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02-12-2013, 09:37 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catnthehat
Anybody can be beaten, as bushrat said, in the short range BR world, a 1/2" agg is nowhere near a winner.
That's not the point of this challenge however.
Cat
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SSHHHH Babtiste---the club thinks I am working out there every day. I just do the Maintenence and make sure things are in condition for shooters so I can't take credit for "running the place"...however, I must say, in most organizations---the janitor really holds all the power
Cat -- thanks for pointing out this is not a competion...just a fun way to show off your stuff. The reality check for all shooters is a simple by product.
Regarding the BR shooters: I would like to see some of them step forward in this challenge as I am interested to see if shooting in the cold would step them out of the "teens and twos". Not sure if there are "seasons", but it seems we only hear of BR and F-Class competion in the fair weather months?
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02-12-2013, 10:22 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 1,188
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I sure wish I had a 6 BR. I really like the idea of this thread. I know it's not a competition I just know your knowledge 260. You've forgotten more then I know! I'm gonna give this a try with my 6.5x284 Norma and some VLD's. I'm having a hard time finding powders in the last 2 weeks though. Really starting to make me angry!
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Ice fishing is dead have to go to phoenix
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Safety D !!!
Savage LTWT Hunter 111 - 6.5x284 Norma
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02-12-2013, 11:53 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,008
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Actually we used to shoot a winter series out at the Namaka range (south of Strathmore). Winter in Strathmore might be a lot of things but "fair-weather" it is not. These matches were for score on Hunter targets and best scores were usually in the 250-20x range with varmint class rifles. The cold weather was certainly a challenge.
As we all know, in Alberta, cold weather isn't limited to the traditional winter months and I recall one match in late June where snow and cold temperatures had all the visitors (including me) running in to the Co-Op to try and buy cold weather clothing. On the second day, weather was more seasonal; again, typical for Alberta. On another occasion, in early May, a friend and I left Kamloops with temperatures in the low eighties and arrived in Strathmore to shoot in blowing snow. So, benchresters do shoot in poor weather too.
The same is true of "F" class. Though the matches were held in August, the Alberta Provincials are occasionally fired in wet snow.
As I said before, with any decent BR rifle the exercise is without much meaning because the rifle HAS to shoot better than that. With many of the "F" class rifles though it may be a real challenge; especially since many have seldom been shot at 100M. In fact, I have some rifles which are not really competitive any more (things have gotten tougher in "F" class) which I'm not sure will do it. I have a 308 built on a Model 70 which I'll give a try some time this week. If I can do it with this rifle, I'll consider it to be a triumph. If I couldn't do it with my best "F" class rifle or either of my short range BR rifles, I would lay the rifle in the road and drive over it with the truck! Leeper
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02-12-2013, 01:22 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Look behind you :)
Posts: 27,818
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Had a great quick range session today....learned a bunch.
Was able to catch up with 260rem and we swapped rifles to shoot a group. I learned that I need to work on my load and fine tune things a bit more before I would be able to compete in this challenge with that particular firearm.
Also got some instruction on technique and I was able to shoot a less than dime sized (CTC) 5 shot group using 260rem's 30br.....beautiful rifle and set up.
Thanks a bunch 260rem for the help/instruction today very very much appreciated. I need to change up my setup a bit in order to get things "dialed in" thats for sure.
LC
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02-12-2013, 02:41 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 1,188
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I totally agree with you LC. I wish I could download his brain. Do you use a case comparator LC? I find it really helps.
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Ice fishing is dead have to go to phoenix
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Safety D !!!
Savage LTWT Hunter 111 - 6.5x284 Norma
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02-12-2013, 02:45 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Lefty shoots good .. two dry fires with my 30...then five shots into what looked to be about 0.4" @ 100M. If this was a competion, I would not be giving Lefty any more tips. Come to think of it, I should have got him to do the "challenge" with that rifle as it was in a Reibin stock and I could have posted another pic
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02-12-2013, 03:02 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Look behind you :)
Posts: 27,818
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 260 Rem
Lefty shoots good .. two dry fires with my 30...then five shots into what looked to be about 0.4" @ 100M. If this was a competion, I would not be giving Lefty any more tips. Come to think of it, I should have got him to do the "challenge" with that rifle as it was in a Reibin stock and I could have posted another pic
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Here is the pic good guess on the group size
LC
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02-12-2013, 08:07 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,071
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 260 Rem
Regarding the BR shooters: I would like to see some of them step forward in this challenge as I am interested to see if shooting in the cold would step them out of the "teens and twos". Not sure if there are "seasons", but it seems we only hear of BR and F-Class competion in the fair weather months?
