View Poll Results: Do you believe in evolution or creation?
|
Creation
|
|
119 |
29.38% |
Evolution
|
|
286 |
70.62% |
|
|
06-13-2017, 09:35 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,066
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
I would agree that they're all bears with different micro evolutionary changes. I guess when I say Macroevolution I should not be saying species, but organisms.
This is what I don't agree with:
"Macroevolution refers to major evolutionary changes over time, the origin of new types of organisms from previously existing, but different, ancestral types."
So basically you take a dog and turn it into a fish.... Nothing like that has ever been seen or done that I know of.
|
I think you've pretty much discredited yourself with your cat-lizard post.
|
06-13-2017, 09:46 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 5,326
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Thumper
The easiest for you to understand would be the chronological order of fossils found in rock strata. Very accurate and always in correct order when strata are intact. (like at the Grand Canyon)
|
And what about fossils that extend through more than one layer?
|
06-13-2017, 09:48 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 445
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered user
No mention of dinosaurs in the bible. it only goes as far back as a talking snake, hmmmm.
|
Yeah, but the talking donkey beat Shrek by about 2100 years. I wonder what language that braying beast enunciated himself in?
|
06-13-2017, 09:49 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Alberta
Posts: 10,937
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
Because everyone has a different opinion. Let it be noted the bible does not say the earth was created 6000 years ago, but that man has added it up and came to that conclusion through the genealogy.
|
Maybe Creationists need to get together, have a talk and figure it all out. This is more confusing than I ever expected.
Growing up Catholic, we were taught the earth was created in 6 days - then God rested on the 7th. None of this 1000 years per day and yada yada yada.
Now, so called scientists want to take creation back to the big bang, give ownership of all human discoveries to God. Imagine why so many are so confused when creation is all over the map.
I'm still trying to figure out how a bunch of ignorant men - that squished, banned, and tortured and killed scientists back in the day for heresy - can create this mess we have today? It's no wonder why so many are leaving the church - and turning to evolution. I suspect if this poll was done 100 years ago, 95% plus would believe in creation.
I'm going to start big banging my head against the wall.
|
06-13-2017, 09:50 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 11,887
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newview01
You are insinuating I agree with all creationists. I believe in a young earth.
|
No, that wasn't my insinuation, simply because creationists are all over the map of this vast timeline spanning anywhere from 6000 years ago up to 6 billion years - and, logically, you can't agree with every creationist groups perspective on this.
I am curious though - when you say you believe in a young earth, how many years old do you think the earth is?
|
06-13-2017, 09:54 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Alberta
Posts: 10,937
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by EZM
6 billion years
|
13.7 billion years actually EZM - they want to take it back to the singularity.
If Weber shows us that the universe is older - I'm sure creation will be adjusted accordingly.
|
06-13-2017, 09:59 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,066
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newview01
And what about fossils that extend through more than one layer?
|
please clarify this? Do you mean fossils that appear in several strata before disappearing?
This is really interesting science and its really what we do here in AB with index fossils etc when we are looking for oil.
|
06-13-2017, 10:07 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,168
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Thumper
please clarify this? Do you mean fossils that appear in several strata before disappearing?
This is really interesting science and its really what we do here in AB with index fossils etc when we are looking for oil.
|
God put them there so we could find oil. He is always watching out for us.
__________________
Moral indignation is a technique used to endow the idiot with dignity.
Marshall McLuhan
|
06-13-2017, 10:11 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 11,887
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newview01
And what about fossils that extend through more than one layer?
|
I assume this is a serious question - so I will try and provide a serious answer (to the best of my understanding).
It means these fossilised organisms lived for a period distending beyond several layers of rock. The dinosaurs, (many species over three distinct periods) for example, can be seen through hundreds of feet of varying layers.
Some fossils begin and end within a layer or two, while others distend into dozens or more layers, with each organism potentially overlapping other organisms and overlapping layers.
Most fossils do have a beginning (an appearance) and an end (in some cases an extinction).
It is also where you can see small adaptations take place over the layers (and time) as organisms evolve.
This is a clear evidence of the premise of evolution in simple organisms.
Quite simple if graphically illustrated.
|
06-13-2017, 10:21 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Provost, Ab
Posts: 145
|
|
.
A creationist friend of mine told me God put the dinosaur bones there to make us ask questions and raise doubt. I honestly can't understand what some people think... And I was born and raised a catholic, in a catholic school.
Here is the funny thing.... life could have been put here(earth) by something else. Who's to say that some species didn't seed thousands of planets with life half a billion years ago(could be a blink of an eye to some species, time is a matter of perception). We could just be some experiment. "God" could certainly exist but would be more of a scientist then a deity.
|
06-13-2017, 10:22 PM
|
|
Gone Hunting
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: North of Peace River
Posts: 11,343
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Thumper
Would you agree that there are three species of bears in Canada? All sharing similar traits but three distinct species.
|
Some say two and two sub, some say three, some say four, some say more.
Black, Grizzly, Polar.
