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02-24-2018, 10:14 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: At the lake
Posts: 2,514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobalong
If true like mentioned in the video probably the biggest display of in-competence and cowardice in law enforcement history. Law enforcement is not paid to stay safe, they are paid to keep us safe. I am sure other cowards will try and defend these cowards, pretty pathetic.
FBI fail numerous times
Sheriff fail numerous times
But lets blame the guns, typical anti-gun bonehead response.
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Sorry but going into an active shooting zone when no one knows what is happening is not a very bright idea. They have SWAT teams for that sort of activity. It's like calling someone a coward for not running into a fully engulfed building and pulling people to safety as apposed to waiting for professional firemen.
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02-24-2018, 10:22 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 5,326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott h
Sorry but going into an active shooting zone when no one knows what is happening is not a very bright idea. They have SWAT teams for that sort of activity. It's like calling someone a coward for not running into a fully engulfed building and pulling people to safety as apposed to waiting for professional firemen.
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No, there is a difference.
But if you think it was smart of them to wait while someone was shooting kids, i don’t know what else to say.
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02-24-2018, 10:27 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Cowtown, agian
Posts: 2,815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sns2
To be a law enforcement officer and stand outside when you know kids are being executed? This is a fairly simple judgement call to make, IMO. If you are a cop and you don't race in, then why are you wearing a badge? Is that not what you sign up for? Somewhere along the line that fall under the heading of "To Protect and Serve". I don't care what network is reporting. This is cut and dry.
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It's starts with the agencies being PC and advertising that everyone "already has what it takes". Not everyone does.
And when the recruiting standards have been lowered to the point that it will pacify lawyers and the snowflakes that believe that they have to be a police officer and don't have what it takes.....
Someone used to say welcome to the decline.
These are the things that can happen when that happens. Start supporting your local police agency that refuses employment to people based on a lack of capability. Stop critizing everything thats done by them without understanding the whole story either.
That could be said about a lot of things.
__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.
- Sir Winston Churchill
A body of men holding themselves accountable to nobody ought not to be trusted by anybody.
-Thomas Paine
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02-24-2018, 10:29 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: At the lake
Posts: 2,514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newview01
No, there is a difference.
But if you think it was smart of them to wait while someone was shooting kids, i don’t know what else to say.
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Those that are the most gu-ho for others to risk their safety are most often the most gutless. Take your hero Trump for example. He calls for others to arm themselves and protect others kids or go over seas into combat. What does he do when he has the chance to prove himself ? He get his dad to get a physician to defer him from being drafted 4 times!!! Those bones spurs must have been awful for him 
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02-24-2018, 10:30 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: At the end of the Thirsty Beaver Trail, Pinsky lake, Alberta.
Posts: 24,586
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You, me, us do not know what the orders or direction the officers were given at that time...the only thing here that is 100% is pure speculation.
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Be careful when you follow the masses, sometimes the "M" is silent... 
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02-24-2018, 10:33 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 5,326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott h
Those that are the most gu-ho for others to risk their safety are most often the most gutless. Take your hero Trump for example. He calls for others to arm themselves and protect others kids or go over seas into combat. What does he do when he has the chance to prove himself ? He get his dad to get a physician to defer him from being drafted 4 times!!! Those bones spurs must have been awful for him |
Answer one question -
Was it smart for these people to wait outside while someone was inside shooting children?
Edit - Why do you say Trump is my hero? I have never stated or insinuated that.
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02-24-2018, 10:50 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Calgary, AB
Posts: 1,021
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 58thecat
You, me, us do not know what the orders or direction the officers were given at that time...
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Ummmm, actually... We do. But you're too stubborn to watch the "fake news", so crawl back under your rock.
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02-24-2018, 10:53 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,917
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 58thecat
You, me, us do not know what the orders or direction the officers were given at that time...the only thing here that is 100% is pure speculation.
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So the fellow lost his job for following orders?
