Scope deals to good to be true?

[dogslayer403]

Originally Posted by Dean2

Actually it is. Last time I asked them, about 2 months ago, Korth will do warranty work on Cabelas, and Bass Pro Leupold scopes bought here in Canada but as far as I know they still won't work on ones sourced direct out of the states, unless this changes in the last 60 days. There website is pretty emphatic about serving their "Canadian customers" but it would be great news if they are in fact servicing the US scopes now too.

I just recently tryed to get a leupold fixed it was from basspro when they where not using korth (they do now) it was not covered but i still had my receipt and they exchanged it in store so ill give them props for that.

[antmai]

Well, when returning from the US with a new scope in my truck, I was asked at customs the normal how long I was gone, etc. I was also asked if I had purchased or am bringing back any firearms or firearms parts. I answered cleanly and honestly, no.
I love my scope and was pretty enamoured by its price as well!

[Big Thumper]

Originally Posted by antmai

Well, when returning from the US with a new scope in my truck, I was asked at customs the normal how long I was gone, etc. I was also asked if I had purchased or am bringing back any firearms or firearms parts. I answered cleanly and honestly, no.
I love my scope and was pretty enamoured by its price as well!

Not a good idea to put up online an illegal activity?

[Mateo]

Originally Posted by antmai

Well, when returning from the US with a new scope in my truck, I was asked at customs the normal how long I was gone, etc. I was also asked if I had purchased or am bringing back any firearms or firearms parts. I answered cleanly and honestly, no.
I love my scope and was pretty enamoured by its price as well!

How was that cleanly and honestly?

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by antmai

Well, when returning from the US with a new scope in my truck, I was asked at customs the normal how long I was gone, etc. I was also asked if I had purchased or am bringing back any firearms or firearms parts. I answered cleanly and honestly, no.
I love my scope and was pretty enamoured by its price as well!

Canada Customs doesn't care about scopes,but had you run into a Homeland Security checkstop on your way out of the USA, they would have confiscated the scope, and at the very least you would be on the watch list when entering the USA in the future. Or they could ban you from the USA for a time period. They could actually arrest you if they choose to.

[JBE]

Prophet River now has the vx1 on for $269.00 shipped. Great price and they are in Alberta

[JD848]

Homeland security under the old patriot act that ended in 2015 could keep you on the other side for a very long time,scope doesn't help things if they stop you,but they don't need a reason cause they do what they want patriot act or not ,they just changed it to another act.

IF I can't afford the scope I want in Canada I move down a model or wait till I can afford it,i have zero trust south of our border and never felt like that till a few years ago,Lotsa good scopes for sale in our country and help support our store owners .

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by Dick284

Scopes are ITAR controlled items. Without filing the necessary paperwork for import and export, you never land one of them off a US site.

Thought it was only specific scopes ?


Grizz

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams

Thought it was only specific scopes ?


Grizz

It's supposed to be, but let's face it, most retailers are so scared of getting a ton of brick dropped on them from the regulators in such affairs, they just do blanket policies.

Heck Midway won't even give a Canadian the time of day, they have chose to just say no, on everything..

[Bub]

So a friend of a friend transaction I mentioned earlier could have been very legal then? Also, presumably, I can buy a scope, which has no export restrictions, and use one of those mail forwarding services to get one to my door step?

Is there a place I can read on the legalities of all this? Something simplified maybe in terms of what's legal and what's not?

The whole thing seems dumb to me anyway.

On a related note, I found a very good deal on Leupold rings a while back in one of the US online shops (if I remember correctly, it was something like 30% of the lowest price I could find in Canada, shipped). I went ahead and placed an order. Two or three days later I received an email saying that my order had been cancelled and I should contact the manufacturer to locate a local dealer from whom I could crab a set. In the same order I had a picatinny rail (so one order for two items) and they sent a separate email saying, in particular, that my picatinny rail order had been cancelled because it was illegal to export one. If I remember correctly, the rail and rings were for a x-bolt.

Pretty dumb, really. I can buy a gun, but not a scope for it. Not even a damn rail

[antmai]

Originally Posted by Mateo

How was that cleanly and honestly?

Tell me black and white how a scope is a firearm accessory or part?
Bird watching, surveying, fire monitoring... we could keep going.

[antmai]

Originally Posted by Big Thumper

Not a good idea to put up online an illegal activity?

You will need to research illegal activity. It was far from.

[Prophet River]

Originally Posted by antmai

You will need to research illegal activity. It was far from.

Did you have export paperwork?

[Big Thumper]

Originally Posted by antmai

You will need to research illegal activity. It was far from.

If you exported with the proper USA commerce department licensing, you most certainly have broken the law. Not hard to research that!

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by antmai

You will need to research illegal activity. It was far from.

Perhaps not illegal under Canadian law, but Homeland Security may see things differently. And when you are in the USA, it's their laws that you need to obey.