Black, Grizzly, Polar and Brown Bear.
Black, Grizzly, Brown Bear and Kermode
Some argue that Grizzly are a subspecies of Brown Bear, some that Kermode are a subspeices of Black bears.
Most agree that there are only two speices and two subspecies.
Black and Polar, ----- Grizzly and Kermode
Science can't seem to agree on something as simple as what species some bears are. How then are we to believe that science has ALL the answers about how millions of species came to be.
__________________
Democracy substitutes election by the incompetent many for appointment by the corrupt few.
George Bernard Shaw
|
06-13-2017, 10:30 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 6,962
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by covey ridge
I can understand what you are feeling. The only thing I would say to that is it is not only about feeling or even mostly about feeling. Giving your life over to Christ is not about getting something warm and fuzzy back. If that is what you want hug a kitten or a teddy bear. Turning your life over to Christ may start by learning about Christ and then doing the things that Christ might do when faced with an opportunity or a crisis or caring about the things Christ cared about. If you do some of the things that Christ cared about you may realize that Christ cares about you.
I am too far off topic here so I will not say more.
|
I know its not about the warm fuzzies, but after being indoctrinated, studying and attending thousands of church services and functions one would think I should at least have gotten a feeling that God and Christ exist. At an early age I sensed something was off with the whole religion thing. The more I learned the more I became convinced that if there were a creator, that creator had little to do with the bible we know today.
My opinion is the bible has evolved into a bastardized chronicle of anecdotal stories tailored to suit the need of various powers that be at the time, edited and evolving over time to address social change subject to the gov't, church or religious organizations current agendas over various epochs and eras. Various religions and gov'ts have used bibles and religion as constitutional aid and code of laws ever since the idea of religion was first conceived. Not saying we didn't have a creator, I just don't think the Bible is a credible account of creation if in fact we were created.
|
06-13-2017, 10:32 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,296
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bushrat
I know its not about the warm fuzzies, but after being indoctrinated, studying and attending thousands of church services and functions one would think I should at least have gotten a feeling that God and Christ exist. At an early age I sensed something was off with the whole religion thing. The more I learned the more I became convinced that if there were a creator, that creator had little to do with the bible we know today.
My opinion is the bible has evolved into a bastardized chronicle of anecdotal stories tailored to suit the need of various powers that be at the time, edited and evolving over time to address social change subject to the church or religious organizations current agendas over various epochs and eras. Various religions and gov'ts have used bibles and religion as constitutional aid and code of laws ever since the idea of religion was first conceived. Not saying we didn't have a creator, I just don't think the Bible is a credible account of creation if in fact we were created.
|
see you at the evergreen temple?
|
06-13-2017, 10:35 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,066
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by KegRiver
Some say two and two sub, some say three, some say four, some say more.
Black, Grizzly, Polar.
Black, Grizzly, Polar and Brown Bear.
Black, Grizzly, Brown Bear and Kermode
Some argue that Grizzly are a subspecies of Brown Bear, some that Kermode are a subspeices of Black bears.
Most agree that there are only two speices and two subspecies.
Black and Polar, ----- Grizzly and Kermode
Science can't seem to agree on something as simple as what species some bears are. How then are we to believe that science has ALL the answers about how millions of species came to be.
|
Where did you read that?
There are three recognized species currently alive in the wild in Canada today by biologists .
|
06-13-2017, 10:36 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 6,962
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by purgatory.sv
see you at the evergreen temple?
|
Yes Thursday.
|
06-13-2017, 10:40 PM
|
|
Gone Hunting
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: North of Peace River
Posts: 11,343
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverdoctor
Maybe Creationists need to get together, have a talk and figure it all out. This is more confusing than I ever expected.
|
You are kidding aren't you!
When in the history of mankind has any two people ever agreed on anything!!
Of course I'm kidding, but the sad fact is, there will never be agreement between the opposing sides, on this subject.
One side is afraid that there might be a God and need to deny that possibility, the other side is afraid there might be no God so must find any means to support his existance.
In the middle are those who believe that there can be creation and evolution working together and those who realize that none of this matters in the end.
What is, is and arguing about it will not change what is.
__________________
Democracy substitutes election by the incompetent many for appointment by the corrupt few.
George Bernard Shaw
|
06-13-2017, 10:43 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: With my dogs
Posts: 4,545
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Thumper
Where did you read that?
There are three recognized species currently alive in the wild in Canada today by biologists .
|
Exactly. I have hesitated to comment on this thread so far...but the lack of basic knowledge on this forum (not only about bears -- in many other fields as well) is extremely disturbing. Learn the basics before you start arguing about things, guysl
__________________
alacringa
"This Brittany is my most cherished possession — the darndest bird-finder I have ever seen, a tough and wiry little dog with a choke-bored nose and the ability to read birds’ minds." -Jack O'Connor
|
06-13-2017, 10:49 PM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,296
|
|
fire
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bushrat
Yes Thursday.
|
Can't go ,all know it's no longer a secret.
