legislation regarding off roading in a provincial park??

[avb3]

Originally Posted by Domestique

As per the hiway traffic act the hiway is not just the actual roadway, but also encompasses the ditch. I am thinking this ticket should be reduced to a parking ticket, if he was within the ditch

Perhaps the OP could indicate, by editing the overhead shot, exactly where he parked... there is some confusion.

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by avb3

Perhaps the OP could indicate, by editing the overhead shot, exactly where he parked... there is some confusion.

He said he was parked on the side of the old roadway on the other side of the ditch and clarified it as being the arm that comes off the road and looks like it used to be an old parking area or something back in the day and used to be gravel but now appears to be overgrown and blocked with rocks(if still same condition as 2012).

It doesn't even really matter though. It isn't a designated parking area. The one thing that surprises me is that he was told he should park on the side of the road. That is typically a no no too except for emergencies. It would have avoided him being charged with section 26 like he was but I do believe they could still charge him with section 28. If he plans on returning and parking on the side of the road I would be contacting Alberta parks first to get clarification on the legality of doing so.

[avb3]

Originally Posted by RavYak

He said he was parked on the side of the old roadway on the other side of the ditch and clarified it as being the arm that comes off the road and looks like it used to be an old parking area or something back in the day and used to be gravel but now appears to be overgrown and blocked with rocks(if still same condition as 2012).

It doesn't even really matter though. It isn't a designated parking area. The one thing that surprises me is that he was told he should park on the side of the road. That is typically a no no too except for emergencies. It would have avoided him being charged with section 26 like he was but I do believe they could still charge him with section 28. If he plans on returning and parking on the side of the road I would be contacting Alberta parks first to get clarification on the legality of doing so.

I see what you mean. I can't see section 26 standing up if he in fact was parked in the ditch, as the TSA allows that. 28 does cover it though.

I still think his best bet is to go talk to the prosecutor. If all charges are not dropped, I suspect he can get a minor, reduced charge. It sure is a lesson for the rest of us.

I wonder how one goes hunting in areas like that now? Get dropped off and vehicle parked elsewhere, and buddy hunts elsewhere? Puts a dent in things for sure.

Could become a huge problem in the Castle. Maybe there is a business opportunity for hunter transport?

[blackmamba]

So I went out today and grabbed some photos , although I did not park where I was the other afternoon ( dont need another cituation to arise ) however from where my truck is parked in the photos I was on the grassy 2 track you see in the picture.. its obvious that it gets used and not just one or twice a year as its beaten down pretty good.. there are no signs stating that of no parking or motorized vehicles beyond this point ..

this pic is of the rocks blocking the old logging road that is 90 degrees to the road
s1282.photobucket.com/user/easton57/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160306_163255_zpssggienrx.jpg.html][/URL]

the ditch and the end of the rocks

s1282.photobucket.com/user/easton57/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160306_161936_zpshwrdddma.jpg.html][/URL]

my truck parked in the ditch

s1282.photobucket.com/user/easton57/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160306_173349_zpsqfxkapc1.jpg.html][/URL]

[MathewsArcher]

If you were parked past the ditchline and on the two track I think your going to have issues fighting the ticket.

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by avb3

I see what you mean. I can't see section 26 standing up if he in fact was parked in the ditch, as the TSA allows that. 28 does cover it though.

I still think his best bet is to go talk to the prosecutor. If all charges are not dropped, I suspect he can get a minor, reduced charge. It sure is a lesson for the rest of us.

I wonder how one goes hunting in areas like that now? Get dropped off and vehicle parked elsewhere, and buddy hunts elsewhere? Puts a dent in things for sure.

Could become a huge problem in the Castle. Maybe there is a business opportunity for hunter transport?

Ok you got me digging more and this just got more complicated... I didn't think Castle was park land which I was right as the Castle area is a public land use zone with off highway vehicles allowed on designated trails.

But in finding that I also came to realize that the Sibbald area is also a PLUZ not park land as I had thought it to be. I don't believe those park land legislations apply to PLUZ zones as quoted below.

http://esrd.alberta.ca/recreation-pu...s/default.aspx

PLUZs are not designated as parks or protected areas.
Within a PLUZ,
No motorized vehicles are permitted to leave the road other than to use trails designated for an off-highway vehicles (OHV) of a particular size or type.

