Deer hunting method question - Alberta/Sask

[expmler]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

I never said I didn't produce mature bucks, I said I didn't produce as many as the other guys, until they got busted. After that I don't remember them taking any big bucks.

And I don't agree at all with your last statement. Anyone from a place that allows baiting, and does it properly will in fact have a wall of shame that will impress you. Not everyone from these areas will have an impressive wall, because not everyone will be willing to put in the time to do it properly.

Knowing a big buck is in the area is one thing, limiting the area you have to hunt him is another. Less movement on your part equals less chances of being detected by the deer. Couple that with being able to know exactly where the deer will be coming from and heading to will in fact greatly up the odds of taking a mature buck. The only uncontrolled variable will be timing. This is where sitting on stand patiently will come into play.

I have stands set up on travel routes and they produce mature deer every year, but it takes a lot more time on stand to have all the stars aligne. It's easier to pin down travel routes to one specific pile of feed than it is to guess which of the surrounding fields that big guy might show up in, let alone which route he'll take to get there.

I'm not saying it's impossible to take a mature buck without bait, I'm saying baiting deer will increase your odds. If it didn't I know 100% fact that you wouldn't see the likes of Cody or Jim doing it. Have you ever seen a Shockey whitetail hunt that wasn't over a bait pile???

Shockey and Cody's success has far more to do with the lack of competition from other hunters on the land they hunt than the use of bait.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by expmler

Shockey and Cody's success has far more to do with the lack of competition from other hunters on the land they hunt than the use of bait.

And???

Are you saying the bait pile doesn't help?

All I'm saying is that it's blatantly obvious that baiting deer will give you an edge at harvesting a mature buck over not being able to bait.

[expmler]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

And???

Are you saying the bait pile doesn't help?

I am saying the bait pile makes it easier to film for TV. I am quite certain those guys could harvest those same bucks in a number of different ways because they know their quarry and are the only ones hunting those bucks.

They make it look like simply dumping a pile of bait on the ground will guarantee Joe Blow weekend hunter a mature buck, but that is not the reality of it.

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by expmler

I am saying the bait pile makes it easier to film for TV. I am quite certain those guys could harvest those same bucks in a number of different ways because they know their quarry and are the only ones hunting those bucks.

They make it look like simply dumping a pile of bait on the ground will guarantee Joe Blow weekend hunter a mature buck, but that is not the reality of it.

Why do people without TV crews choose to hunt over bait?

[pikeslayer22]

Originally Posted by expmler

I am saying the bait pile makes it easier to film for TV. I am quite certain those guys could harvest those same bucks in a number of different ways because they know their quarry and are the only ones hunting those bucks.

They make it look like simply dumping a pile of bait on the ground will guarantee Joe Blow weekend hunter a mature buck, but that is not the reality of it.

If the powers that be give the average Joe Blow AB hunter the same baiting laws as Sask I "Guarntee" we would surpass them in the B&C standings...not sure how we even compete with them now

[dmcbride]

I dunno, I do know that I can harvest a deer faster and with less work without using bait. Same can be said with bear.

[expmler]

Originally Posted by Talking moose

Why do people without TV crews choose to hunt over bait?

Because they see it on TV and think it will guarantee them a big buck.

Just like the people that watch fishing shows and run out to buy the latest lure because the guy on the show was hauling in fish. Then they get out on the lake and have no idea where they should be fishing and the lure is useless.

But the guy that knows his quarry is in the right area catching fish without the new fantastic lure.

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by expmler

Because they see it on TV and think it will guarantee them a big buck.

Just like the people that watch fishing shows and run out to buy the latest lure because the guy on the show was hauling in fish. Then they get out on the lake and have no idea where they should be fishing and the lure is useless.

But the guy that knows his quarry is in the right area catching fish without the new fantastic lure.

Fair point.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by expmler

I am saying the bait pile makes it easier to film for TV. I am quite certain those guys could harvest those same bucks in a number of different ways because they know their quarry and are the only ones hunting those bucks.

They make it look like simply dumping a pile of bait on the ground will guarantee Joe Blow weekend hunter a mature buck, but that is not the reality of it.

It's just as easy to film sitting in a stand NOT over a bait pile.

And Joe Blow will stand a way better chance of harvesting a deer over a bait pile than not.

Lol! Why are people even arguing the point? It must be to ease their conscious, because it doesn't take a biologist teamed up with a PH to figure out animals eat food.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by expmler

Because they see it on TV and think it will guarantee them a big buck.

Just like the people that watch fishing shows and run out to buy the latest lure because the guy on the show was hauling in fish. Then they get out on the lake and have no idea where they should be fishing and the lure is useless.

But the guy that knows his quarry is in the right area catching fish without the new fantastic lure.

Give the guy that knows what he's doing a budwieser novelty crank bait and joe blow all the greatest lures and see who comes home with more fish after a summer of fishing.

[fish_e_o]

this might be the best discussion on baiting we've ever had

[fish_e_o]

oh i had talked about a guy that everyone says is baiting



do you guys think that's a food plot

yes, real picture in alberta

[pikeslayer22]

That or a Pipeline/lease

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by pikeslayer22

That or a Pipeline/lease

in the winter you can see through the trees. there's no lease in there

[pikeslayer22]

Whats growing and does he combine or cut&bail it for feeed?