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02-24-2018, 10:54 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: My House
Posts: 13,459
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 58thecat
You, me, us do not know what the orders or direction the officers were given at that time...the only thing here that is 100% is pure speculation.
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No it is not speculation. I just watched an interview with the Director of the NASRA (National Association of School Resource Officers). He emphatically said that all SROs are trained to immediately confront the shooter whether in the building or outside. He was then questioned as to whether law enforcement responding to the call should have waited. He said all LEOs called to a shooting at a school, know because of recent history that they are to assume it is an active shooting, and immediate confrontation is required.
US and Canadian sources have been quoted. It is clear how they are to respond - confront the guy shooting kids asap - but most of us knew that anyhow.
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02-24-2018, 10:55 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Edmonton Area
Posts: 4,102
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The difference is knowlege at the time
If the officers on scene believed it was an active shooter, they must enter to attempt to stop the threat. Now if they thought it was an armed and barricades individual with hostages then the right thing to do would be to hold and wait for SWAT. Once there is reasonable knowledge that people are actively being injured or killed the officers have a sworn duty to do what’s necessary to stop the person causing the injury or death.
If reports are accurate and a very solid rational isn’t provided I will be very surprised if the 4 officer are not charged criminally and then sued.
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02-24-2018, 10:59 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Edmonton Area
Posts: 4,102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 58thecat
You, me, us do not know what the orders or direction the officers were given at that time...the only thing here that is 100% is pure speculation.
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Even if a supervisor via radio told the officers on scene to hold, that does not remove them from their legal obligation to act.
If the officer knew it was an active shooter then any order to hold or to not stop the threat would be an unlawful order.
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02-24-2018, 11:05 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wildbill
Yup........have another drink!
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Don't drink. There was about a 10 year old boy who was holding a door in one of the rooms to keep the gunman out and was shot 5 times but lived. 4 trained police (supposedly) with firearms hid behind cars waiting for the killing to stop. After reading some of your comments it does not surprise me that you would identify with the cowards while children were being killed.
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02-24-2018, 11:58 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Cowtown, agian
Posts: 2,815
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And the AO Train of Assumptions leaves the tracks at full steam errantly piloted at the Village of Buffoonery with the outcome predictable..........again.
__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.
- Sir Winston Churchill
A body of men holding themselves accountable to nobody ought not to be trusted by anybody.
-Thomas Paine
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02-24-2018, 12:05 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: West Central Alberta
Posts: 6,670
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rem338win
And the AO Train of Assumptions leaves the tracks at full steam errantly piloted at the Village of Buffoonery with the outcome predictable..........again.
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Thanks for the chuckle.
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02-24-2018, 12:05 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: At the end of the Thirsty Beaver Trail, Pinsky lake, Alberta.
Posts: 24,586
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rem338win
And the AO Train of Assumptions leaves the tracks at full steam errantly piloted at the Village of Buffoonery with the outcome predictable..........again.
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Somethings are what they are. You know what happens when we assume. 
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Be careful when you follow the masses, sometimes the "M" is silent...
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02-24-2018, 12:15 PM
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Outside of Onoway
Posts: 821
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I am sure that the officers that did not go in will be reliving their decision until the end of their days and whatever punishment they will soon face will pale in comparison. That said, they were employed as first responders. Law enforcement officers. They were hired as protectors and defenders and they failed. Yes I believe they should have died for those kids in there, it’s what I expect them to do as part of their job. I know a few first responders and they all have a visceral pride in what they do and while they know fear, they understand what their responsibilities are when they pursue careers in law enforcement.
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IT'S COMING RIGHT FOR US!!!!!!!
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02-24-2018, 12:51 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Cowtown, agian
Posts: 2,815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Attilathecanuk
I am sure that the officers that did not go in will be reliving their decision until the end of their days and whatever punishment they will soon face will pale in comparison. That said, they were employed as first responders. Law enforcement officers. They were hired as protectors and defenders and they failed. Yes I believe they should have died for those kids in there, it’s what I expect them to do as part of their job. I know a few first responders and they all have a visceral pride in what they do and while they know fear, they understand what their responsibilities are when they pursue careers in law enforcement.
