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08-31-2016, 09:39 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 934
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Big Grey you are totally right. There has been a pile harping on this subject. Alot of the trappers don't realize that this has been in the works for alot of years. People have to realize that with a rfma you are LEASING the land to trap fur. With alot of leased land it gets abused. I was talking with a county foreman and leased agriculture land is going under the microscope soon also. Even though you can't please everyone, changes are coming some good and some bad.
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CAVEAT EMPTOR!
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08-31-2016, 09:51 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 6,395
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Uke, if what you are saying on staff changes at ATA is true, agree that is somewhat of a concern. However we have to go with the team we have left.
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08-31-2016, 10:19 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Fort McMurray, Alberta
Posts: 286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 209x50
More a case of the staff were underemployed. When they were asked to step up and produce as the ATA needs from their limited funds they chose to resign,
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There is always two sides to the story Rich. Not at all what I heard from the other side......
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08-31-2016, 10:42 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North of the Kakwa
Posts: 3,967
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I sense a great disturbance in the force right now...
Not at all impressed with what is going on personally with our Bios but I'll reserve my comments until the issue is final. Troubling times out there in the trapping world !
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08-31-2016, 10:46 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 5,412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uke hunter
There is always two sides to the story Rich. Not at all what I heard from the other side......
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True story no matter how thin the pancake is there are always two sides. However even a blind man could see the changes that needed to be done in Staffing.
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08-31-2016, 11:23 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Fort McMurray, Alberta
Posts: 286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 209x50
True story no matter how thin the pancake is there are always two sides. However even a blind man could see the changes that needed to be done in Staffing.
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And those that are still required at the top......
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08-31-2016, 11:53 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uke hunter
And those that are still required at the top......
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Sounds like a good opportunity for you to step up instead of complaining and throwing out accusations.
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08-31-2016, 12:02 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Fort McMurray, Alberta
Posts: 286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moose maniac
Sounds like a good opportunity for you to step up instead of complaining and throwing out accusations.
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I have standards with respect to professional conduct/communication that those at the top, from personal experience, fall vastly short of. Not getting into it....enough said.
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08-31-2016, 12:04 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,107
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Big Grey Wolf, you are a true pack leader, I respect your attitude of pulling together while still checking the facts.
People love conspiracies. But if you attend your local meetings, AGM's, etc all will be revealed.
Executive Director who was hired didn't meet performance standards so was let go. ATA streamlined processes and reviewed office staffing and realized their were savings to be had without loss of member services.
And i'm sure if you talk to anyone who is out of a job, and its not their choice, what kind of feedback would you get? I applaud the exec for taking action.
I'm sure you all attend local meeting so you know our exec is actively developing work plans and strategic planning? If I could wave my magic wand no trapper would be able to make public complaints if they weren't an ATA active member and kept themselves informed.
You guys sniping about the ATA are shooting yourselves in the foot. This isn't government, industry, or some NGO. This is us, these are our fellow trappers, everyone on of them with a real bush resume and passion for our industry. Yet year after year they get dumped on by the people they're trying to help. In no way are they perfect. In fact we've butted heads over the years on issues, but respectfully and face to face.
If you won't step up and offer constructive criticism it says more about your character then the ATA. Imagine the power if every local took the time to send a personal thank you from their local to the Exec for looking out for us. Wouldn't that empower them going into a negotiation? Knowing the members have their back, not trying to kneecap them? I guess I live in a different world.
And no Nube it's not always about you, I was talking to porkfat, who like Elvis has left the room, but like Jesus will be back I'm sure in another form.
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08-31-2016, 12:47 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uke hunter
I have standards with respect to professional conduct/communication that those at the top, from personal experience, fall vastly short of. Not getting into it....enough said.
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So just another tin foil hat guy who thinks that these VOLUTEERS are out to .... Sometimes I really have to wonder why they bother
Last edited by catnthehat; 09-04-2016 at 08:37 PM.
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08-31-2016, 03:30 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Fort McMurray, Alberta
Posts: 286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moose maniac
So just another tin foil hat guy who thinks that these VOLUTEERS are out to .... Sometimes I really have to wonder why they bother
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Some volunteers should stay at home.
Last edited by catnthehat; 09-04-2016 at 08:37 PM.
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08-31-2016, 05:15 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Copperhead Road, Morinville
Posts: 19,289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 209x50
More a case of the staff were underemployed. When they were asked to step up and produce as the ATA needs from their limited funds they chose to resign,
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I wouldn't be so quick to throw those individuals under the bus. Do you even know them or are you just repeating what someone told you?
