will be positive that the buyer showed me a valid PAL, before they took possession of the gun.

[Okotokian]

Why would there be any change? If you were a law-abiding citizen a quick call to to the registry wouldn't deter you from buying a rifle you wanted. If you were a criminal the registry never stopped you anyway. Isn't that what we have been saying?????

[KegRiver]

I'm sure that some people will appear who never registered their guns.

Trudeau commishioned a study on the number of guns in Canada, to the best of my recollection they came up with a figure of 16 million guns in Canada at the time, that was in the late eighties.

When Chretien introduced the gun control law in 1995 he claimed there was 4 million guns in Canada. I haven't seen a figure on the number of guns that have been registered but my guess is that it is under 10 million.

Now keep in mind that a considerable number of new guns have been brought into Canada since 1995, probibly a few million, so where are all the guns that Trudeau found? I realize that a million or so were destroyed, mostly old guns that didn't work and weren't worth repairing. But lets say it is one and a half million.

My math says there were 16 million, add a couple million new guns, remove 1 1/2 million and lets say six million registered and I get 10.5 million unregistered guns out there somewhere. I'm sure some of those were thrown in rivers, melted down, burnt or burried, still there has to be at least a couple of million still hanging in basements or barns around Canada.

I'm sure someone will despute my figures, it really doesn't matter. We all know there are unregistered guns out there.
The owners of those guns will go back to using them, or they will sell them.

Besides that, there are a fair number of people who chose to get rid of their guns rather then register them. Many of those people will very likely go out and buy a gun or two, once the registry is gone. If in fact it does get dumped.

If instead, they simply give the registry a new suit of clothes, then people will go on as if nothing has changed.

[PGH]

Originally Posted by sikwhiskey

In the beginning, yes there will be a freeforall, but when it settles out, It will be about the same, most people who are interested in firearms already own and register them. You will see Quite a few that come up for sale "NEVER REGISTERED". I can't wait for all the goodies out there that have never seen the light of day because of the Registry.

good point! I wonder how many previously unregistered firearms would surface from the attics, basements and closests and make there way onto kijiji....could be some beauties for sure...and also stuff you would want someone else to fire first...

Originally Posted by PGH

good point! I wonder how many previously unregistered firearms would surface from the attics, basements and closests and make there way onto kijiji....could be some beauties for sure...and also stuff you would want someone else to fire first...

I don't see any increase in new rifle sales but you are likely right that the used market might see some new offerings.

[SonnyJ]

Originally Posted by PGH

good point! I wonder how many previously unregistered firearms would surface from the attics, basements and closests and make there way onto kijiji....could be some beauties for sure...and also stuff you would want someone else to fire first...

I don't think Kijiji sells firearms but yeah I get your drift.

[backstraps]

I know a lot of very casual used to be shooters who didn't bother to entertain the idea of buying more guns because of the registration. I could see it changing their minds.

[Dick284]

I think all this speculation is just that...better wait and see what the actual legislation is supposed to look like.

Can you say Paperless Registry?


You will still likely have to phone the CFC to see if buddies Licence is still valid...then comes the 20 questions, what make model etc. etc..........

I'm not saying this is a lock...but it has been floated before.

Here is a novel idea, try writing your MP, and stating what you would like to see come fall.

Like the stuff from the old Bill C-301...not Bill C-391.
Sections 91 and 92 of the CCofC gone.
Mag limits gone.

Ah heck ask that the CCof C and Firearms Act be totally re done.

Afterall we have a Participatory Democray.

I think an assurance from the Conservatives that the registry will be abolished is a bit more than speculation......No mention of tweaking as suggested by the dippers....just abolished. Their word is good for me but I've been wrong before.

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

I think an assurance from the Conservatives that the registry will be abolished is a bit more than speculation......No mention of tweaking as suggested by the dippers....just abolished. Their word is good for me but I've been wrong before.