About 2.59 after sunrise.
All will be revealed.
|
06-13-2017, 11:15 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,066
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
|
Not hard to tell he does not have a biology background!
|
06-13-2017, 11:21 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,168
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
|
Lol. DNA has been the best thing for evolution science ever! It answered a lot of questions and confirmed a lot of theories and opened many new lines of inquiry.
__________________
Moral indignation is a technique used to endow the idiot with dignity.
Marshall McLuhan
|
06-13-2017, 11:28 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,858
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjemac
Lol. DNA has been the best thing for evolution science ever! It answered a lot of questions and confirmed a lot of theories and opened many new lines of inquiry.
|
Did you watch the video...
|
06-13-2017, 11:36 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,168
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
Did you watch the video...
|
Yes. And he either doesn't understand DNA and mutations or (more likely) he is being deliberately misleading.
__________________
Moral indignation is a technique used to endow the idiot with dignity.
Marshall McLuhan
|
06-13-2017, 11:39 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,066
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by raab
Did you watch the video...
|
I have it on listening here while I work. I'm assuming you are using this clown's video to show how a totally unqualified person, working at this 'discovery institute' , using pseudo science can sound like somewhat like a scientist to the uneducated.
Its actually quite funny and must be a real embarrassment to the 'Discovery Institute' much like his first book Signature in the Cell
|
06-13-2017, 11:43 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,066
|
|
Well, at least he did visit the Burgess shale here in Canada. ( not sure if that is what qualifies him to write and talk on such subjects?)
|
06-13-2017, 11:47 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,168
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Thumper
Well, at least he did visit the Burgess shale here in Canada. ( not sure if that is what qualifies him to write and talk on such subjects?)
|
The PhD in the history of science certainly has to qualify him for…… Something. Maybe like a degree in drama teaching qualifies someone else for…… Something
__________________
Moral indignation is a technique used to endow the idiot with dignity.
Marshall McLuhan
|
06-13-2017, 11:54 PM
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,066
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjemac
The PhD in the history of science certainly has to qualify him for…… Something. Maybe like a degree in drama teaching qualifies someone else for…… Something
|
Yeah, not sure. Really funny thing is he actually uses the Burgess shale to back up his false claims about the 'Cambrian Explosion'. Of course, anybody who had done any research or even read the tourist pamphlet would know that the Burgess shale is middle Cambrian, millions and millions of years after the Cambrian Explosion. Embarrassing stuff , really.
|
06-14-2017, 12:03 AM
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,168
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Thumper
Yeah, not sure. Really funny thing is he actually uses the Burgess shale to back up his false claims about the 'Cambrian Explosion'. Of course, anybody who had done any research or even read the tourist pamphlet would know that the Burgess shale is middle Cambrian, millions and millions of years after the Cambrian Explosion. Embarrassing stuff , really.
|
I think the thing that truly scares me about this debate and holistic medicine and naturopaths and and and... is that charlatans are co-opting the terminology and language of the scientific method to try to endow their superstitions and snake oil with legitimacy. While they talk of science, they aren't actually doing it.
The end result is a fear and distrust of the scientific method. On the light end, people avoid MSG for no reason at all. On the dark end, smallpox comes back because morons won't vaccinate their kids --- but that's another thread – – often beaten to death.
__________________
Moral indignation is a technique used to endow the idiot with dignity.
Marshall McLuhan
|
06-14-2017, 12:09 AM
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,066
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjemac
I think the thing that truly scares me about this debate and holistic medicine and naturopaths and and and... is that charlatans are co-opting the terminology and language of the scientific method to try to endow their superstitions and snake oil with legitimacy. While they talk of science, they aren't actually doing it.
The end result is a fear and distrust of the scientific method. On the light end, people avoid MSG for no reason at all. On the dark end, smallpox comes back because morons won't vaccinate their kids --- but that's another thread – – often beaten to death.
|
There must be good money in misleading the uneducated. Seems to be a few of them making a living at it.
|
06-14-2017, 12:27 AM
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,908
|
|
I know there is billions if not trillions of stars and planets,if you think there there for the heck of it fine,i would like to know who put them there.
Not a matter of a billion years or what ever how did this all come to be and who can say I am right or wrong,plus I have no answer to it all,but I just don't think a monkey made this whole deal and made such a vast universe ,some higher power or intelligence made this happen,what who and how did this is the 99 dollar question and answer,most guys don't know how the camera is put into there cell phones and what is hid under the sahara desert,but yet can tell you when this and that became to be,the FBI worked liked crazy to figure out how to reboot an iphone to get info out of it,but then there's wacko's that know who think they know when it all began.
These same guys don't know where the sidewalk ends and the road begins,so go figure,this topic can go on longer than my computer or yours will last,all I know for sure is that if you look straight down and not move your looking at the center of the planet,same thing if your sitting on the toilet ,the water turns clock wise and below the equator it turns counter clockwise,but it's still the center if you focus hard enough.
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:33 PM.
|