The first batch of fur that I took in last season I had the opportunity to chat with Coral and Anne (I think that was her name?). I immediately noticed how stressed out they both were so I stuck around until things quieted down a bit because I was concerned about them. I told Coral that she needed to take care of herself and rest up a bit. That's when I found out about the re-org with AJ no longer managing the depot and was dedicated full time to teaching trapping courses and that both her and Anne (?) had put in their notices. I was really disappointed to hear that but given both their highly stressed condition I didn't need to ask why they were leaving. For $14 per hour I would have put my health first as well.
The next batch of fur that I brought in there was only AJ there running the whole show. He seemed somewhat stressed as well but not as concerning to me as what the two ladies were. I couldn't imagine that lasted too long.
Leadership principle #6 - Know your personnel and promote their welfare.
What limited ATA funds are you referring to? Now that the Standard Trapping Course is mandatory, "the demand for courses has significantly increased." (From the ATA site). Logic would dictate that there has also been an increase in revenue......correct? How is it that a depot manager, an admin clerk and a staff member in the depot/store was affordable prior to the influx of revenue but not after? (Honest question)
I don't know who's brainwave it was to eliminate the manager position and frankly I don't care. What I do take exception with is people who would throw these two ladies under the bus and make it sound like they ran out on their jobs. Both ladies had always provided me with outstanding service and routinely went above and beyond in their duties (ie. Labelling my coyotes in a specific order in order for me to track the grades at auction). In all my visits to the ATA I have never, ever observed them relaxing on the job. Quite the contrary, they had always been very busy with their duties.
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08-31-2016, 06:31 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: northern AB
Posts: 2,241
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For the first time in way to long, has the real issued been raised again, that being the internal operation of our ATA. This situation was created or started way back when maybe 8 - 10 years and has "progressed to where we are now -----divided, to say the least.
As for Nube's comments...sounds like he ruffled a few feather and damn good for him. Those who did contribute to the "Original" ATA publication, were soon made outcasts when it became a family affair. As it is now - you can voice your opinion as long as it is in agreement with mine.
There is not many places where our laundry can be washed, so maybe this will have to be it ----for a while anyway ---maybe till the next AGM. Rob is letting his name stand for VP, so it will be very interesting to see which way the gate swings.
Not the time to start writing a book but STAY TUNED
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08-31-2016, 09:00 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HunterDave
I wouldn't be so quick to throw those individuals under the bus. Do you even know them or are you just repeating what someone told you?
The first batch of fur that I took in last season I had the opportunity to chat with Coral and Anne (I think that was her name?). I immediately noticed how stressed out they both were so I stuck around until things quieted down a bit because I was concerned about them. I told Coral that she needed to take care of herself and rest up a bit. That's when I found out about the re-org with AJ no longer managing the depot and was dedicated full time to teaching trapping courses and that both her and Anne (?) had put in their notices. I was really disappointed to hear that but given both their highly stressed condition I didn't need to ask why they were leaving. For $14 per hour I would have put my health first as well.
The next batch of fur that I brought in there was only AJ there running the whole show. He seemed somewhat stressed as well but not as concerning to me as what the two ladies were. I couldn't imagine that lasted too long.
Leadership principle #6 - Know your personnel and promote their welfare.
What limited ATA funds are you referring to? Now that the Standard Trapping Course is mandatory, "the demand for courses has significantly increased." (From the ATA site). Logic would dictate that there has also been an increase in revenue......correct? How is it that a depot manager, an admin clerk and a staff member in the depot/store was affordable prior to the influx of revenue but not after? (Honest question)
I don't know who's brainwave it was to eliminate the manager position and frankly I don't care. What I do take exception with is people who would throw these two ladies under the bus and make it sound like they ran out on their jobs. Both ladies had always provided me with outstanding service and routinely went above and beyond in their duties (ie. Labelling my coyotes in a specific order in order for me to track the grades at auction). In all my visits to the ATA I have never, ever observed them relaxing on the job. Quite the contrary, they had always been very busy with their duties.
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The old saying " The empty vessel makes the most noise" really suites you Dave lmao
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08-31-2016, 10:59 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Copperhead Road, Morinville
Posts: 19,289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moose maniac
The old saying " The empty vessel makes the most noise" really suites you Dave lmao
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Thank you for the chuckle.
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09-01-2016, 09:42 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HunterDave
Thank you for the chuckle.
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I guess it don't take a lot to amuse a simple mind??
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09-01-2016, 09:45 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HunterDave
I wouldn't be so quick to throw those individuals under the bus. Do you even know them or are you just repeating what someone told you?
