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02-19-2011, 02:47 PM
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Gone Hunting
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: North of Peace River
Posts: 11,343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mountain Guy
Oh, I wouldn't recommend a frontal head shot on a moose either.
As a volunteer firefighter I tried to dispatch a live bull moose laying on the highway with a broken back. I walked up to him ,wound up and put all of my 230lbs into his forehead with a pick axe. I thought it would easily penetrate his skull and it would be quick and painless for the poor critter. To my amazement the axe bounced off his forehead !! He shook his head like he had a bug in his ear. Not sure what to do I wound up and did it again with the same result. The other firefighters watched as I had to beat this poor thing a few times before he finally succumbed. Boy did I learn something about how tough a moose is...
I've since learned that the soft spot behind the ear is the place to beat a moose with a pick axe
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Shade of Déjà vu !!
I can tell you from experience a post maul won't do it either.
I learned two things that day.
#1 a hammer, no matter how large is not a good tool for Moose hunting.
#2 a short legged Dutchman can outrun a long legged Scotsman. If there is a Moose on their tails.
That was one of those high shoulder shots some like so much.
Yeah I missed where I aimed, missed by about two inches in fact.
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02-19-2011, 02:49 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
Using the elk pictures posted, it looks as though #2 gives the biggest margin for error to ensure a clean kill.You can miss by a few inches in any direction,and still hit vitals.That isn't the case with #3.
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Likely most would agree with this. Aim a little left of #2, basically directly above #1 and you have the biggest kill zone, largest margin of error by a long shot.
Sure its cool to see the spectacular "bang flop" high shoulder hit on video, but to say that the "high shoulder" has the highest margin for error is clearly not consistent with anatomy pictures posted.
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02-19-2011, 02:51 PM
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Gone Hunting
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: North of Peace River
Posts: 11,343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by equanuck
The OP was large and dangerous... 350 yards???? Nothing is dangerous at that distance. This exact scenario was already written somewhere around page 2 of this post.
I guess maybe age does have an affect on things. LOL!
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Nice cheep shot.
If you read that post with an open mind, you might notice that it is addressing the difficulty of making a successful high shoulder shot, which has been touted as a good choice on dangerous game and thus the post is on topic.
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02-19-2011, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LongDraw
Sure its cool to see the spectacular "bang flop" high shoulder hit on video, but to say that the "high shoulder" has the highest margin for error is clearly not consistent with anatomy pictures posted.
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Clearly to you perhaps.....Good to have some different opinions on things..... I find it interesting that some of you are so distressed that some people do things differently...the world is like that. I like the way you do things....I just like my way better. It's okay if we don't all agree The result is ultimately the same.
Last edited by sheephunter; 02-19-2011 at 03:24 PM.
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02-19-2011, 03:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
I just went and referenced Craig Boddington's "The Perfect Shot North America" Oddly enough he does not even consider #3 as a viable shot on any North American big game animal.
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Well there we have it....no doubt Craig is the diffinitive answer to all things regarding hunting and shooting.....
I respect Craig's opinion....just as I respect a lot that praise the high shoulder. I'm sure if you Google enough you can find those too....lol I love how you cherry pick writers that agree with you and discount those that don't
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02-19-2011, 03:06 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walking buffalo
Thanks TJ.
For Dangerous Game comparison.
Black bear
Brown bear
Polar Bear
Teddy Bear
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Thank WB. It's easy to see what's directly behind the shoulders on all the bear pics. I don't shoot elk in the shoulders and the OP questioned on dangerous animals. I would think that given a broadside non-moving bear at under 100 yards the rear section of the mid shoulder blade would be easy to take out. This was all about "preferred shot on large and dangerous" so obviously you have to assume ideal situation of what you would like.
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02-19-2011, 03:19 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
Well there we have it....no doubt Craig is the diffinitive answer to all things regarding hunting and shooting.....
I respect Craig's opinion....just as I respect a lot that praise the high shoulder. I'm sure if you Google enough you can find those too....lol I love how you cherry pick writers that agree with you and discount those that don't
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Your right. I cherry picked the writer qualified to write that type of book and who has arguably more game under his belt than any other "writer" on the planet alive today. Who knows maybe someone will approach you for a sequel.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 03:20 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: The Best Place on Earth
Posts: 113
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Sheep Guide
All we need now is sheepguide and it'll be an all nighter LOL
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02-19-2011, 03:21 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
#3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LongDraw
Likely most would agree with this. Aim a little left of #2, basically directly above #1 and you have the biggest kill zone, largest margin of error by a long shot.