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I only dabble in benchrest and haven't shot a match in a couple years or so. Personally I can't afford to keep up with the equipment or the travel expenses. I shoot all winter long but with hunting and varmint rifles. It is too hard to keep a BR rifle in tune in cold weather to consistently shoot to it's potential, let alone the effect chattering teeth have on your groups!
It's been said that it takes "teens and twos" to win a match, those "teen' aggs rarely happen and when they do mostly happen when wind conditions are playing fair. Even with good conditions with a dozen shooters or so, more often than not only a couple or three guys out of a dozen shooting a match will agg in the mid .2's, aggs in the "teens" are rare. Even with the rigs they shoot and the knowledge many of these shooters have I would guess that if you averaged the aggs of every shooter at a weekend match it would be in the .3s to .4s. There are very few "teen" aggs shot, even at the highest level international events with hundreds of shooters. It takes a "teen" agg to win at that level but probably only 5% of competitors at those events actually agg in the "teens" to take home a plaque..
Last edited by Bushrat; 02-12-2013 at 08:12 PM.
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02-12-2013, 08:31 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Thanks Bushrat, I don't feel so bad about my winter groups now. Most of us have never been to a BR match so our impression is that we get from reading. It's great to hear the perspective of a shooter who has walked the walk!
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02-12-2013, 08:37 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 46,149
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It's a lot easier to shoot five groups that average under 1/2" than to shoot five groups that are all under 1/2". I guess that is why we have far more guns that average sub 1/2" than guns that always shoot sub 1/2". Then when you add in cold and wind, even averaging 1/2" get's tough.
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Only accurate guns are interesting.
Last edited by elkhunter11; 02-12-2013 at 08:43 PM.
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02-12-2013, 08:53 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,071
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 260 Rem
It's great to hear the perspective of a shooter who has walked the walk!
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Reality is I only took a few steps, tripped on my lace, fell on my face, out of the race...
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02-13-2013, 10:15 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Given the high interest, but linited participants, I decided to start another thread which "loosens" the requirement to shoot ALL groups under 1/2". Hopefully, that will encourage more people to try this sub-1/2" challenge - and still be able to show off their work if it came close. The rules for this thread have not been changed!
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02-16-2013, 12:53 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Weather is great for shooting in most of Alberta ... anybody trying the five groups under 1/2" Challenge?
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02-20-2013, 07:05 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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To date, Feb 20, 2013 Challenge has been met by:
260 Rem - 30BR/Barnard action/Sako stock
Mods--any way to edit so successfull "challengers" can be posted in the OP (that's how it's done on the gunnutz challenge)?
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02-23-2013, 07:52 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whiskeywillow
I been chewin' on posting for two days already.. personally, I'd be more interested to see how these sub-1/2" rifles perform when you guys take away bench, vice, etc etc & stretch their darn legs a bit...
*260... can you still shoot like that while laying in the dirt, on the ground.. off a bi-pod? Already we'll allow a rear bag. Can you do it?
Could you hold them there beyond 100, consecutively? Off a bi-pod, under spur of the moment/realistic shooting conditions ..@ 300, 400, 700 ??
I'm itchin' to see long-range groupings, and how you guys' rifles stack-up then... and to see if we're still reading about these same "talkers & shooters"
So... Can ya?
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************************************************** ****************
Perhaps best answered in a scene from Quigley Down Under
As he lay dying on the ground, the fast draw gunman looked up at Quigley saying: "I thought you said you weren't good with pistols?" to which Quigley replied, "I said I didn't have much use for 'em...never said I couldn't use them"
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03-02-2013, 06:12 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Anybody shoot Saturday?
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03-20-2013, 02:14 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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March 20th --- Bringing this back to the top to see if anybody is still up to showing their tackdrivers. This Challenge has been up for about 6 weeks ... to date, only one successfull group-set displayed. Come on AO shooters, ten gunnutz made the cut in 2 1/2 months
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03-21-2013, 05:54 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Maidstone Sask
Posts: 2,799
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I am sitting in a hotel room right now, when I get home for my days off I may have something for you. Before I headed off to work I had run out of my favourite 108 Bergers and couldn't find any more locally.