The first batch of fur that I took in last season I had the opportunity to chat with Coral and Anne (I think that was her name?). I immediately noticed how stressed out they both were so I stuck around until things quieted down a bit because I was concerned about them. I told Coral that she needed to take care of herself and rest up a bit. That's when I found out about the re-org with AJ no longer managing the depot and was dedicated full time to teaching trapping courses and that both her and Anne (?) had put in their notices. I was really disappointed to hear that but given both their highly stressed condition I didn't need to ask why they were leaving. For $14 per hour I would have put my health first as well.
The next batch of fur that I brought in there was only AJ there running the whole show. He seemed somewhat stressed as well but not as concerning to me as what the two ladies were. I couldn't imagine that lasted too long.
Leadership principle #6 - Know your personnel and promote their welfare.
What limited ATA funds are you referring to? Now that the Standard Trapping Course is mandatory, "the demand for courses has significantly increased." (From the ATA site). Logic would dictate that there has also been an increase in revenue......correct? How is it that a depot manager, an admin clerk and a staff member in the depot/store was affordable prior to the influx of revenue but not after? (Honest question)
I don't know who's brainwave it was to eliminate the manager position and frankly I don't care. What I do take exception with is people who would throw these two ladies under the bus and make it sound like they ran out on their jobs. Both ladies had always provided me with outstanding service and routinely went above and beyond in their duties (ie. Labelling my coyotes in a specific order in order for me to track the grades at auction). In all my visits to the ATA I have never, ever observed them relaxing on the job. Quite the contrary, they had always been very busy with their duties.
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And by the way Dave why are you taking fur to the ATA?? Your to cheap to support them by simply buying a membership.
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09-01-2016, 10:34 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Fort McMurray, Alberta
Posts: 286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moose maniac
And by the way Dave why are you taking fur to the ATA?? Your to cheap to support them by simply buying a membership.
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It's "You're too" not "your to".....and you think Dave is simple....
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09-01-2016, 10:43 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: In a house
Posts: 7,770
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I think Dave actually has some pretty good info and isn't the type to be swayed to meet his own objective. He has some very valid thoughts.....
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09-01-2016, 10:47 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Fort McMurray, Alberta
Posts: 286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube
I think Dave actually has some pretty good info and isn't the type to be swayed to meet his own objective. He has some very valid thoughts.....
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Some "close minded" individuals on here better open their eyes and see what's actually happening in the ATA. Blind faith gets you nowhere.
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09-01-2016, 11:28 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uke hunter
It's "You're too" not "your to".....and you think Dave is simple....
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Auto correct on an I phone when YOU'RE in a hurry... Pretty sad thats all you can come up with.
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09-01-2016, 12:30 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Copperhead Road, Morinville
Posts: 19,289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moose maniac
And by the way Dave why are you taking fur to the ATA?? Your to cheap to support them by simply buying a membership.
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That's the problem with accepting everything that you're told as factual. It can make you look silly. In the future you might want to consider the source and credibility of the individual(s) telling you things.
For the sake of avoiding future derails by the bobbleheads here's the whole story. Three years ago I joined the ATA and at that time Ann (geeze, I wish that I was certain of her name) guided me through the process of setting up my NAFA account, ATA membership, etc. The following year when I brought in my Fall rats I was reminded that memberships were due and I took care of it on the spot. Last year I wasn't reminded and I allowed my membership to lapse. It was brought to my attention towards the end of July and I renewed it as soon as I could.
I believe that the re-org at the ATA depot may have contributed to the staff not reminding me that memberships were expiring otherwise I would have taken care of it right there and then like I had done the previous year. As I described in the post that you quoted, the staff at the depot was working frantically to keep up with their workload. Ultimately, it was my responsibility and I'm not the type of person to blame others for things that I'm responsible for. Besides, the last I heard there was a cost involved with dropping off fur at the ATA for non-members and I had been dropping my fur off there all season. Based simply on that, out of principle, I believe that it was the right thing to do.
It amazes me how some people are so easily manipulated and distracted from the real issue and diverted away from it simply bringing up something as trivial as whether or not my membership is up to date or not. Oh look.....a squirrel.
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09-01-2016, 12:57 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HunterDave
That's the problem with accepting everything that you're told as factual. It can make you look silly. In the future you might want to consider the source and credibility of the individual(s) telling you things.
For the sake of avoiding future derails by the bobbleheads here's the whole story. Three years ago I joined the ATA and at that time Ann (geeze, I wish that I was certain of her name) guided me through the process of setting up my NAFA account, ATA membership, etc. The following year when I brought in my Fall rats I was reminded that memberships were due and I took care of it on the spot. Last year I wasn't reminded and I allowed my membership to lapse. It was brought to my attention towards the end of July and I renewed it as soon as I could.