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Other side of the coin: you think you have the right to put a price on life? Theirs is only a salary? You can have an expectation on their life?
That resembles tyranny.
Did you also know that the annual salary is under 40k? Noteworthy.
Did they know what they were responding to? Have we heard the 911 calls? The radio transmissions? Orders? Rules of Engagement made?
I haven't seen anything unequivocal on those points.
That said I don't even know what they swore to.
Myself, I'm not one to hesitate to fight in whatever manner, with whatever risk, to save a life. My fear isn't dying; it's causing or allowing needless death. I'd rather be a memory than have to fight with those dark memories.
So if I did not rush into the frey knowing that these kids were being attacked so cowardly I'd be struck.
Also, if I rushed in and the barricaded coward mowed down many more because of my actions I would equally be devastated.
These are a few of the choices and questions that might had to be considered.
I would also say don't trust that media. They have no obligation to be objective and give us the truth. They've proven this to us weekly.
Our society has become so enamored with our opinions and their perceived value that we've become the mob. Little facts, lots opinions, motivated by assumptions, but armed to the teeth with pitchforks and torches and ready to burn things.
__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.
- Sir Winston Churchill
A body of men holding themselves accountable to nobody ought not to be trusted by anybody.
-Thomas Paine
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02-24-2018, 12:51 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Vulcan Ab
Posts: 3,871
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Attilathecanuk
I am sure that the officers that did not go in will be reliving their decision until the end of their days and whatever punishment they will soon face will pale in comparison. That said, they were employed as first responders. Law enforcement officers. They were hired as protectors and defenders and they failed. Yes I believe they should have died for those kids in there, it’s what I expect them to do as part of their job. I know a few first responders and they all have a visceral pride in what they do and while they know fear, they understand what their responsibilities are when they pursue careers in law enforcement.
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^^^^Insert very loud and long clapping. While cowards show cowardice, Kids are dying. NO EXCUSE no matter what B.S. is spewed. Even a caveman would protect children. It's called being a human. Protect the weak!!
__________________
"It's like bragging that it's 10 CENTIMETERS LONG! (when really, it's 4" dude, settle down)"
Huntinstuff
"Me neither but it's all in the eye of the beer holder"
norwestalta
.....out of bounds.....but funny none the less!
LC
"Funny how when a bear eats another bear, no one bats an eye, but......
when a human eats another human, people act like it's the end if the friggin world. News coverage, tweets, blogs, outrage, Piers Morgan etcetc.
Go figure." -Huntinstuff
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02-24-2018, 01:29 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Calgary, AB
Posts: 1,021
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Hear hear !!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by vcmm
^^^^Insert very loud and long clapping. While cowards show cowardice, Kids are dying. NO EXCUSE no matter what B.S. is spewed. Even a caveman would protect children. It's called being a human. Protect the weak!!
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02-24-2018, 01:30 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Vulcan Ab
Posts: 3,871
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FishOutOfWater
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Thank you!!
__________________
"It's like bragging that it's 10 CENTIMETERS LONG! (when really, it's 4" dude, settle down)"
Huntinstuff
"Me neither but it's all in the eye of the beer holder"
norwestalta
.....out of bounds.....but funny none the less!
LC
"Funny how when a bear eats another bear, no one bats an eye, but......
when a human eats another human, people act like it's the end if the friggin world. News coverage, tweets, blogs, outrage, Piers Morgan etcetc.
Go figure." -Huntinstuff
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02-24-2018, 02:48 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: At the lake
Posts: 2,514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vcmm
^^^^Insert very loud and long clapping. While cowards show cowardice, Kids are dying. NO EXCUSE no matter what B.S. is spewed. Even a caveman would protect children. It's called being a human. Protect the weak!!
