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  #1  
Old 05-10-2014, 04:54 PM
mtbkr mtbkr is offline
 
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Default .270 or .308 for Beginner Rifleman

Hi all,
I'm just getting into shooting and deer/elk hunting and looking to buy my first hunting rifle. Will certainly be picking up a .22 for practicing lots at the range.

I'm looking to buy both the .22 and the hunting rifle now so I can spend the next few months practicing my shot before hunting season.
I was set on a Savage 111 Trophy Hunter Package in .270 win (moderate recoil, just hard-hitting enough for elk, flat shooting...). However, someone was trying to convince me to pick up a .308 so I could buy cheap surplus ammo so as to be able to practice a lot with the big rifle.

My question: Buy the .22 and the .270 - practice tons with .22 and some with .270 OR...
...Buy .22 and .308 and practice lots with each.

Thanks all for the advice!!

Cheers
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  #2  
Old 05-10-2014, 05:21 PM
gtr gtr is offline
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Smile choices or preference

A 308 will do pretty much what a 270 will do.
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Old 05-10-2014, 06:02 PM
mtbkr mtbkr is offline
 
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Originally Posted by gtr View Post
A 308 will do pretty much what a 270 will do.
Thanks gtr,

I guess another related question is: Would it be a bad idea to feed your prized rifle with surplus ammo when practicing? Anyone worry about it being corrosive or otherwise damaging?
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  #4  
Old 05-10-2014, 06:15 PM
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sns2 sns2 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbkr View Post
Thanks gtr,

I guess another related question is: Would it be a bad idea to feed your prized rifle with surplus ammo when practicing? Anyone worry about it being corrosive or otherwise damaging?
Get the 270 and you can buy factory ammo for $20 box. Forget that corrosive stuff.

I like both cartridges you are pondering, but the 270 is just as hard hitting and a little flatter shooting, but the real world difference is negligible. No moose ever jumped up and argued that one is better than the other. Seriously.
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  #5  
Old 05-10-2014, 07:24 PM
1886 1886 is offline
 
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They are both good calibers. Have owned and shot both of them. The only advantage the 308 has is availability of heavier bullets if you desire them.
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  #6  
Old 05-10-2014, 07:39 PM
stevens stevens is offline
 
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I don't think you can go wrong with a .308
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Old 05-10-2014, 07:40 PM
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Mateo Mateo is offline
 
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Both really great calibers. The .270 uses the same case as the 30-06, and the 30-06 is just a longer cased .308. You will get higher velocities out of the .270 because of the bigger case, that being said, the 308 won't be lacking anything for hunting, unless you really want to get into long range hunting like 500+ yards. You can't go wrong with either. The .308 is lower recoil. But not by much. Whatever you decide, send me a message when you get it and I'd be happy to do some reloads up for you so you can take full advantage of the accuracy these guns are capable of if you aren't happy with a factory round. I personally hunt with the .270.
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  #8  
Old 05-10-2014, 08:36 PM
mtbkr mtbkr is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Mateo View Post
Both really great calibers. The .270 uses the same case as the 30-06, and the 30-06 is just a longer cased .308. You will get higher velocities out of the .270 because of the bigger case, that being said, the 308 won't be lacking anything for hunting, unless you really want to get into long range hunting like 500+ yards. You can't go wrong with either. The .308 is lower recoil. But not by much. Whatever you decide, send me a message when you get it and I'd be happy to do some reloads up for you so you can take full advantage of the accuracy these guns are capable of if you aren't happy with a factory round. I personally hunt with the .270.

Thanks for all the info everyone!
I understand the .270 to be a flatter shooting cartridge while the .308 would have some heavier bullets available. Realistically I'm sure I will be perfectly happy hunting with either - as a beginner I won't be taking any particularily long shots at game.

I guess what it comes down to is should I opt for the .308 so I can shoot it more as surplus ammo is available? I simply don't know much about surplus ammo. Will it ALL be corrosive? ...Potentially damaging to a nice rifle? I do want to spend some time with this gun at the range, just don't know if I should buy surplus ammo for practicing my shot

Thanks everyone!
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  #9  
Old 05-10-2014, 09:45 PM
1886 1886 is offline
 
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No not all surplus ammo is corrosive. If your getting it from a sporting goods store you should just be able to ask them if it is.
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  #10  
Old 05-10-2014, 09:48 PM
1886 1886 is offline
 
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Personally I have never used any surplus ammo. In my 308 I shoot 150 grain core lock ammo. 21.99 a box and you can reload the brass as well.
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  #11  
Old 05-10-2014, 09:56 PM
raab raab is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbkr View Post
Hi all,
I'm just getting into shooting and deer/elk hunting and looking to buy my first hunting rifle. Will certainly be picking up a .22 for practicing lots at the range.

