FIRST shotgun purchase; Would like to talk some things over with the "pros"

[millsboy79]

Hi there, I just received my PAL and am pretty sure my first purchase will be a 12ga shotgun. Will be going hunting for waterfowl, and other birds. I have been doing a lot of reading on here and other forums as well as watching a number of reviews on youtube. Sometimes I feel I find solid information, but other times I find it raises more questions than it answers.

Most recently was 3 vs 3.5" chambered guns. They were discussing the pluses for the 3.5 does not out way the negatives. They talked about extra weight and how the gun itself handled. Personally I would have to think 3.5 is better since you have more options.

I am pretty sure that I want to buy an auto-loader but if someone wants to make a case for a pump or over under, I am always happy to learn.

The current front runner is the Stoeger 3500 because of price point and inertia drive done by benelli as apposed to gas. Like most people I would rather the Super Vinci (go big or go home right) but I am not ready to drop that much money at this point.

I know that fit is of the utmost importance so I plan a day at bass pro to shoulder a few and see what I like.

I hope to get all kinds of feedback here and look forward to learning what you have to share.

[elkhunter11]

Buy a shotgun that fits you, the best made shotgun in the world isn't of much use to you, if it doesn't fit.

[catnthehat]

For an all around gun, any action will do as long as the gun fits.
if a person is going to be doing more pass shooting and higher volume
( read longer shots) , then a semi will be better over the course of a day because of the recoil factor.

From a blind, weight is actually a good thing as well, because it absorbs recoil and you don't have to pack the gun around like upland hunting.

However, if you are jump shooting, a lighter gun is preferred by many .

I have shot many of the newer semis and they are pretty good for the most part, but no better IMO than an 1100 Remington, simply because to realize the difference one has to fire a lot of ammo to notice the difference.

I don't hunt with a semi, in fact I don't hunt very much with a 12 bore , and when I do it's a SXS hammer gun.
Most of my waterfowl hunting these days is done with a 20 over decoys.

Many if my friends use older 1100's or newer semi autos like the Maxis or Extrema, and they all think theirs are the best!

However, like EH11 stated, make sure it fits- most of the newer guns have shims and spacers to help with this.
Cat

[qwert]

http://www.chuckhawks.com/index2c.shotguns.htm

[catnthehat]

He's looking for real world feedback, not something from Chuck Hawkes that may or may not be simply cut and pasted.

I once asked a factory shooter who had gone from one of fthe biggest selling companies in the world to a smaller company, what the difference was in the respective semi's o truthfully.
" The biggest difference in the fact that one costs 4 timems as much as the other, they both work fine, but you will not notice the difference in weight or cycling from brand X to brand Y unless you shoot 500 birds in a day"
He shoots the cheap $400 guns just as well as the other brand costing $1,900 .
THAT is about as truthful as a person can get.
He was released because o0f health issues, BTW, nothing else....
Cat

[gopher]

1100s made a nice single shot.

[duck duck goose]

For a first gun I would suggest a Remmington 870. It is pretty much the standard 12ga across the board. I realize that it is not an autoloader like you were looking for but for the price and the field proven reliability you really can't go wrong.

I would suggest you start here, shoot the pump gun for a few years (chambered in 3") to again save money, and figure out exactly what you want to do with your shotgun. In a couple years hopefully you can save up some decent coin and then dump that into a high end (Browning, Benelli, Beretta) autoloader if that's what you decide you want. Although I am sure I am missing some brand that someone will politely remind me of.

After you gain a couple years of experience looking down the barrel of an 870 you will be able to figure out what you like the best, and what you should invest in. I have been hunting waterfowl HARD for the past 6 years and my gun is only chambered for 3", and I will be the first to tell you that if you are skyblastin or missing you could be shooting 6" shells and it isn't going to matter. With this in mind, don't worry too much about shell size as you do about your personal shooting ability. Practise with the gun you have and shoot the birds in the lips and you will put more birds on the ground then any black cloud 3.5" slinging cowboy out there. Last winter I shot 2 3/4 BB shells out of a full choke at honkers and I'll tell you what, if you can get the birds to land on your lap, 2 3/4 is all you need. (Someone have at me for this statement now too)

Back to your idea for a Stoger, I know a couple of guys who shoot their pump guns, and although I have never seen a Stoger auto perform, based on the performance of their pump guns I would not recomend one. Although the price is right I have seen these guns jam more times than any other. This is why I come full circle to the 870. Save some money on the first gun and get an 870. These things are rock solid and you will die long before this gun does. Then save your money and get yourself a high end gun. If you decide waterfowl is your game then get a new fancy autoloader, and if you decide you would rather chase pheasants then go find a nice O/U 20ga and enjoy that.