I dont think we will walk away un scathed from this..........The RCMP have allegidly told a firearms importer to hold off on future imports because a bunch of re classifications are in the offing for this fall. Go read it at CGN. I know it's a bit rumorish, but it tracks pretty close to things in the not too distant past.

Heck somewhere I have a quote from Harper himself saying he would turf the hole C-68 debacle, but look at the latest retoric, LGR only.......and what is the back side?

My CPC MP is getting educated every chance I get to talk to him...Seems he thinks only the LGR needs to go...Far from it the whole OiC's need to be pulled, the portions of the FA and CCofC that overide the Charter need to go, etc etc..
There is a lot to ask for and if we don't we will have missed the boat.

Don't pretend that the CPC is firearm friendly...they are firearm neutral at best, and like all politicians they move to where they can get votes.

Remember, the old adage...

"How do you tell when a politician is lying?"

Need I say more.

The proof will be in the fall sitting of Parliment...in the mean time you can throw your thoughts and wishes at your MP...Or perhaps risking taking a bite of a sugar coated chit sandwich...The choice is yours.

I'd love to see that quote from Harper saying he'd turf C68. Not saying it didn't happen but it sure is news to me. I'm not really sure I'd call getting rid of the LGR rhetoric but perhaps I'm just a bit more of an optimist. Nothing wrong with keeping your MP up to speed on things and letting him know your thoughts on the LGR, etc but can't really see the point of getting in his face and calling him a liar. They've made a promise...I expect they'll keep it. I'm sure they will. There's still over three years to fight the other battles...this one is on the table right now. As for the other stuff....I'm not big on rumours.......

[Cowbizzoy]

Originally Posted by Dick284

...Or perhaps risking taking a bite of a sugar coated chit sandwich....

Awesome line..

[MountainTi]

[QUOTE=sikwhiskey;1034138]In the beginning, yes there will be a freeforall, but when it settles out, It will be about the same, most people who are interested in firearms already own and register them. You will see Quite a few that come up for sale "NEVER REGISTERED". I can't wait for all the goodies out there that have never seen the light of day because of the Registry.[/QUOTE]

And to me, these rifles that have never been registered will still be worth more money as they are right now. If the LGR is abolished, do you really think all records will be destroyed? What would you rather own, a previously registered rifle, or one that the government knows nothing about?

Originally Posted by MountainTi

And to me, these rifles that have never been registered will still be worth more money as they are right now. If the LGR is abolished, do you really think all records will be destroyed? What would you rather own, a previously registered rifle, or one that the government knows nothing about?

The day the registry is abolished all info about that registered rifle is useless as no one knows who owns it anymore. I don't see any extra value to previously unregistered rifles at all. They still operate with the premise of put bullet in back, pull trigger and bullet comes out front. Who did or didn't own it yesterday is irrelevant. How would you know if you were buying a previously unregisterd rifle anyhow?

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

The day the registry is abolished all info about that registered rifle is useless as no one knows who owns it anymore. I don't see any extra value to previously unregistered rifles at all. They still operate with the premise of put bullet in back, pull trigger and bullet comes out front. Who did or didn't own it yesterday is irrelevant. How would you know if you were buying a previously unregisterd rifle anyhow?

I'd tell ya (if I actually had any)
Hopefully you are right and the info disappears, but I believe the info will still be floating around somewhere

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

I think an assurance from the Conservatives that the registry will be abolished is a bit more than speculation......No mention of tweaking as suggested by the dippers....just abolished. Their word is good for me but I've been wrong before.

Just read an article in our local paper quoting our MP as saying the registry will be toast, but not to expect any further gun law-related changes. No appetite to change handgun or restricted laws.