[32-40win]

Optics Planet used to have , may still have an explanation on their site, about US export laws, they got nailed on it, so did Cabelas and Basspro and Midway and a few others. Brownell's has classifications on their site to indicate what they can and cannot export, Leupold used to indicate which models of scopes were and were not exportable, dare say if u ask them, they would tell you.
If you google ITAR prosecutions as per which store, the cases do show up.

[wwbirds]

Not sure why but I cant get it to transfer to the forum from the document I have saved under export Penalties. The gist of it is simple $50,000 to $500,000 for individuals exporting itar items without paperwork. Corporations face up to 5,000,000.

[Bub]

So what does "military specifications" exactly mean?

Originally Posted by ITAR, Category I(a)

Riflescopes manufactured to military specifications (See category XII(c) for controls on night sighting devices.)
...
This category does not cover riflescopes and sighting devices that are not manufactured to military specifications.

And then there is this as well:

Originally Posted by Amendment 78 FR 40630

SUMMARY: The Department of State is amending the International Traffic in Arms Regulations to implement a statutory provision regarding the exemption from licensing for export to Canada of firearms components not exceeding $500 in value.
DATES: This rule is effective July 8, 2013.

This is all I could find from the little free time I had today so far.

[antmai]

So leaving the country the law it is enforced in is what breaks the law? Well, an extradition order might be appropriate here! Interpretations are just that. I feel that US authorities should have a better handle on leaving their country then. No border check or signs leaving the US. I was asked by the authorities,and i gave them an honest answer. If you all want to flame me, warm up those torches!

Hey, dont tell anyone...i think i did 107 on the henday today.

[wwbirds]

The dudes from Homeland Security very often watch sporting goods store for Canadians and there are some indications they use plate scanners in those lots to select who is more likely to have firearms ammunitions scopes or other ITAR items. We have known of several people to get intercepted at the border before they get to Canada customs and you aren't going to like the reception you get as a non resident of the US if found in possession of restricted goods requiring export permits. What the hey we have been warning people for probably 3 years on the forum so if you want to play I say go for it. Some people only learn by first hand experience.

[Bub]

You can warn people to avoid buying in the States or you can help them figure out what can actually be bought and taken out of the country without any additional paperwork. Do rimfire scopes fall under this law? Probably not. And so do not many others I figure.

Now if someone can tell me what "military specifications" means, that would be great.

[Prophet River]

Originally Posted by Bub

You can warn people to avoid buying in the States or you can help them figure out what can actually be bought and taken out of the country without any additional paperwork. Do rimfire scopes fall under this law? Probably not. And so do not many others I figure.

Now if someone can tell me what "military specifications" means, that would be great.

All rifle scopes need paperwork. Even a 29.00 crickett scope that is close to a toy. Some military type scopes may require US state paperwork on top of the commerce department license and some may be prohibited for any export. Even some spotting scopes need the license (generally, if they have a reticle in them)

[Big Thumper]

Originally Posted by antmai

So leaving the country the law it is enforced in is what breaks the law? Well, an extradition order might be appropriate here! Interpretations are just that. I feel that US authorities should have a better handle on leaving their country then. No border check or signs leaving the US. I was asked by the authorities,and i gave them an honest answer. If you all want to flame me, warm up those torches!

Hey, dont tell anyone...i think i did 107 on the henday today.

I don't think anybody is flaming when they tell you that you broke a serious USA export law. If you were caught you may well face serious fines and have the items taken from you and, almost certainly, you will never be legally allowed back in the USA.

[antmai]

Message received all. Heres hoping for decent range weather to use my well, you know!

[Newview01]

Some potential good news in this department.

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/exclusive-...2--sector.html

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Trump administration is preparing to make it easier for American gun makers to sell small arms, including assault rifles and ammunition, to foreign buyers, according to senior U.S. officials.

Aides to President Donald Trump are completing a plan to shift oversight of international non-military firearms sales from the State Department to the Commerce Department, four officials told Reuters.

While the State Department is primarily concerned about international threats to stability and maintains tight restrictions on weapons deals, the Commerce Department typically focuses more on facilitating trade.

The officials from multiple agencies, speaking on condition of anonymity, say the new rules will cut government red tape and regulatory costs, boosting U.S. exports of small arms and creating jobs at home.

"There will be more leeway to do arms sales," one senior administration official said. "You could really turn the spigot on if you do it the right way."

The push fits both Trump's support for the gun lobby espoused on the campaign trail and his "Buy American" agenda.

But critics, including some lawmakers and arms control advocates, have expressed concern that any easing of export rules could make powerful weapons of the type often used in U.S. mass shootings more accessible to criminal gangs and militants that Trump has vowed to fight.

The administration has all but finalised a draft of the new rules, which could be sent to the White House budget office for review within days, one U.S. official said.