Just my two cents, but I hope I gave you something to think about.

[Mohr74]

Agree with Cat on the 1100's. I've shot one for years out of a blind until recently. One thing to consider with any auto loader is you must must must keep them clean or you will have problems. It's pretty easy especially in a blind out in a dirty stubble field to get dirt and dust into your action and if it's cold they can get a little sticky. More than once I found myself stripping, cleaning my semiautos and when there are birds in the air that is not a good feeling. Switched back to a pump a couple years ago for this reason. Shoot a Benelli Nova, nothing fancy but it's bulletproof and troublefree. Like the guys say whatever you choose pick something that shoulders and points nice for you. Good luck.

[32-40win]

May be a notion for you to go out to Dewinton, to the Cgy Trap & Skeet club and see what people have out there for you to check out. Or even out to the shotgun range at Homestead on a weekend. Quite sure you will find a variety of guns people will let you try out. Likely cost you some ammo & clays. Whether the Stoeger 3500 is a good choice or not, may be a bit up in the air yet, it is only a year old. The 2000 was a bit iffy, lots of good ones, perhaps lots of questionable ones, in what I have read on them. They have a Benelli style action, but are not a Benelli, so to speak. They claim they made a lot of improvements. There are reasons for the price difference.
You can read a lot on all the shotguns , some hate this one, some hate that one, some are brand ho's. They all function, or they'd be off the market pretty quick. Some folk put two boxes a year thru them, some will shoot a skid or two in a year. And they all have a problem here and there, they are a mass production item.

[rwm1273]

Before I bought my first shotgun, I used to use a buddy's 1100. It shot fine, and I was able to get birds and shoot clays just fine, but I always bruised my finger on the trigger guard.

I have an Auto 5, and it shoots like a dream. And I don't have an issue with the trigger guard hitting my fingers. I can shoot many boxes of ammo when out shooting clays, and the only thing sore is my back from reloading the thrower.

I also have a couple mossburg semis, and a sxs and they all shoot fine.

[millsboy79]

Some definite good advise. I may indeed end up with a pump, just in the reading the stoeger 3500 sounded like a great gun for the buck. I know it is all hype but it did win NRA shotgun of the year this year. HAHAHA but like everyone knows and has said, I need to go have a look and feel what fits the best.

Thanks again and I will keep all posted what I end up getting.

[catnthehat]

Lefdt to right:
Remington 1100 2 3/4" 12 guage, F.A.I.R. 3" O/U 20 gauge, Remington 870 pump 12 guage 3"
They all work fine if you hit the birds properly!

Cat

Originally Posted by millsboy79

The current front runner is the Stoeger 3500 because of price point and inertia drive done by benelli as apposed to gas. Like most people I would rather the Super Vinci (go big or go home right) but I am not ready to drop that much money at this point.

.

I had the opportunity to shoot nearly every shotgun in the Stoeger family last week and I must say that the 3500 did not impress me. It would not eject trap loads consistently and I realy didn't like the way it felt. The one shotgun that really impressed me though was the A400 Xtreme. It will definitely be my next purchase.

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Lefdt to right:
Remington 1100 2 3/4" 12 guage, F.A.I.R. 3" O/U 20 gauge, Remington 870 pump 12 guage 3"
They all work fine if you hit the birds properly!

Cat

Who is the senior citizen in the middle? Is that your grandpa?

[millsboy79]

I do like the Beretta but $1800 is more than double what I want to spend on my first shotgun.

[ShawnM]

Do yourself a favor and forget the semi-autos right now. You need experience shooting and hunting more than you need a shotgun that cycles itself...

Buy an expensive pump ($600-$700) and count yourself lucky for all the birds you bag. A Browning BPS will last a lifetime and it will never let you down in the field. Don't get a Remington because they are really crappy at the moment.

A pump will survive anything you can dish it in the field. A semi-auto gives you a lot more to think about.

Originally Posted by millsboy79

I do like the Beretta but $1800 is more than double what I want to spend on my first shotgun.

If budget is the deciding factor, I'd go with a high-quality pump like the Super Nova then.