The park lands that those legislations would apply to are the following.

http://www.albertaparks.ca/albertapa...n-regulations/

But that said there does happen to be a small portion of park land right at that corner... Crane Meadow PRA is the name but I can't find any more info on it as it just says it is closed. Maybe that is why it was charged under parks legislation?

http://esrd.alberta.ca/recreation-pu...icle-pluz.aspx

There are a bunch more regulations for these areas too... I don't really feel like digging through them all right now though...

http://esrd.alberta.ca/recreation-pu...gislation.aspx

Either way you aren't supposed to leave the road with a vehicle in that PLUZ or if it is part of Crane Meadow PRA. If that isn't park land and that is what they charged you with might be able to fight that technicality but not sure how you prove where the park land is or isn't and have to make sure they did in fact charge you under parks legislation as well(I just assumed as the 26 charge matched it).

I would try to get clarification on parking in the ditch like you did on this last trip as I am not sure if that is completely legal either.

[KBF]

Originally Posted by RavYak

Ok you got me digging more and this just got more complicated... I didn't think Castle was park land which I was right as the Castle area is a public land use zone with off highway vehicles allowed on designated trails.

But in finding that I also came to realize that the Sibbald area is also a PLUZ not park land as I had thought it to be. I don't believe those park land legislations apply to PLUZ zones as quoted below.

http://esrd.alberta.ca/recreation-pu...s/default.aspx



The park lands that those legislations would apply to are the following.

http://www.albertaparks.ca/albertapa...n-regulations/

But that said there does happen to be a small portion of park land right at that corner... Crane Meadow PRA is the name but I can't find any more info on it as it just says it is closed. Maybe that is why it was charged under parks legislation?

http://esrd.alberta.ca/recreation-pu...icle-pluz.aspx

There are a bunch more regulations for these areas too... I don't really feel like digging through them all right now though...

http://esrd.alberta.ca/recreation-pu...gislation.aspx

Either way you aren't supposed to leave the road with a vehicle in that PLUZ or if it is part of Crane Meadow PRA. If that isn't park land and that is what they charged you with might be able to fight that technicality but not sure how you prove where the park land is or isn't and have to make sure they did in fact charge you under parks legislation as well(I just assumed as the 26 charge matched it).

I would try to get clarification on parking in the ditch like you did on this last trip as I am not sure if that is completely legal either.

For now, hopefully the Castle doesn't become a park.

[anthony5]

Originally Posted by blackmamba

Not on private property, crown land in k country. This is exactly where I was parked off the gravel road. looks like a staging area for rec users using the trail systems to me..

s1282.photobucket.com/user/easton57/media/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_2016-03-04-23-43-02_zps15eb09tl.png.html][/URL]

Mamba, hopelfully your judge interprets the law, and not just reads as written.( as I understand for rules in K country)Otherwise you would have been better off parking on the side of the road. This is what goes on in K country parking "almost" on the side!! west and south of Longview, and it can be a little scary at times. Be a real crying shame to pull off onto the ditch or approach, in your case, to maybe make things a little safer on our road ways.I have driven through K country in this area and not seen less than 3 vehicles parked off the road or in the ditch and have not seen or heard of any citations given out and have been driving this area for over 30 years.

Hope it works in your favour, for all of our sake.

[blackmamba]

Originally Posted by anthony5

Mamba, hopelfully your judge interprets the law, and not just reads as written.( as I understand for rules in K country)Otherwise you would have been better off parking on the side of the road. This is what goes on in K country parking "almost" on the side!! west and south of Longview, and it can be a little scary at times. Be a real crying shame to pull off onto the ditch or approach, in your case, to maybe make things a little safer on our road ways.I have driven through K country in this area and not seen less than 3 vehicles parked off the road or in the ditch and have not seen or heard of any citations given out and have been driving this area for over 30 years.

Hope it works in your favour, for all of our sake.

Yes k country has approximately 3 million(as stated to me by another conservation officer ) people go through it each year , and there isn't a day that there arent hundreds of vehicles lining the ditches . And sometimes are not done in a safe manner , and puts us all at risk . To take the liberty of being completely out of the way of harm for myself the fine is worth it in my mind.. just frustrating that common sense comes with a price tag ..