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Unfortunately you are correct they don't appear to care about their children down in the USA as they refuse to make any meaningful changes to their gun laws.
Every time this happens all they seem to be able to do is pray......it doesn't seem to be working and they don't seem bright enough to learn. We'll have this thread restarted soon when this happens again next month. I wonder how many kids it'll be next time..... 
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02-24-2018, 03:12 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 5,326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott h
Unfortunately you are correct they don't appear to care about their children down in the USA as they refuse to make any meaningful changes to their gun laws.
Every time this happens all they seem to be able to do is pray......it doesn't seem to be working and they don't seem bright enough to learn. We'll have this thread restarted soon when this happens again next month. I wonder how many kids it'll be next time..... |
Tell me what law should be in place that would prevent someone from obtaining a firearm and going on a shooting spree?
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02-24-2018, 03:46 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Cowtown, agian
Posts: 2,815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newview01
Tell me what law should be in place that would prevent someone from obtaining a firearm and going on a shooting spree?
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Ban crazy?
"Pull yourself together Bill! Don't you know it's illegal to hear voices, believe you're a deity, and claim you're capable of seeing into people's future evil ambitions?!
What's that? Well of course you can't do any harm unless you've got access to a gun. What's your plan with that machete, Bill?"
__________________
The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.
- Sir Winston Churchill
A body of men holding themselves accountable to nobody ought not to be trusted by anybody.
-Thomas Paine
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02-24-2018, 04:03 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,425
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The real hero’s in all of this are the kids. Maybe we should listen to what they want for their futures.
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02-24-2018, 04:28 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 5,326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MyAlberta
The real hero’s in all of this are the kids. Maybe we should listen to what they want for their futures.
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Why don't we drop the voting age to 14 then.
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02-24-2018, 05:24 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sns2
No it is not speculation. I just watched an interview with the Director of the NASRA (National Association of School Resource Officers). He emphatically said that all SROs are trained to immediately confront the shooter whether in the building or outside. He was then questioned as to whether law enforcement responding to the call should have waited. He said all LEOs called to a shooting at a school, know because of recent history that they are to assume it is an active shooting, and immediate confrontation is required.
US and Canadian sources have been quoted. It is clear how they are to respond - confront the guy shooting kids asap - but most of us knew that anyhow.
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Confirmation is nice, common sense approach. For all you supporters of cowards make you sure you read the statement above a few times so it sinks in. You don't offer up children in sacrifice for your cowardice.
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02-24-2018, 05:25 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vcmm
^^^^insert very loud and long clapping. While cowards show cowardice, kids are dying. No excuse no matter what b.s. Is spewed. Even a caveman would protect children. It's called being a human. Protect the weak!!
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x100.
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02-24-2018, 05:29 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: At the lake
Posts: 2,514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newview01
Tell me what law should be in place that would prevent someone from obtaining a firearm and going on a shooting spree?
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Maybe the US could adopt laws similiar to ;
Canada
Australia
New Zealand
United Kingdom
France
Sweden
Norway
Etc......
They could pretty much emulate any country cuz when you're the worst in the world you've got no were to go but up
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02-24-2018, 05:31 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 5,326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott h
Maybe the US could adopt laws similiar to ;
Canada
Australia
New Zealand
United Kingdom
France
Sweden
Norway
Etc......
They could pretty much emulate any country cuz when you're the worst in the world you've got no were to go but up |
Is it the laws that prevent mass shootings, or the culture? I recall a pretty serious incident some years ago in Norway?
And do you really want laws similar to UK / Australia?
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02-24-2018, 06:02 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: At the lake
Posts: 2,514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newview01
Is it the laws that prevent mass shootings, or the culture? I recall a pretty serious incident some years ago in Norway?
And do you really want laws similar to UK / Australia?
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Some years ago in Norway......compare that to the number of incidents in the US. It can happen in any country, but unlike Americans others seem to learn and fix their problems.
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