I believe that the re-org at the ATA depot may have contributed to the staff not reminding me that memberships were expiring otherwise I would have taken care of it right there and then like I had done the previous year. As I described in the post that you quoted, the staff at the depot was working frantically to keep up with their workload. Ultimately, it was my responsibility and I'm not the type of person to blame others for things that I'm responsible for. Besides, the last I heard there was a cost involved with dropping off fur at the ATA for non-members and I had been dropping my fur off there all season. Based simply on that, out of principle, I believe that it was the right thing to do.
It amazes me how some people are so easily manipulated and distracted from the real issue and diverted away from it simply bringing up something as trivial as whether or not my membership is up to date or not. Oh look.....a squirrel.
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Glad you finally ran out and renewed you membership Dave about time. The only one trying to manipulate people is you and YOU'RE conspiracy theories Dave they are getting old, I would hope to see you at the agm in Sept to voice all your theories and concerns, a retired veteran like you has nothing but time right? Or is it all keyboard complaining? The folks at the ata office have a lot to do for short periods during the season but overall they are anything but overloaded.
Last edited by catnthehat; 09-04-2016 at 08:39 PM.
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09-01-2016, 02:19 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: North Eastern Alberta
Posts: 891
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Her name is Linda. Anne Coles is the president.
Spruce
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09-01-2016, 05:30 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 104
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Holy smokes there is some juvenile ignorance I see on display for the public to view.. Shame on you!
How old are you? 12!?!!
smarten up, and be a little more productive to our trapping community! This infighting is unbecoming and is what will be our end!
Reading your posts for days, I've bitten my tongue, your attitude on here is APPALLING!
Now that's enough of that!
Other people's memory, and or finances and business are not of your concern! NOT EVER!
Jon
Last edited by Seige; 09-01-2016 at 05:47 PM.
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09-01-2016, 08:03 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 16
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Jon
Totally understood
That is one of the frustrations we seem to face in Ab. It has been going on for years. Not sure how this happens but it may be from the seeming success that individuals have at their chosen professions . They then tend to think that they are also gifted at their HOBBY. Quite often they are not but they seem to become quite vocal. porkfat? martin?,gordon saunders?, what ever name he goes by is a great example . Oil money finances a huge belief that he actually knows something. Guys like him just create strife among the rest . The only way to eliminate this is to create a system where $$$ does not make you king. Tough job but hope to see it happen in my life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seige
Holy smokes there is some juvenile ignorance I see on display for the public to view.. Shame on you!
How old are you? 12!?!!
smarten up, and be a little more productive to our trapping community! This infighting is unbecoming and is what will be our end!
Reading your posts for days, I've bitten my tongue, your attitude on here is APPALLING!
Now that's enough of that!
Other people's memory, and or finances and business are not of your concern! NOT EVER!
Jon
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09-02-2016, 12:29 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Copperhead Road, Morinville
Posts: 19,289
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Come on, really? Why is it important for you to state that trapping is only a hobby? For many of us it is an occupation just like any other and we depend on the revenue that it generates, not to mention the value of managing a healthy wildlife population. I have summer jobs (self employed) and my winter job is trapping. That income puts food on our table. It's hardly a hobby.
Please tell me that you're not back already.
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09-02-2016, 01:00 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Copperhead Road, Morinville
Posts: 19,289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Spruce
Her name is Linda. Anne Coles is the president.
Spruce
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Thanks. I was torn between Linda and Ann. I couldn't remember her name but I know that if you want to buy her a drink out of appreciation her preference is sugar free root beer. I guess that remembering what type of pop that she drank was more important to me than what her name was.
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09-02-2016, 04:54 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North of the Kakwa
Posts: 3,967
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harley74
Jon
Totally understood
That is one of the frustrations we seem to face in Ab. It has been going on for years. Not sure how this happens but it may be from the seeming success that individuals have at their chosen professions . They then tend to think that they are also gifted at their HOBBY. Quite often they are not but they seem to become quite vocal. porkfat? martin?,gordon saunders?, what ever name he goes by is a great example . Oil money finances a huge belief that he actually knows something. Guys like him just create strife among the rest . The only way to eliminate this is to create a system where $$$ does not make you king. Tough job but hope to see it happen in my life.
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Right......
I see a banned user under your title in the near future!!!
Jealousy will not get you anywhere in this world.
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09-02-2016, 07:20 AM
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 5,412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Torkdiesel
Right......
I see a banned user under your title in the near future!!!
Jealousy will not get you anywhere in this world.
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Yes I recognize yet another resurrection.
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