[winger7mm]

And to me, these rifles that have never been registered will still be worth more money as they are right now. If the LGR is abolished, do you really think all records will be destroyed? What would you rather own, a previously registered rifle, or one that the government knows nothing about?[/QUOTE]

IMO if its a rifle that the gov didnt know about I dont see an issue with it, most crimes that were commited with a gun going off, not all but alot are solved and the gun taken away and destroyed. So to me buying a un registered rifle would make no difference, as long as the seller and buyer have a pal/pol i would be fine with it. or at least I dont see an issue with it

Originally Posted by MountainTi

I'd tell ya (if I actually had any)
Hopefully you are right and the info disappears, but I believe the info will still be floating around somewhere

It may stick around somewhere for sure but it will be useless. I'll likely sell all my guns the first day like most others will After that, who knows how many times they will trade hands in the following days. All the registry did was tie a firearm to a certain owner. Once that information is a couple hours out of date it's useless. The info about serial number, barrel length, etc is all in your hands with the rifle.....that info on paper doesn't change anything.

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Just read an article in our local paper quoting our MP as saying the registry will be toast, but not to expect any further gun law-related changes. No appetite to change handgun or restricted laws.

Ya, that's what I've repeatedly been told too.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Ya, that's what I've repeatedly been told too.

I can live with that. At least the current flow has been reversed.

[hal53]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Ya, that's what I've repeatedly been told too.

I don't think ANY mention was ever made of reducing/eliminating restrictions on Restricted guns or Hand Guns...only the elimination of the LGR. According to my MP, you will still require a PAL or POL...which myself , I don't mind. There are some people that should be scrutinized somewhat before they own a firearm, ( thinking some of them may be lurking here......)

Originally Posted by Okotokian

I can live with that. At least the current flow has been reversed.

Ya for sure. Right now it's about living up to their promise of abolishing the LGR. In the years to come we can lobby them to look at other assinine parts of our gun laws. Hopefully they listen but I haven't heard any promises other than the LGR.

[hal53]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Ya for sure. Right now it's about living up to their promise of abolishing the LGR. In the years to come we can lobby them to look at other assinine parts of our gun laws. Hopefully they listen but I haven't heard any promises other than the LGR.

Gol Darn TJ!!!!...you have to learn how to type with 1 finger!!!!!....LOL!!! you're too fast!!!

[Dick284]

Just for TJ:

“I was and still am in total agreement with the statement made in the House of Commons by former Reform Leader Preston Manning on 13 June 1995:

“Bill C-68, if passed into law will not be a good law. It will be a blight on the legislative record of the government, a law that fails the three great tests of constitutionality, of effectiveness and of democratic consent to the governed. What should be the fate of a bad a law? It should be repealed ...”

Bill C-68 [The Firearms Act] has proven to be a bad law and has created a bureaucratic nightmare for both gun owners and the government.

As Leader of the Official Opposition, I will use all powers afforded to me as Leader and continue our party’s fight to repeal Bill C-68 and replace it with a firearms control system that is cost effective and respects the rights of Canadians to own and use firearms responsibly.”
- Stephen Harper, January 2002


Hold em to their word's boys.

Again a politician is a politician, and all the old tongue and cheek refrences towards politicians sooner or later seem to apply.

News to me Dick thanks for posting. I guess once the LGR is gone, that's something gun owners should remind Harper of. I'm guessing "replace it with a firearms control system that is cost effective and respects the rights of Canadians to own and use firearms responsibly" might take some time and thought.

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

News to me Dick thanks for posting. I guess once the LGR is gone, that's something gun owners should remind Harper of. I'm guessing "replace it with a firearms control system that is cost effective and respects the rights of Canadians to own and use firearms responsibly" might take some time and thought.

Nope...the NFA has already published such a system, training, qualifying, and gawd forbid a lot of logic...Nothing new here, Remember Bill C-301, that is one thing we can ask for today, it was tabled yet the CPC gutted it because they were in a minority.

If we fail to keep on top of our politicians and hold them to their word, and constantly remind them of the actual numbers of votes we as a firearms community garner, they will saddle up to other voices, and guess where we will end up.

Pretending we can get something later is IMO a bad course of action. Ask for everything to change and hopefully we get 25% of it....Afterall it worked for Wendy and her CFGC...