I'm looking to buy both the .22 and the hunting rifle now so I can spend the next few months practicing my shot before hunting season.
I was set on a Savage 111 Trophy Hunter Package in .270 win (moderate recoil, just hard-hitting enough for elk, flat shooting...). However, someone was trying to convince me to pick up a .308 so I could buy cheap surplus ammo so as to be able to practice a lot with the big rifle.

My question: Buy the .22 and the .270 - practice tons with .22 and some with .270 OR...
...Buy .22 and .308 and practice lots with each.

Thanks all for the advice!!

Cheers
If you ever want to get into long range shooting and reloading get the .308. The Savage is an alright action to build on as theres parts everywhere and .308 is the most common 1k calibre out there. If you just want to go out and hunt, then it doesn't matter, both will get the job done with similar recoil. Here's a nice chart on recoil and the differences between calibres http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm
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  #12  
Old 05-10-2014, 10:08 PM
raab raab is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbkr View Post
Thanks for all the info everyone!
I understand the .270 to be a flatter shooting cartridge while the .308 would have some heavier bullets available. Realistically I'm sure I will be perfectly happy hunting with either - as a beginner I won't be taking any particularily long shots at game.

I guess what it comes down to is should I opt for the .308 so I can shoot it more as surplus ammo is available? I simply don't know much about surplus ammo. Will it ALL be corrosive? ...Potentially damaging to a nice rifle? I do want to spend some time with this gun at the range, just don't know if I should buy surplus ammo for practicing my shot

Thanks everyone!
Shooting surplus ammo out of a gun you care about is like putting dirty gas in a car you care about. Both may get the job done but at what cost? Personally I wouldn't shoot it in a hunting/target rifle. In an SKS, SVT, or cheap military rifles sure. The federal blue box ammo is around 20 bucks for both the 270 and 308. Shoot your 22 lots and buy decent ammo for your bolt action. Or if you really want to get into shooting a lot look into reloading. Will give you way better groupings and it saves you a bit of coin once you reload enough.
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  #13  
Old 05-10-2014, 10:30 PM
260 Rem 260 Rem is offline
 
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270 seems to get best performance with a 130gr bullet whereas the 308 is very capable in the 150 - 175 gr range. I would choose the 308.
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  #14  
Old 05-10-2014, 10:42 PM
Lefty Lefty is offline
 
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Both are great cartridges. Both are relatively cheap to buy for. Head down to the store you'll be shopping at and compare prices and selection between the two. Regular ammo for the 308 is cheap enough I wouldn't bother using the surplus stuff as I would always have the rifle sighted in for ammo that will work on game. One difference between the cartridges is that the 308 comes in a shorter action. Handle rifles in each caliber and you might find one that balances and feels better to you, and if that happens it make the decision easier.
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  #15  
Old 05-10-2014, 11:22 PM
sikwhiskey sikwhiskey is offline
 
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I haven't seen corrosive 308 in at least 10 years, even if you did find some and shot it out of your bolt action, clean it after use, no problem.
I'd pick 308, but I'm bias.
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  #16  
Old 05-10-2014, 11:24 PM
bsmitty27 bsmitty27 is offline
 
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Like lefty said
short action vs long action.
Little less recoil 308
Flatter 270
Not much differance
Great idea to get the 22, you can streach those little guys out there further than you think.
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  #17  
Old 05-10-2014, 11:32 PM
Rockman Rockman is offline
 
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A question for those with experience, would you consider the Norinco crates of 7.62x51 surplus? As in, stuff you wouldn't run in a decent bolt hunting gun?
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  #18  
Old 05-10-2014, 11:54 PM
260 Rem 260 Rem is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockman View Post
A question for those with experience, would you consider the Norinco crates of 7.62x51 surplus? As in, stuff you wouldn't run in a decent bolt hunting gun?
It's your gun, so you decide what to feed it. I have never, and will never, shoot any milsurp in any of my 308's. . . primarily, because I doubt the accuracy potential (which for me, is important). My preference is to hit what I aim at with one shot, rather than to plunk 20 down in the general area. I use the term "pattern" as opposed to "group" when referencing targets shot with milsurp ... Perhaps that is a bit harsh, perhaps not? .
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  #19  
Old 05-11-2014, 09:23 AM
petew petew is offline
 
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If I was to buy my first rifle again, I would seriously consider a 7mm08.
That said I would be also looking at a 270, 30-06, and a 308, and let price and availability persuade me on what one to buy.
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  #20  
Old 05-11-2014, 11:11 AM
1886 1886 is offline
 
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The military used the 308 for years as a sniper rifle. They didn't build special ammo for it, they used the same as every other rifle and there was some amazing shots made with it. The military surplus ammo made in the USA is produced by the major ammo companies ( winchester, umc-Remington ) and I'm sure they wouldn't make a sub grade ammo just for them. Just my opinion.
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  #21  
Old 05-11-2014, 11:27 AM
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I shoot corrosive ammo regularly in many of my firearms, and nothing but in some of them, never had a problem with it, but I clean my guns propely whenever I shoot them.
There seems to be some real myths out there as far as corrosive ammo and MILSURP ammo not being accurate.