[mac1983]

Ran into fish n chips yesterday at sturgeon lake while sledding and fishing. I was having a cool one with buddy and in he comes sledding right into our camp on the lake. Very nice fella we bs'ed for about an hour, very informative session.
Telling me horrer stories about bad hunters poaching tresspassing and general bad behaviour and how they give him abuse i believe him, a standup kinda guy.
Bad behaviour by hunters are giving them all a bad rep, he had nothing bad to say about fisherman or trappers, other than the natives so called sustenance activities, we had a good talk. So in other words do it legal and if you get a ticket by some powerhungry fc fight it it is our right. By the way he did not mention my cool one or ask for a license we were just enjoying the day outdoors, just sayin.....

[fitzy]

Something that gets forgotten a lot is, a lot of these guys are guys that grew up loving the outdoors and doing the things we love to do. Yeah I've run into the odd one that I suspect was maybe a reject from society but on the whole they're good people who when treated with respect tend to give it back. Like most people in law enforcement.

They're just regular people, they'll have their bad days just like us.

[Yaha Tinda]

Be careful what ditch you park in, I was assaulted for parking off the roadway (>20') and the RCMP defended it.

[Domestique]

If you were on the grassy 2 track in the 2nd pic above the rocks I think you are SOL.

[winged1]

Originally Posted by Domestique

If you were on the grassy 2 track in the 2nd pic above the rocks I think you are SOL.

X2 , that would definitely be over reaching.

[waterninja]

I have one question for the OP. I am not familar with the location you got this ticket but your title said it was in a provincial park. You also stated you were scouting for a new tree stand location.
My question is are you even allowed to hunt in a provincial park? I always thought it was illegal to hunt in a provincial park. I'm a little surprised no one else has brought this up after 3 pages. Please excuse me if I am wrong about this. I'll have to check regs again.

[purgatory.sv]

I think page 35 of the 2015 regulations give direction.

[IAMBREAD]

Originally Posted by RavYak

Alberta parks land does not have the same relaxed laws and enforcement that most crown land does.

True.
If you're in Alberta Parks you better know the rules! (Which generally means the places you're allowed to do stuff have about thirty signs). Even if it goes against your "common sense", as well just because your father had done it for 20 years or everyone else is doing it, doesn't make it right!

Find a designated parking spot or get a Conservation Officers written approval and you wont have to worry!

[IAMBREAD]

Originally Posted by waterninja

I have one question for the OP. I am not familar with the location you got this ticket but your title said it was in a provincial park. You also stated you were scouting for a new tree stand location.
My question is are you even allowed to hunt in a provincial park? I always thought it was illegal to hunt in a provincial park. I'm a little surprised no one else has brought this up after 3 pages. Please excuse me if I am wrong about this. I'll have to check regs again.

Originally Posted by purgatory.sv

I think page 35 of the 2015 regulations give direction.

Indeed, he would be in a Wildland Park or Natural area, which both also happen to have stricter OHV restrictions, probably another reason for the ticket.

In total waterninja there's 60 different Provincial Parks inside Kananaskis, so it's good to know where you are and what you can do!

http://www.albertaparks.ca/kananaski...in-kananaskis/

[Grizzly Adams]

Plead not guilty, go to court and see if the officer even shows up.

Grizz

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by waterninja

I have one question for the OP. I am not familar with the location you got this ticket but your title said it was in a provincial park. You also stated you were scouting for a new tree stand location.
My question is are you even allowed to hunt in a provincial park? I always thought it was illegal to hunt in a provincial park. I'm a little surprised no one else has brought this up after 3 pages. Please excuse me if I am wrong about this. I'll have to check regs again.

Unless I am mistaken he was actually in a public land use zone not provincial park land(although there is a speck of park land right at that corner that he perhaps was in but I couldn't find a map of the exact borders).

Each PLUZ has different regulations on a variety of things. The one in that area does allow hunting.

http://esrd.alberta.ca/recreation-pu...icle-pluz.aspx

I believe you are correct about not hunting on park land though. Which I found kind of odd from the beginning but figured I just didn't know the regs as I am not a hunter.

[Jake-138]

Originally Posted by blackmamba

I will be fighting this one forsure..

Just remember, you should start your fight before going to court... Your issue now is not with the judge but the prosecutor. Chances are you can resolve it before taking it to a judge.

Judges jobs are to resolve conflicts that couldn't otherwise be resolved.

Contact the court and speak with first appearance attorney.

[Acesneights]

Well good thing that CO taught us all a valuable lesson, when finding a spot to park, make sure you pull well off the road, preferably well into the trees and cover your truck with branches that you break off from the nearest growing shrubs and trees. If this was a Honda Civic instead off the pickup that you parked there this wouldn't have even been an issue. Sad!!!!