Open Letter to SRD

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by pikeslayer22

Have you ever seen a grazing lease agreement? I know in mine there is no set date that livestock has to be in or out...in fact I use mine as fall grazing with livestock going in mid September and coming out when I see fit! Not because Joe Blow wants to go hunting!

And that's one of the reasons your "program" will end.

[pikeslayer22]

I am hopeful it will and they sell it off to the highest bidder...than everyone can put up or shut up!!

[Rocky7]

Agreed on the first part. That Crown land won't be sold, though. It'll grow elk and moose and other critters and provide their winter range.

[dwayne.bigred@gmail.com]

I had 1560 acres that was deeded lease land for 25 years I gave it to my uncles kids now . When you have a lease you must maintain fencing , creeks and water sheads etc. anyone who ever asked was given access but some of these people made a incredible mess at their campsites etc that they felt I was not responsible to clean up but I was. So after the years the bad ones were not allowed to return . This was less than 10 percent of the hunters that came, I didn't brand all hunters with the same brand such as a few of you here have done , you are those 10 percent and you can ruin anything good for anyone can't you. We need more hunters our numbers are dwindling so lets not separate ourselves by thinking all lease holders are bad either.. Food for thought .
I have asked for permission around 100 times all over three provinces and no one has refused me and my son yet.

[sunsetrider2011]

Originally Posted by Rocky7

Agreed on the first part. That Crown land won't be sold, though. It'll grow elk and moose and other critters and provide their winter range.

Unfortunately It can and will be as time progresses, it happens consitently.

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by RavCanoe

The own the rights to it... Just like a renter owns rights to an apartment.

nope , only rights to the grass my friend , just the grass.

[pikeslayer22]

Originally Posted by Rocky7

Agreed on the first part. That Crown land won't be sold, though. It'll grow elk and moose and other critters and provide their winter range.

Hopefully people like you put up a big fuss and send lots of letters to SRD...that way it will happen faster! I would compare most people's self entitlement to free access of lands to the natives treaty's?...like all good things it will come to an end my friend...go out and invest some money on some good hunting ground cause the freebies "will come an end"

[Mistagin]

Originally Posted by pikeslayer22

Hopefully people like you put up a big fuss and send lots of letters to SRD...that way it will happen faster! I would compare most people's self entitlement to free access of lands to the natives treaty's?...like all good things it will come to an end my friend...go out and invest some money on some good hunting ground cause the freebies "will come an end"

And you think that's a good thing?

[vcmm]

Here we go again.

[sh9683]

(im not very aware of this situation) so just correct me if im wrong.

if lease is public property. then how can cow farmers prevent hunters from hunting the land?

chances are the hunter doesn't have land. rarely will you see cow owners not have land, if anything should the land no tbe used in favor of the hunter?

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by sunsetrider2011

Unfortunately It can and will be as time progresses, it happens consitently.

Well, that's a depressing thought.

The PC's were indeed selling off a lot of Crown land, or trying to - which was supposed to be an election issue....until somebody in the media said: "homo-sexual".

[HunterDave]

Originally Posted by sh9683

if lease is public property. then how can cow farmers prevent hunters from hunting the land?

It's pretty easy to do with someone that doesn't know the rules. All that they have to do is say no and the person doesn't know any difference.

[sh9683]

Originally Posted by HunterDave

It's pretty easy to do with someone that doesn't know the rules. All that they have to do is say no and the person doesn't know any difference.

makes sense, but if you know what public lease is, you could leagally keep hunting there right? and ignore the greedy farmer who is trying t keep you off public land?

[hillbillyreefer]

Originally Posted by sh9683

makes sense, but if you know what public lease is, you could leagally keep hunting there right? and ignore the greedy farmer who is trying t keep you off public land?

Yup we are all greedy farmers.

Tragic that we want to make a living and allow our kids to play hockey, take dance and piano. I hope you enjoy hunting the medians on the deer foot.

[Jimboy]

Originally Posted by sh9683

(im not very aware of this situation) so just correct me if im wrong.

if lease is public property. then how can cow farmers prevent hunters from hunting the land?

chances are the hunter doesn't have land. rarely will you see cow owners not have land, if anything should the land no tbe used in favor of the hunter?

Lease agreement states that if he has cows on the lease then he can refuse access , thats what we,re talking about that needs to change, because he can put one cow out , refuse access , and then hunt himself on his own private / public land , poor excuse to refuse access /
He should not be allowed to hunt himself when access is denied , this would stop a lot of this bullcrap.

