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09-30-2015, 09:55 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 460
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stringer
What would a person entering on to a grazing lease without permission with no livestock present be charged with ?
He would have to be charged in order to fight it in court.
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The black and white response is that you could potentially be charged with trespassing - the absence of livestock doesn't remove the recreational user's obligation to comply with s.5 of the regulation. That being said, things are rarely, if ever, that simple. Each situation is entirely fact dependant.
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09-30-2015, 09:56 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoytCRX32
We leased 5 quarters of our ranch (owned, not leased) near Bassano for $2000.00/quarter ten years ago
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I stand corrected if the land was used for grazing.
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09-30-2015, 09:58 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icefisher2885
The black and white response is that you could potentially be charged with trespassing - the absence of livestock doesn't remove the recreational user's obligation to comply with s.5 of the regulation. That being said, things are rarely, if ever, that simple. Each situation is entirely fact dependant.
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The petty treaspact act clearly exempts grazing leases.
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09-30-2015, 10:00 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoytCRX32
Just a shout out to the Waldron Ranch how it handles hunting. They allow foot access (you should still stop in and ask) and if you were successful even allowed (at least they did in the past) one to use an ATV to retrieve game.
Them boys (and girls) do it right. Thank you!!
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Exactly
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09-30-2015, 10:03 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoytCRX32
Agreed...I don't think anyone in the system would want this issue brought to the forefront. If this became a bigger issue with non-hunters then there could be real call for change. Perhaps the dippers will look into it. The Wildrose certainly should be.
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The ranchers have the wildrose in their back pocket much like the conservatives were the last 40 years.
Last edited by stringer; 09-30-2015 at 10:21 AM.
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09-30-2015, 10:06 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt505
Well sorry to hear you ARE the type of lease holder that gives them the bad name they are receiving. And to top it off you're proud of it!
Good luck getting advise from this guy Redneck yote, you made my "don't ever help that guy" list  |
Sorry to hear you feel that way ??
And for the record I should have given more details about my lease land ? My one 1/4 of lease land is on the northern part of my ranch . The only way to get to it is to cross the land that is privately owned on all 4 sides by myself . So the only way of getting to it without crossing my land on foot, horse ,quad , truck , would be by helicopter / plane. Not to many recreational users have the cash to get flown in and out when they would like to use said land !! Plus there's no place to land except on the cleared land which is private land ! That would be trespassing if someone did !! So for that reason the "Queen", doesn't expect myself to allow recreational users . So yes I will keep renting from" The lady " since it would cost a fortune for somebody to develop this land !!
And yes I'm proud of these FACTS !!
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09-30-2015, 10:11 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Communist state
Posts: 13,243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redneck yote
Sorry to hear you feel that way ??
And for the record I should have given more details about my lease land ? My one 1/4 of lease land is on the northern part of my ranch . The only way to get to it is to cross the land that is privately owned on all 4 sides by myself . So the only way of getting to it without crossing my land on foot, horse ,quad , truck , would be by helicopter / plane. Not to many recreational users have the cash to get flown in and out when they would like to use said land !! Plus there's no place to land except on the cleared land which is private land ! That would be trespassing if someone did !! So for that reason the "Queen", doesn't expect myself to allow recreational users . So yes I will keep renting from" The lady " since it would cost a fortune for somebody to develop this land !!
And yes I'm proud of these FACTS !!
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So...... You have the public road allowance blocked off?
PS, you don't have to apologize to me, I feel this way by choice.
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09-30-2015, 10:26 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 1,786
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stringer
I stand corrected if the land was used for grazing.
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Yep...not that I have any idea what it would be now
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Common sense is so rare these days, that it should be considered a super power.
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09-30-2015, 10:41 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Crossfield
Posts: 56
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As a land owner with some lease land as well we can not deny access however you sure do not want to burn any bridges. I think most people get all uptight and upset when they hear anything but "ya go ahead". Have a visit and find out what his reasoning is. Sure they may just be grumpy old buggers  but they also maybe aren't knowledgable on all the rules and regulation. I have seen where there has been a few guys who came before and are hunting first and leasers say they would rather no more hunters to keep hunter numbers down and animal numbers up. I know its not the lease holders job to regulate the hunters however there are only so many a chunk of land can hold. I would you rather stay in the good books and go hunting another day without seeing 10 other people looking and shooting at the same animals.
Thats my 2c
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Today's struggles are tomorrows victories.
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09-30-2015, 10:47 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt505
So...... You have the public road allowance blocked off?
PS, you don't have to apologize to me, I feel this way by choice.
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There is only one road allowance on this ranch and I own it . Since it goes nowhere but my yard , So yes there are gates at the start of it !! There are no roads around my ranch and its all privately owned ranch land that backs on to my land . Any more questions ??
P.S
I wasn't apologizing just stating FACTS !!
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09-30-2015, 10:49 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Communist state
Posts: 13,243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redneck yote
There is only one road allowance on this ranch and I own it . Since it goes nowhere but my yard , So yes there are gates at the start of it !! There are no roads around my ranch and its all privately owned ranch land that backs on to my land . Any more questions ??
P.S
I wasn't apologizing just stating FACTS !!
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Where is it?
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09-30-2015, 10:52 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt505
Where is it?
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Western Alberta !!
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09-30-2015, 10:54 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Communist state
Posts: 13,243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redneck yote
Western Alberta !!
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Why are you yelling at me?
Western Alberta is fairly large, can you be more specific?
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09-30-2015, 10:55 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 1,786
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redneck yote
There is only one road allowance on this ranch and I own it . Since it goes nowhere but my yard , So yes there are gates at the start of it !! There are no roads around my ranch and its all privately owned ranch land that backs on to my land . Any more questions ??