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by pikeslayer22

Whats growing and does he combine or cut&bail it for feeed?

i'll check next time i'm around. i try not to snoop especially on guys who i suspect of illegal things.

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

oh i had talked about a guy that everyone says is baiting



do you guys think that's a food plot

yes, real picture in alberta

I don't see any hunter in the pic....

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by Talking moose

I don't see any hunter in the pic....

well that's exactly it. so even if the guy is baiting who's going to prove it? and who would enforce it?

no one. so it might as well be legal

[dmcbride]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

oh i had talked about a guy that everyone says is baiting



do you guys think that's a food plot

yes, real picture in alberta

To bad all farmers didn't farm with wildlife in mind.

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by dmcbride

To bad all farmers didn't farm with wildlife in mind.

could you imagine being a deer?

all summer you have abundant food and it's delicious then September hits and instantly some giant machines come up and wipe all your food out. desperately you forage for food where grain has been spilt and bails have been stacked. then for a couple of months you try to avoid eating during the day because every truck that drives by sends a bullet at you. on top of it all it's mating season so you're fighting and chasing everything in sight.

that sounds like crap. it sounds like it's the worst possible time to be hit with all that stuff.

if only more people would bait all year round and provide a stable food source when they were most vulnerable.

[dmcbride]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

could you imagine being a deer?

all summer you have abundant food and it's delicious then September hits and instantly some giant machines come up and wipe all your food out. desperately you forage for food where grain has been spilt and bails have been stacked. then for a couple of months you try to avoid eating during the day because every truck that drives by sends a bullet at you. on top of it all it's mating season so you're fighting and chasing everything in sight.

that sounds like crap. it sounds like it's the worst possible time to be hit with all that stuff.

if only more people would bait all year round and provide a stable food source when they were most vulnerable.

Yes, it wouldn't be fun that's for sure, with the lack of trees or cover in some places.

Personally, I don't have a problem with habitat improvement for wildlife. A pile of bait is not the same as stuff that grows year round. (trees, shrubs, small clearings ect.)

[norwestalta]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

could you imagine being a deer?

all summer you have abundant food and it's delicious then September hits and instantly some giant machines come up and wipe all your food out. desperately you forage for food where grain has been spilt and bails have been stacked. then for a couple of months you try to avoid eating during the day because every truck that drives by sends a bullet at you. on top of it all it's mating season so you're fighting and chasing everything in sight.

that sounds like crap. it sounds like it's the worst possible time to be hit with all that stuff.

if only more people would bait all year round and provide a stable food source when they were most vulnerable.

It's a great idea in theory but I shot a moose a few years back. There wasn't a ounce of fat on it and I was told that it was on a steady diet of alfalfa and it was starving itself to death. I can't say for sure if it's true or not. I've also heard stories of deer dieing in bale yards due to their stomachs not being able to digest the hay they were eating.

[dmcbride]

Originally Posted by norwestalta

It's a great idea in theory but I shot a moose a few years back. There wasn't a ounce of fat on it and I was told that it was on a steady diet of alfalfa and it was starving itself to death. I can't say for sure if it's true or not. I've also heard stories of deer dieing in bale yards due to their stomachs not being able to digest the hay they were eating.

You are correct, they need a variety of foods. My comment "To bad all farmers didn't farm with wildlife in mind." was that it was nice to see the farm field in with all the tree's around it. Perfect wildlife habitat.

[Leafy]

Originally Posted by norwestalta

It's a great idea in theory but I shot a moose a few years back. There wasn't a ounce of fat on it and I was told that it was on a steady diet of alfalfa and it was starving itself to death. I can't say for sure if it's true or not. I've also heard stories of deer dieing in bale yards due to their stomachs not being able to digest the hay they were eating.

That's hard to believe unless you were poaching in February

Supplement feeding works well when we have harsh winters, this has to be carried through to spring into green up or yes there can be some serious consequences to our wildlife.

Think of your moose all summer long and into fall, he or she could have ate as much alfalfa as they want but highly unlikely they would if not locked up... Animals will feed on the "hot" stuff until they get a stomach ache and then forage on other sources...

[norwestalta]

Originally Posted by Leafy

That's hard to believe unless you were poaching in February

Supplement feeding works well when we have harsh winters, this has to be carried through to spring into green up or yes there can be some serious consequences to our wildlife.

Think of your moose all summer long and into fall, he or she could have ate as much alfalfa as they want but highly unlikely they would if not locked up... Animals will feed on the "hot" stuff until they get a stomach ache and then forage on other sources...

No shot in November. Was told that it was eating alfalfa. Suppose it could of been other issues.

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by Leafy

Supplement feeding works well when we have harsh winters, this has to be carried through to spring into green up or yes there can be some serious consequences to our wildlife.

absolutely i think if baiting goes legal people should have to do a minimum to stay through the winter.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by norwestalta

No shot in November. Was told that it was eating alfalfa. Suppose it could of been other issues.

November is right after the moose rut, he was probably leaned right out from the rut and just starting to feed regularly again.

[Wild Bounty]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

well that's exactly it. so even if the guy is baiting who's going to prove it? and who would enforce it?

no one. so it might as well be legal

Bang on! So now I guess this ends all discussion

[norwestalta]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

November is right after the moose rut, he was probably leaned right out from the rut and just starting to feed regularly again.

Cow. I've shot other moose before and never seen one like this.