Sure its cool to see the spectacular "bang flop" high shoulder hit on video, but to say that the "high shoulder" has the highest margin for error is clearly not consistent with anatomy pictures posted.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
Clearly to you perhaps.....Good to have some different opinions on things.....
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You believe that #3 on the elk anatomy chart you posted has the largest margin of error?
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02-19-2011, 03:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LongDraw
You believe that #3 on the elk anatomy chart you posted has the largest margin of error?
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Clearly I personally believe that or I clearly wouldn't have said it. If the margain of error we are talking about is dead or alive. From my experience, not much chance of a wounding shot there. You either miss or bang flop. I like those odds. I clearly appreciate that you may not and do things differently
It's just my humble opinion...I appreciate that you see things differently and I'm not trying to convince anyone to use it. It works for me. That makes me happy It also works from some of the county's preemminent long range shooters.....Colonel Craig excluded, so I feel I'm in good company with my humble opinion. I've never once said it's the only way....just a way that I prefer as the OP asked.
Last edited by sheephunter; 02-19-2011 at 03:30 PM.
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02-19-2011, 03:27 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KegRiver
Nice cheep shot.
If you read that post with an open mind, you might notice that it is addressing the difficulty of making a successful high shoulder shot, which has been touted as a good choice on dangerous game and thus the post is on topic.
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Keg,
You can't honestly believe that you're on topic when the topic is dangerous game and you are writing about a potential 350 yard shot. More than 1 person on this post has stated the distances for preferred shots and why.
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02-19-2011, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
Your right. I cherry picked the writer qualified to write that type of book and who has arguably more game under his belt than any other "writer" on the planet alive today. Who knows maybe someone will approach you for a sequel.
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It's funny chuck, I've seen the colonel getting slagged on a couple other sites recently for recommending the shoulder shot....it's all in persprective I guess. That's one of the problems with chery picking...it's rarely an accurate depiction of a person's beliefs.
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02-19-2011, 03:38 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
Clearly I personally believe that or I clearly wouldn't have said it. If the margain of error we are talking about is dead or alive. From my experience, not much chance of a wounding shot there. You either miss or bang flop. I like those odds. I clearly appreciate that you may not and do things differently
It's just my humble opinion...I appreciate that you see things differently and I'm not trying to convince anyone to use it. It works for me. That makes me happy It also works from some of the county's preemminent long range shooters.....Colonel Craig excluded, so I feel I'm in good company with my humble opinion. I've never once said it's the only way....just a way that I prefer as the OP asked.
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By shooters you assuredly don't mean hunters do you and what country do you live in? It's hardly a humble opinion from what I can gather. Heaven help "your" critics.
I'd also say you've lost a bunch of supporters here when they found out exactly what you meant by shoulders.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 03:40 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
It's funny chuck, I've seen the colonel getting slagged on a couple other sites recently for recommending the shoulder shot....it's all in persprective I guess. That's one of the problems with chery picking...it's rarely an accurate depiction of a person's beliefs.
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Maybe he know's where the shoulder actually is as he recommends the shoulder shot in the book I referenced numerous times. Nice try though.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
I'd also say you've lost a bunch of supporters here when they found out exactly what you meant by shoulders.
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I wasn't looking for support chuck....I'm not looking to win an argument here. The OP asked for opinions and I gave mine. I could really care less if no one agrees with me. It's the way I personally do things and it works for me. I've explained why. If your opinion differs that's cool. If garnering support to your position is important, be all means go for it. I honestly don't care.....I do it my way and it works. I'm sure your way works too It's okay that not everyone does things the same
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02-19-2011, 03:56 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Copperhead Road, Morinville
Posts: 19,289
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Third picture of the elk with the vitals included.
http://www.rifle-accuracy-reports.co...placement.html
"The best scenario for good shot placement of the bullet is when the animal is positioned broadside or slightly quartering away and the bullet placed into the high shoulder area (#3) hitting the shoulder blade (scapula) and part of the spine (see skeletal picture). Or placing bullet right on the middle of shoulder (#2) attempting to break BOTH shoulders and lungs, or just behind the shoulder into the heart/lung area (#1)."
I can't say that I agree with it but that's what's written. To me the ideal shot would be double lung directly above #1 and in line with #2. To each their own.
You don't want to see the suggested shot placement on a moose that I found on another site.