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

If budget is the deciding factor, I'd go with a high-quality pump like the Super Nova then.

BINGO! Sheephunter is a really smart guy (because he and I usually agree). Listen to Sheephunter!

Originally Posted by ShawnM

BINGO! Sheephunter is a really smart guy (because he and I usually agree). Listen to Sheephunter!

LOL...isn't there a saying about great minds thinking alike.....or is it fools seldom differ. Looks like we posted the same advice at the same time....lol

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by ShawnM

Who is the senior citizen in the middle? Is that your grandpa?

OUCH! That's just cold!!
As far as pumps go, an older Wingmaster cn be had for chea and they are super guns.
The newer 870's, not so much, but of the 15 or so I have bought and sold, I have not seen the issues that have been talked about concerning them.
I HAVE seen them on guns owned by oithers however.....
Cat

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

OUCH! That's just cold!!

LOL, just taking a shot at ya'

Originally Posted by catnthehat

As far as pumps go, an older Wingmaster cn be had for chea and they are super guns.
The newer 870's, not so much, but of the 15 or so
Cat

If you can find one. Plus there's something special about a brand new gun you bought for yourself.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by ShawnM

If you can find one. Plus there's something special about a brand new gun you bought for yourself.

Lots of them around, the thing is, you have to move on them FAST!
I think have 12 or so at the moment, i'm going to be putting some up for sale here pretty quick, as well.
Cat

[Zekeland]

Good idea about the older wingmaster's. Find one that is mint condition and there is your new gun. Spend 50.00 or so to get the barrel bored out for steel and you are good to go. That was my first shotgun, still shoots like a new one.

Don't bother with 3.5 ", regardless if you are pass shooting or shooting late season birds. It is a waste of money!
Get a 3" shotgun, practise at the range , and PATTERN your gun, all of your chokes at different distances and find out how your guns shoots.

Like Cat....I have shot a 20g for the past few seasons, ducks, snows, honkers, early and late season over decoys.

good luck!

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by Zekeland

Good idea about the older wingmaster's. Find one that is mint condition and there is your new gun. Spend 50.00 or so to get the barrel bored out for steel and you are good to go. That was my first shotgun, still shoots like a new one.

Don't bother with 3.5 ", regardless if you are pass shooting or shooting late season birds. It is a waste of money!
Get a 3" shotgun, practise at the range , and PATTERN your gun, all of your chokes at different distances and find out how your guns shoots.

I have to disagree with most of this. Don’t buy an old shotgun and then spend money on making it more modern… Why buy an old gun that you have to spend time hunting down and money making into something that’s useful now? The brand new guns were in the OP’s budget. It’s not like the old Remington Wingmasters are any better than a brand new Nova or BPS…

And if the OP is buying a new pump it is most likely in 3.5” anyway. And calling a 3.5” shotgun a waste of money is dead wrong. It’s not a huge improvement but it’s something. There’s no sense in trying to avoid a 3.5” gun.

[catnthehat]

Many of the Wingmasters came factory with mod chokes , which will handle steel, and many even had screw in's.

3.5" out of a pump is not fun, according to the guys I have talked to that have done it, but out of a semi I'm sure it would be more manageable.
I have many friends who use newer shotguns like the Super Nova and like them, I prefer the older guns like the Wingmaster and model 12, just because
I can't say if they are better or not however.....
Cat

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Many of the Wingmasters came factory with mod chokes , which will handle steel, and many even had screw in's.

3.5" out of a pump is not fun, according to the guys I have talked to that have done it, but out of a semi I'm sure it would be more manageable.
I have many friends who use newer shotguns like the Super Nova and like them, I prefer the older guns like the Wingmaster and model 12, just because
I can't say if they are better or not however.....
Cat

I shoot 10ga out of a pump and if I can handle that then anyone can handle 12ga 3.5".

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by ShawnM

I shoot 10ga out of a pump and if I can handle that then anyone can handle 12ga 3.5".

I don't even shoot 3", let alone 3.5"!!
I thought my shoulder was back in shape this prng, but even 1/3 a round of skeet with a facotry 1 1/8" load without a recoil pad on was enough for me!
Cat

Originally Posted by ShawnM

There’s no sense in trying to avoid a 3.5” gun.

Some good advice there.

[Tundra Monkey]

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=138595

Maybe this one??

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Some good advice there.

Lol kinda sounds like I was shooting them.