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by hillbillyreefer

I hope you enjoy hunting the medians on the deer foot.

When times are good for farmers, like now, guys like you talk a lot about "Me" and "I" and "Mine".

When a drought hits, or BSE, or something else, you will talk a lot about "We" and "Our" as you make your case for a handout from the city dwellers.

Weird, eh?

[hillbillyreefer]

Originally Posted by Rocky7

When times are good for farmers, like now, guys like you talk a lot about "Me" and "I" and "Mine".

When a drought hits, or BSE, or something else, you will talk a lot about "We" and "Our" as you make your case for a handout from the city dwellers.

Weird, eh?

Yup it is. It is especially weird when the one constant is "the mean landowner won't let me hunt on his land" that one never changes.
This same thread occurs about this time every year. Landowners are evil a holes, it gets a bit old.

Come hunt my lease all you want. I don't care, I assume you know the difference between a cow and a mule doe.

In all these threads there still hasn't been one person answer why farmers are dicks because they won't let you hunt with their cows, but it's ok for mining company's to keep hunters off huge expanses of land because they are using it.

[sh9683]

Originally Posted by Jimboy

Lease agreement states that if he has cows on the lease then he can refuse access , thats what we,re talking about that needs to change, because he can put one cow out , refuse access , and then hunt himself on his own private / public land , poor excuse to refuse access /
He should not be allowed to hunt himself when access is denied , this would stop a lot of this bullcrap.

makes sense.

[sh9683]

Originally Posted by hillbillyreefer

Yup we are all greedy farmers.

Tragic that we want to make a living and allow our kids to play hockey, take dance and piano. I hope you enjoy hunting the medians on the deer foot.

im not saying your all like that, im sorry.

i guess if teh farmer is having his cows graze, he has the right to the land. my question was more if the farmer tries to use that land all the tim eand keep it to himself for other reasons then just grazing

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by sh9683

im not saying your all like that, im sorry.

i guess if teh farmer is having his cows graze, he has the right to the land. my question was more if the farmer tries to use that land all the tim eand keep it to himself for other reasons then just grazing

Oh I don't think that happens, just like hunters never rut up roads on leases, cut fences or any of the other stuff that is alleged to have happened.

Oh I suppose it might have happened once. But it's certainly not something that happens often enough to make a big issue out of now.

I do find it a bit odd, when I hear about all the negative encounters hunters have with other hunters. But apparently, when hunters go on leased land they are all perfect gentleman. But all those lease holders, well they are just the opposite.

Every other day of the year they are generous respectful helpful people but come hunting season they all turn into greedy scheming outfitters.

Or at least that is what I would deduce from reading this thread. If I didn't know any different.

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by hillbillyreefer

This same thread occurs about this time every year. Landowners are evil a holes, it gets a bit old.

That's not what I see here.

[/QUOTE]....... but it's ok for mining company's to keep hunters off huge expanses of land because they are using it.[/QUOTE]

If there's an issue there, it should be dragged into the sunlight.

Originally Posted by KegRiver

Oh I suppose it might have happened once. But it's certainly not something that happens often enough to make a big issue out of now.

.

Your condescending remarks don't elude me keg but if you think this abuse by some leaseholders isn't common and rampant and becoming more common in many parts of the province you are truly naive. Perhaps where you live it isn't a problem but in other parts of Alberta it most definitelly is. From what I gather from your posts keg, you are a stay at home guy when it comes to hunting. I was wondering how you were able to comment on the state of leases in the entire province when this is the case. Alberta is a big place.

This isn't about leaseholders or landowners being good or bad or greedy....it's about a system that permits this type of abuse by a few on land owned by the people of Alberta. I'm sure even most lease holders would agree that the intent of these leases was never to set up a hunting club for friends and family and in an increasing number of cases, profitable outfitting business but rather to graze cows in the long and proud ranching tradition of this province. Something I wholeheartedly support.

[Rackmastr]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

Oh I suppose it might have happened once. But it's certainly not something that happens often enough to make a big issue out of now.

Honest question for you Keg. When and how many times have you hunted any of the 300-320 zones, or any of the 100 zones?

[BuckCuller]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Your condescending remarks don't elude me keg but if you think this abuse by some leaseholders isn't common and rampant and becoming more common in many parts of the province you are truly naive. Perhaps where you live it isn't a problem but in other parts of Alberta it most definitelly is. From what I gather from your posts keg, you are a stay at home guy when it comes to hunting. I was wondering how you were able to comment on the state of leases in the entire province when this is the case. Alberta is a big place.