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03-23-2013, 08:39 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Come on AO shooters --- time to get out in the snow.
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03-29-2013, 05:53 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Suggestion made at the Range today to give credit to the gunsmith that chambered the rifles shooting the successfull CHALLENGE. Retro credit for the smith chambering (and the stock-work to fit the Sako) for this 30 BR was Ian Robertson.
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04-04-2013, 01:52 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Here we are, two months after the CHALLENGE'S first post and not many pics, so I tried the same rifle combination with which I met the 300M challenge--and stepped down to 100M-- I had to chase a couple of groups because the initial shot went a bit low-- and I'm still not getting "warm weather groups...but here's what happened.
Rifle is 30BR in Barnard S action / Krieger Short BR -- Smith work by Karl Schmidt
barrel / CG Trigger / Reiben Stock
Last edited by 260 Rem; 04-04-2013 at 01:57 PM.
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04-19-2013, 01:13 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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April 19th --- over 75 days after the initial CHALLENGE and no other AO shooters with pics... I think Gunnutz is up to a dozen different shooters.
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04-22-2013, 09:58 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Edmonton/San Tan Valley,Arizona
Posts: 885
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Will be trying on Wednesday at SPFG. Weather is supposed to be good and not working.
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04-22-2013, 10:31 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Valleyview AB
Posts: 1,376
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When I can secure another pound of H4350 I will be more enthusiastic about the challenge.
With our component shortages and late spring I'm not surprised that few shooters are up for this.
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Pretty girls make us buy beer, the ugly ones make us drink it.
"Al Bundy"
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..... you won't like me when I'm angry...
.....heck you probably won't like me even when I'm not
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04-22-2013, 12:35 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Little Smoky, Alberta
Posts: 110
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I may take a stab at it this weekend too weather permitting of course. How did the 45/70 go for ya Sunday hot wheels?
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Pin it to Win it.
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04-22-2013, 12:37 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Valleyview AB
Posts: 1,376
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I.R.Chevy
I may take a stab at it this weekend too weather permitting of course. How did the 45/70 go for ya Sunday hot wheels?
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I made it thru 15rnds then swapped over to my hunting rifle for a bit... After the 45/70 the 30/06 is a kitten!
Going to play again this coming weekend... Should be interesting
__________________
Pretty girls make us buy beer, the ugly ones make us drink it.
"Al Bundy"
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..... you won't like me when I'm angry...
.....heck you probably won't like me even when I'm not
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04-22-2013, 04:34 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AI 6.5
Will be trying on Wednesday at SPFG. Weather is supposed to be good and not working.
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Big Bore is a bit of a mess with construction materials around but open to 300M unless workers are on site. Overflow is fine.
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05-18-2013, 07:12 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Credits - This Challenge was initially posted in the Precision Rifles thread on Gunnutz by a chap with the handle UNDERTHEGUN on Jan 15, 2013. Underthegun credits the CHALLENGES ideas back to 2012 posts in Sipers Hide. I carried this CHALLENGE over to AO on Feb 07, 2013. The GUNNUTZ thread features the handles of successfull "challengers" and also gives credit to the "smallest average" and "smallest group" which is updated in the OP. I did not transfer the concept of special mention to the "best" to avoid the potential for "competition. This is one of the several CHALLENGES that was "stickied" in Gunnutz Precision Rifles due to it's popularity and high traffic volume. To date, the Gunnutz thread has over 39,000 views with 12 different shooters meeting the thread requirements.
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05-18-2013, 07:43 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nacmine
Posts: 2,286
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I actually tried this challenge at 6:30 this morning. Even with fat head I did quite well. One group measured in the .8's though. Then I remembered to hang onto the gun and things got a lot better with the best group going into the .3's. Maybe next time.
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Proud To Be A Volunteer Fire Fighter.
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05-18-2013, 08:41 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: East Central Alberta
Posts: 8,315
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Good on you tc, look forward to seeing pics of your rig. Guess 0630 is the only time the wind is down to gale force in the south. I don't envy your conditions
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