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02-19-2011, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
Maybe he know's where the shoulder actually is as he recommends the shoulder shot in the book I referenced numerous times. Nice try though.
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Is this you speaking for Boddington again or something he actually said? Anyhow, many people don't know where the shoulder sits....that's why I reference it as high shoulder even though that term is somewhat redundant.
You are right about one thing though...you aren't a doctor
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02-19-2011, 04:02 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
I wasn't looking for support chuck....I'm not looking to win an argument here. The OP asked for opinions and I gave mine. I could really care less if no one agrees with me.
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Dude, you stomped your feet and told me I was criticizing YOU with my opinion earlier in this thread. You even went so far as to comment on my friends in school. Even when my comments had no reference to you or anyone else. What a piece of work you are.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 04:05 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
Is this you speaking for Boddington again or something he actually said? Anyhow, many people don't know where the shoulder sits....that's why I reference it as high shoulder even though that term is somewhat redundant.
You are right about one thing though...you aren't a doctor
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Nope, he has nice pictures for reference though.
Even though I'm not a doctor, I do know the difference between my shoulder and shoulder blade. Laughing!
Keep grasping.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 04:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
Dude, you stomped your feet and told me I was criticizing YOU with my opinion earlier in this thread. You even went so far as to comment on my friends in school. Even when my comments had no reference to you or anyone else. What a piece of work you are.
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LOL....I think you missed my intent chuck.....I'm just not big on someone accusing me of taking an iffy shot...it sounds unethical. I was just trying to explain why indeed it was not iffy and why I personally like it. Hope that clears things up a bit
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02-19-2011, 04:15 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,088
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huntinstuff
Blasting the shoulders out is a great way to anchor an animal for sure. Good bullet.
I tend to shoot behind the shoulder because i know it works every time. Yes i might have to track the animal but i tend to take my time so to me, tracking is just part of it all
Mostly, my animal is dead within 100yds of where it was shot, but i dont pursue right away so really i just delay getting my animal
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My preference as well. They never go far without a heart and/or lungs. Also important to me, is the fact that very little, to no, meat is damaged.
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02-19-2011, 04:16 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
LOL....I think you missed my intent chuck.....I'm just not big on someone accusing me of taking an iffy shot...it sounds unethical. I was just trying to explain why indeed it was not iffy and why I personally like it. Hope that clears things up a bit
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It is iffy. That's my opinion and I base that on personal experience. If that offends you so be it.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
If that offends you so be it.
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It does....and that's the only reason I've stayed in this conversation.
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02-19-2011, 04:29 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 04:35 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 6,952
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Why don't you 2 boys take this to PM? Instead of littering this board on who has the biggest ego. Cause ya both know thats what its about. hahaha I laugh at you both.
GARBAGE.
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Smoke or Fire in the Forest Dial 310-FIRE
thegungirl.ca @gmail.com
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02-19-2011, 04:37 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,730
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IBTL.....
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02-19-2011, 04:37 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 04:49 PM
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Gone Hunting
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: North of Peace River
Posts: 11,343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by equanuck
Keg,
You can't honestly believe that you're on topic when the topic is dangerous game and you are writing about a potential 350 yard shot. More than 1 person on this post has stated the distances for preferred shots and why.
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Perhaps if you did some real hunting you would learn that dangerous game is dangerous no matter the range, and they remain dangerous until dead.
That is what gives rise to the designation dangerous game.
I'll tell you what. you crawl on hands and knees into a brush pile to finish off a Bear your neighbour made a bad shot on at (according to his account, at 200 yards) and then you come tell me how a 200 or 350 or any other distance shot is never a dangerous game shot.
This is getting tiresome. This is about the tenth time you have tried to pick a fight with me.
What is your problem. You want to debate, lets debate, quit trying to bait me into a fight.
What are your thought on bullet placement.
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02-19-2011, 05:19 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 16,273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter
I wasn't looking for support chuck....I'm not looking to win an argument here. The OP asked for opinions and I gave mine. I could really care less if no one agrees with me.
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Quote:
It does....and that's the only reason I've stayed in this conversation.
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So which is it?
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
-Billy Molls
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02-19-2011, 05:23 PM
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Gone Hunting
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Between Bodo and a hard place
Posts: 20,168
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WOW! I was gonna say I shoot the shoulder on dangerous game, but after reading all this I've decided to keep shooting the shoulder. It's worked for 50 years so far.
__________________
I'm not lying!!! You are just experiencing it differently.
It isn't a question of who will allow me, but who will stop me.. Ayn Rand
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