This isn't about leaseholders or landowners being good or bad or greedy....it's about a system that permits this type of abuse by a few on land owned by the people of Alberta. I'm sure even most lease holders would agree that the intent of these leases was never to set up a hunting club for friends and family and in an increasing number of cases, profitable outfitting business but rather to graze cows in the long and proud ranching tradition of this province. Something I wholeheartedly support.

I have had this type of issue here in central Alberta with outfitters with rich parents lease tracts of private and public land to control hunting rights on them. I have lost lots of property to hunt on this way and with loop holes in the system and the influence of APOS this will not change any time soon. As far as I am concerned I think all public land grazing leasing should be stopped and all atv use on public land should be on designated trails only and inforced. I think that would solve a lot of problems. And we should not be selling public land anymore either!

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by BuckCuller

As far as I am concerned .. all atv use on public land should be on designated trails only and inforced.

I disagree. There's a topic for another thread. That, and the garbage left by slobs on Crown land. I was north hunting moose on an unsubscribed tag this fall and could not believe the amount of trash, up to and including an old generator, that was tossed. One camp of hunters actually piled up their plastic trash bags in a clearing for the ravens to pick on!

Anyway, I don't mean to hijack this discussion but would welcome/join anybody's good ideas to stop it. I'm thinking cellphone cameras and licence plates.

Sorry...carry on.

[BuckCuller]

I agree with the trash my brother and I had a certain spot that we camped to hunt elk and we always spent the first few hours cleaning what others had left but it was unclear weather it was hunters or quaders I would not just assume it was hunters.

[sh9683]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

Oh I don't think that happens, just like hunters never rut up roads on leases, cut fences or any of the other stuff that is alleged to have happened.

Oh I suppose it might have happened once. But it's certainly not something that happens often enough to make a big issue out of now.

I do find it a bit odd, when I hear about all the negative encounters hunters have with other hunters. But apparently, when hunters go on leased land they are all perfect gentleman. But all those lease holders, well they are just the opposite.

Every other day of the year they are generous respectful helpful people but come hunting season they all turn into greedy scheming outfitters.

Or at least that is what I would deduce from reading this thread. If I didn't know any different.

haha good point. like i said im new to this and this will be my second year hunting, last year the two deer i shot was on private property i was given permission to hunt on.

bu tim pressuming cpws are gone from these grazing area by fal?

[guywiththemule]

Originally Posted by sheephunter

Your condescending remarks don't elude me keg but if you think this abuse by some leaseholders isn't common and rampant and becoming more common in many parts of the province you are truly naive. Perhaps where you live it isn't a problem but in other parts of Alberta it most definitelly is. From what I gather from your posts keg, you are a stay at home guy when it comes to hunting. I was wondering how you were able to comment on the state of leases in the entire province when this is the case. Alberta is a big place.

This isn't about leaseholders or landowners being good or bad or greedy....it's about a system that permits this type of abuse by a few on land owned by the people of Alberta. I'm sure even most lease holders would agree that the intent of these leases was never to set up a hunting club for friends and family and in an increasing number of cases, profitable outfitting business but rather to graze cows in the long and proud ranching tradition of this province. Something I wholeheartedly support.

I have seen this "lease holder abuse" when it comes to hunting and access on government leases for years around here. I own and lease private land in this area and have hunted here my entire life. Several lease holders have been running this "no tresspassing and no access" scam for years and have succeeded in bluffing the hunting public. New rules and stiff penalties need to be put into place to make it fair to all hunters not just a priviliged few who are either close relations or on a guided hunt or kiss the lease holder`s *****.

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by guywiththemule

I have seen this "lease holder abuse" when it comes to hunting and access on government leases for years around here. I own and lease private land in this area and have hunted here my entire life. Several lease holders have been running this "no tresspassing and no access" scam for years and have succeeded in bluffing the hunting public. New rules and stiff penalties need to be put into place to make it fair to all hunters not just a priviliged few who are either close relations or on a guided hunt or kiss the lease holder`s *****.

Thanks for posting that.

We can't let hunting become something that only the privileged few that are rich or on the "in" can enjoy.

[leeelmer]

I have a few names and numbers of lease holders, they are refusing hunting on lease land they hold even after I explained the rules to them. The response was no hunting! Please pm me for details. I have a call into srd to settle the dispute. But no call back yet. But more calls the better