The changes – which can be implemented without congressional approval - could be made public this fall, followed by a period of public comment, with implementation as early as the first half of next year, the officials said.

The officials stressed, however, that the proposed shift in oversight was not a blanket deregulation of firearms.

"The NSC is working through the interagency process with the State Department and the Department of Commerce to ensure that U.S. industries have every advantage in the global marketplace, while at the same time ensuring the responsible export of arms," said an official with the White House National Security Council.

SLACK U.S. SALES

The move, part of a broader Trump administration overhaul of weapons export policy that the officials say is also nearing completion, comes at a time when U.S. gun makers could use the help.

Domestic gun sales have fallen significantly after soaring under President Barack Obama, when gun enthusiasts stockpiled weapons and ammunition out of fear that the government would tighten gun laws.

Since Trump was elected in November, the share price for Smith & Wesson owner American Outdoor Brands Corp is down 50 percent and Sturm Ruger has fallen 26 percent.

Both stand to benefit from easier export protocols, alongside Vista Outdoor and the private equity firm Cerberus Capital Management, which owns Bushmaster, a brand of AR-15 assault rifle.

The powerful U.S. gun lobby backed Trump in the 2016 election. The National Rifle Association spent more than $30 million in support of his candidacy. "I am going to come through for you," Trump told the NRA convention in April.

The State Department licensed an estimated $4 billion in commercial firearms exports last year, of which $3.2 billion would shift to Commerce under the new arrangement, one U.S. official said.

In recent years, Canada, Australia, Thailand and Saudi Arabia have been among the top destination countries for U.S. non-military firearms exports, according to U.S. Census data.

The shift to Commerce could increase sales by 15-20 percent annually, predicted Lawrence Keane, senior vice president for the National Shooting Sports Foundation, a firearms industry trade association.

The effort to streamline U.S. small arms export controls dates back to an Obama administration initiative begun in 2009, but which was never translated into policy.

The process was repeatedly stalled by a series of U.S. mass shootings, including one at the Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut, in 2012 in which 20 children and six adults were killed by a gunman using an AR-15-style assault rifle.

Assault rifles like the Bushmaster would be some of the most powerful weapons expected to be more readily available for commercial export under the new rules, which are largely in line with proposals the Obama administration had crafted.

[Bub]

Originally Posted by Prophet River

All rifle scopes need paperwork. Even a 29.00 crickett scope that is close to a toy. Some military type scopes may require US state paperwork on top of the commerce department license and some may be prohibited for any export. Even some spotting scopes need the license (generally, if they have a reticle in them)

Thanks for the reply, Prophet River.
I have gone through most of the document now and still cannot see anything more than what I quoted above. The "military specs" is quite open to interpretation and is not defined anywhere in regards to rifle scopes.

I am assuming a scope cannot be considered to be a gun component, can it? The under-$500 scopes would then fall under the exception, i.e. amendment I have quote above as well.

This whole thing just does not make sense to me whatsoever. A guy in some states can buy almost anything he wants in terms of firepower, yet a store cannot ship a rifle scope to a Canadian hunter. Lol. Idiocy at its finest. And it is not just a scope either, like I already mentioned, one store refused sending me a $50 or whatever it was picatinny rail due to it being a restricted for export item.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Bub

Thanks for the reply, Prophet River.
I have gone through most of the document now and still cannot see anything more than what I quoted above. The "military specs" is quite open to interpretation and is not defined anywhere in regards to rifle scopes.

I am assuming a scope cannot be considered to be a gun component, can it? The under-$500 scopes would then fall under the exception, i.e. amendment I have quote above as well.

This whole thing just does not make sense to me whatsoever. A guy in some states can buy almost anything he wants in terms of firepower, yet a store cannot ship a rifle scope to a Canadian hunter. Lol. Idiocy at its finest. And it is not just a scope either, like I already mentioned, one store refused sending me a $50 or whatever it was picatinny rail due to it being a restricted for export item.

Not all items qualify for the under $500 exemption. Scopes are one of the items that apparently don't qualify.

[SakoAlberta]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Not all items qualify for the under $500 exemption. Scopes are one of the items that apparently don't qualify.

Correct. They do not qualify

[Bub]

Rediculous, isn't it?

Good discussion though. I really had no idea that scopes are covered by itar. I guess I have never run into it until now.

[kman35ca]

This has probably been already mentioned, but Irunguns, and Aztech Armoury import scopes, and it's only a 25$usd fee. Plus the normal shipping from their warehouse. If you stuck to Vortex, Burris, even Bushnell and I think SIG. They don't ask for a recipe or where you bought it from to use their warrenty.
And I know SWFA now sells to Canada, but only SWFA scopes. And I have no idea on the shipping costs, warrenty, etc. But they are pretty good scopes for the money.
Hopefully the Trump administration straightens this out. If we could order directly from the US, especially with our dollar climbing some really great deals to be had.
And it only makes sense.