P.S
I wasn't apologizing just stating FACTS !!
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Red is right on this...road allowances which are bordered on both sides by one owner can have access restricted...but I'm not sure if they can actually be bought. I know that if one parcel get's sold then the road allowance goes back on as original.
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Common sense is so rare these days, that it should be considered a super power.
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09-30-2015, 10:57 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt505
Why are you yelling at me?
Western Alberta is fairly large, can you be more specific?
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Yelling ?? Its over there near... notellhimcreek ??
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09-30-2015, 11:00 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Communist state
Posts: 13,243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redneck yote
Yelling ??
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!!
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09-30-2015, 11:01 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoytCRX32
Red is right on this...road allowances which are bordered on both sides by one owner can have access restricted...but I'm not sure if they can actually be bought. I know that if one parcel get's sold then the road allowance goes back on as original.
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Years ago if you owned both sides and it dead ends on to land you own , you could buy the the road allowance . So that's what what happened here .
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09-30-2015, 11:02 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoytCRX32
Red is right on this...road allowances which are bordered on both sides by one owner can have access restricted...but I'm not sure if they can actually be bought. I know that if one parcel get's sold then the road allowance goes back on as original.
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Not so - according to our MD. They can be used by the landowner and under some circumstances rented, but if the public wants access it must be provided. I would assume this is provincial legislation.
Road allowances do not end but do have a jog or correction line in them just like land boundaries.
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09-30-2015, 11:03 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt505
!!
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Oh ,I thought it was considered yelling .... Typing in capital letters ? My bad .
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09-30-2015, 11:05 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoytCRX32
Yep...not that I have any idea what it would be now
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Private pasture $39 to $45 / AUM
Public land northern alberta $1.30 / AUM southern Alberta $2.30 / AUM
These ranchers are getting one hell of a deal
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09-30-2015, 11:06 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 1,786
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xmastree
Not so - according to our MD. They can be used by the landowner and under some circumstances rented, but if the public wants access it must be provided. I would assume this is provincial legislation.
Road allowances do not end but do have a jog or correction line in them just like land boundaries.
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Interesting...I'm no expert on this so I'm backing away slooooowly 
__________________
Common sense is so rare these days, that it should be considered a super power.
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09-30-2015, 11:11 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 460
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stringer
The petty treaspact act clearly exempts grazing leases.
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The Trespass to Premises Act applies to any land exempted by the Petty Traspass Act, and that is the statute under which you could be charged. See 1(c)(ii) of Alberta Trespass to Premises Act.
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09-30-2015, 11:12 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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[QUOTE=xmastree;2981203]Not so - according to our MD. They can be used by the landowner and under some circumstances rented, but if the public wants access it must be provided. I would assume this is provincial legislation.
Road allowances do not end but do have a jog or correction line in them just like land boundaries.[/QUOTE
Depends on the when land was purchased , and what is at the end . example , lake , river ,coulee .
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09-30-2015, 11:21 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icefisher2885
The Trespass to Premises Act applies to any land exempted by the Petty Traspass Act, and that is the statute under which you could be charged. See 1(c)(ii) of Alberta Trespass to Premises Act.
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Thanks I'll check it out..
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09-30-2015, 11:29 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 460
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I'm going to step out of this thread now, just wanted to point out the danger of just blindly following whatever turns up on a Google search - these issues are never black and white, and you may often be dealing with the intermingling of several different statutes at once.
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09-30-2015, 11:29 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Communist state
Posts: 13,243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redneck yote
Oh ,I thought it was considered yelling .... Typing in capital letters ? My bad .
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Exclaiming is sort of a form of yelling..... maybe?
I'm not too worried about it, and I'm not worried about accessing your land or the rules you have in place for your private and leased land. I have my own lease land issues to deal with in my own hunting area, from lease holders that are out of line to put it politely.
Just remember this, whatever you do in life is transparent at one point or another, and there's always someone taking note. The particular lease holder I'm dealing with used to be respected by many locals, however over the past 5 or so years his stripes have come to light. Now many locals have lost respect for him, its not the same friendly wave when we pass by. To this day I have always respected his wishes to stay off his lease land, I just hunt the land around it. He's the one who many locals don't like anymore. He moved in about 15yrs ago, we've been there for over 25yrs, the only people upset with me are mad because I kill big deer around there, not because I trespass or restrict access.
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09-30-2015, 11:33 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icefisher2885
I'm going to step out of this thread now, just wanted to point out the danger of just blindly following whatever turns up on a Google search - these issues are never black and white, and you may often be dealing with the intermingling of several different statutes at once.
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Thanks again sir
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09-30-2015, 11:40 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt505
Exclaiming is sort of a form of yelling..... maybe?
I'm not too worried about it, and I'm not worried about accessing your land or the rules you have in place for your private and leased land. I have my own lease land issues to deal with in my own hunting area, from lease holders that are out of line to put it politely.
Just remember this, whatever you do in life is transparent at one point or another, and there's always someone taking note. The particular lease holder I'm dealing with used to be respected by many locals, however over the past 5 or so years his stripes have come to light. Now many locals have lost respect for him, its not the same friendly wave when we pass by. To this day I have always respected his wishes to stay off his lease land, I just hunt the land around it. He's the one who many locals don't like anymore. He moved in about 15yrs ago, we've been there for over 25yrs, the only people upset with me are mad because I kill big deer around there, not because I trespass or restrict access.
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I understand what your saying , Enough said , Good luck to you in your endeavors . Happy hunting !!
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09-30-2015, 11:41 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stringer
Thanks again sir
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x2 Icefisher2885 , thx for the info .
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