I've seen 308 Portuguese and Yugoslavian stuff regularly shoot very well at 500 and even 1,000 yards with a good rifle from field positions, and a couple of older .303's and 308 military guns shoot the stuff as well.

Clean it properly and all is good.
As far as the 270/308 argument goes, but are great cartridges, I can't like the 270 however for nothing more than being biased towards my favourite- the 308!
Cat
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  #22  
Old 05-11-2014, 11:38 AM
Blackwolf Blackwolf is offline
 
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I have both, but prefer the .308 Its a savage 99, and shoots very well out to 400 yards. I do not shoot anything other than hunting loads in her, currently I'm playing with a 130 grain TTSX, with 46 grains of IMR 3031. Spits them out at 3200 fps, on chronograph. At 200 yards I place them one bullet on top of the other. (1/8th group) I also use a 150 grain SST for bigger game. 45 grains of 3031 spits them at 3,000 fps. not as tight groups but still 1/4 " groups at 200 yards.
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  #23  
Old 05-11-2014, 12:11 PM
M4verick M4verick is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petew View Post
If I was to buy my first rifle again, I would seriously consider a 7mm08.
That said I would be also looking at a 270, 30-06, and a 308, and let price and availability persuade me on what one to buy.
Just bought a 7mm-08. Love it! Haven't used it for hunting yet but I am excited to. The faster bullet than the .308, bigger bullet than .270 and like half the recoil of a 30-06. They are gradually becoming more popular too. At the end of the day, shot placement is what knocks animals down.
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  #24  
Old 05-11-2014, 12:36 PM
Shrike Shrike is offline
 
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First hunting rifle?
7-08 probably the best choice, less recoil then .308 and .270 and every bit as deadly.
You will be good out to 400 yards.
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  #25  
Old 05-11-2014, 03:11 PM
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fordtruckin fordtruckin is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1886 View Post
The military used the 308 for years as a sniper rifle. They didn't build special ammo for it, they used the same as every other rifle and there was some amazing shots made with it. The military surplus ammo made in the USA is produced by the major ammo companies ( winchester, umc-Remington ) and I'm sure they wouldn't make a sub grade ammo just for them. Just my opinion.
The US Military does not use regular M80 147gr 7.62 ammo in its "sniper" rifles. They use M118LR 175gr Sierra Match King Hollow Point Boat Tail. The ammo is made at the Lake City Army Ammunition Plant. The M80 stuff can be used in a pinch but DM's and Shooters stick with the M118LR if they have a choice. This also may depend on the service as the AMU and Marine Corps often hand load rounds in house to get even better accuracy.

the Lake City AAP is owned by the US Government but operated by Alliant Techsystems Inc (ATK).
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  #26  
Old 05-11-2014, 04:04 PM
mtbkr mtbkr is offline
 
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Just want to say a big thanks to everyone who chimed in here. Lots of good info and lots to think about so thank you all!
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  #27  
Old 05-11-2014, 04:09 PM
1886 1886 is offline
 
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My point was to the guy that asked about shooting military surplus ammo in a 308. Any manufacturer of ammo for the military ( wether snipe or regular army) does not make poor quality ammo. It has to be reliable and accurate enough to hit its target.
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Old 05-11-2014, 05:49 PM
Rockman Rockman is offline
 
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Yep, thanks for the good replies and info. Good learning...
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  #29  
Old 05-12-2014, 01:13 AM
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wasteland.soldier wasteland.soldier is offline
 
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I could never really find a straight answer online about the milsurp 7.62x51 stuff out of a .308. I found a lot of talk about "headspaces", and as I'm far from being a gunsmith, I didn't really follow the discussion. My understanding was that there are a few thousandths of an inch difference between the civilian and military versions in some dimensions, and that it probably wouldn't be a problem, but could be if you were on the outer edges of tolerance for your firearm and ammo at the same time.

I have a .308, have been shooting for just a few years, and find that it's still quite a bit more accurate than I am from field positions.

In the end, I'd agree with the above poster. Go to whatever is the most convenient ammo store for you (for me it's the Walmart across the street, although there's also a close Canadian Tire), and buy whichever caliber is better or more cheaply stocked.
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  #30  
Old 05-12-2014, 02:19 AM
hollowedpoint hollowedpoint is offline
 
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Theres a far better selection of firearms in .308!
Like m14's, rem 700, etc!
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