'It is clear that Canada's excessive firearms control system has failed again.'- Canada's National Firearms Association

[marxman]

Originally Posted by shep dog

Wow, the NFA has absolutely no clue.

“It is clear that Canada's excessive firearms control system has failed again,” the NFA statement said.

Really? Is that what the NFA would have the average Canadian, non-gun owning citizen believe? Canadian guns laws are too excessive? And the control system's "failure" led to the deaths of three mounties? Really?

Well done, NFA.

well said.

[1Heavyhitr]

Give your heads a ! The NFA opened their statement with condolences. I have no problem with the NFA's timing. It was perfect. As firearms owners our backs are up against the wall - WE'RE GOING TO TAKE ANOTHER BEATING - and when your backs up against the wall only thing you can do is come out swinging and try to make some space for yourself. It's better to be proactive and frame the battle/debate, rather than sit back and have to respond on the defensive. You then keep control of where you want to go. The media were all over the gun issue with the breaking news of the shootings. The NFA just confirmed their position that gun control Will not prevent these types of tragedies from happening. People bitch that the NFA isn't proactive enough and now that they are proactive people bitch that they're too quick to respond? Give me a break.

[skidderman]

I don't recall these crazy things when I was growing up. And I had play guns on me lots, so did most others. We watched John Wayne & it didn't cause any of us to go on a shooting spree. What has changed? The guns were there then and are now.

[qwert]

I am disappointed that the OP chose to quote the CBC report rather than the actual press release from the NFA.
https://nfa.ca/news/canadas-national...se-june-5-2014
I do not know if the subsequent commentators searched out and read the actual NFA press release or are commenting on the CBC filtered report of the actual statement.

IMHO we should all have our facts straight before forming conclusions based on any media misinformation or filtered report.

Originally Posted by Groundhogger

If the NFA was approached for a comment (and I got the sense they hadn't yet)

While it seems this is a comment based on the CBC report and not on the actual NFA release,
https://nfa.ca/news/canadas-national...se-june-5-2014
I agree that timing is critical in these matters and that the NFA should have confined their comment as GH suggests.

Originally Posted by Groundhogger

it (NFA) should have responded that
it's wrong to have that sort of discussion at this time.
Media focus should be on tracking-down the perpetrator, and
our thoughts are with the families, friends, and colleagues of the fallen officers.

The "best defense is a good offense" idea doesn't apply when the situation is still unfolding. Maybe not at all where there is a loss of life. Regardless, the comment's timing struck me as being VERY "off".

Now is the time for us all to unite in our shared sorrow and outrage at this senseless act, and not to use it for political advantage, The gun ban crowd will be excused as speaking from grief and emotion, but from us it will be perceived as improper and disrespectful.

There will be plenty of time for debate when our emotions have recovered and logical discussion is possible.

[marxman]

nobody is going to look for the nfa press release they are going to see what cbc wants to report about it on the news. nfa "frames the debate" way to go nfa

[Unregistered user]

I agree with the -NFA, the subject will come up so why not fire the first shot? For the bedwtters here, don't get sucked into a blame the tool argument, Calgary is still reeling from a horrific mass-stabbing and we still don't know what brand of knlfe the murderer used.

[rugatika]

Good on the nfa. I agree with them completely. Not sure why it's OK for gun control advocates to jump on gun owners right out of the gate, but we have to sit down, shut up and take our lumps.

It's been proven time and time again. Prohibition does NOT work.

The reason so many non-gun owners think more restrictions are needed every time something like this occurs is because that is the only message they hear. Over and over and over and over again. They need to begin to hear over and over and over again, that it is not about the guns, it's about the people and spending money trying to prohibit something is a waste of money and effort that could be better utilized elsewhere in preventing these tragedies.

[1Heavyhitr]

Originally Posted by rugatika

Good on the nfa. I agree with them completely. Not sure why it's OK for gun control advocates to jump on gun owners right out of the gate, but we have to sit down, shut up and take our lumps.

It's been proven time and time again. Prohibition does NOT work.

The reason so many non-gun owners think more restrictions are needed every time something like this occurs is because that is the only message they hear. Over and over and over and over again. They need to begin to hear over and over and over again, that it is not about the guns, it's about the people and spending money trying to prohibit something is a waste of money and effort that could be better utilized elsewhere in preventing these tragedies.

Exactly

[MagnumMachine]

The media is quick to sensationalize as that is what sells. I doubt any of the "journalists" would ask for comment from any Pro gun source, but I think Windy's phone was a ringin right away looking for blather.

Timing is always 1 of those things that is hard to decide. When confronted with a fight a person always has to decide, do we fight back while strong and fresh or be sporting and wait until we have had several licks taken and try to recover the lost ground?

I think it is important to publicize the facts, that even IF the registry were still in force, this still could have occurred.

My question is when does the public and media start to blame the likes of Stallone, Swartznegger, Marky Mark and all the other hypocritical actors who make a TON of money making movies about killing everything. Clearly this psycho dressing up like Rambo and shooting up Moncton was influenced by the Rambo films.
Losers like this present killer obviously hero worship these actors, so why are they not blamed? Or banned?, Or controlled?

[greylynx]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Gun control groups agree with the NFA that our current system doesn't work. They just have different views of how to fix it.

Isn't it interesting and ironic that some dude that seemed so passionate about gun rights may do as much or more damage to the cause as anyone else in Canadian history short of Marc Lepine. Thanks idiot.

Name a group Oki.

[greylynx]

I think the ban gun people on this forum have made it quite evident who they are.

Just look at some of the above posts.

Baa Baa Baaa.

[guywiththemule]

Originally Posted by greylynx

I think the ban gun people on this forum have made it quite evident who they are.

Just look at some of the above posts.

Baa Baa Baaa.

Very good post Mr Grey. Thankyou

[hillbillyreefer]

Originally Posted by greylynx

Name a group Oki.

I think you misunderstood. We say that even as restrictive as our laws are they failed. The anti gunners say the laws aren't restrictive enough that's why they failed. Two opposing view points of the same failure.

[Twisted Canuck]

It is the bald faced hypocrisy of the grief industry that makes me irate, and I'm fine with the NFA releasing this statement. If the media applied the same language and semantics to this event as to the recent mass stabbing in Calgary that led to the deaths of 5 students, they would be calling the Moncton shootings a mental health issue. The same as the decapitation in the Greyhound Bus by Lee. Mental Health. That's the issue. But, those with an agenda are going to make it a 'gun issue', and press hard for further restrictions....hypocrisy.

[Ruger1022]

Originally Posted by qwert

I am disappointed that the OP chose to quote the CBC report rather than the actual press release from the NFA.
https://nfa.ca/news/canadas-national...se-june-5-2014

Originally Posted by marxman

nobody is going to look for the nfa press release they are going to see what cbc wants to report about it on the news. nfa "frames the debate" way to go nfa

This..↑↑

I posted the CBC view because this is the veiw precieved by most people reading the interweb, not from the NFA website. Why sugar coat it for the AOF crowd?

[qwert]

Originally Posted by Ruger1022

This..↑↑

I posted the CBC view because this is the veiw precieved by most people reading the interweb, not from the NFA website. Why sugar coat it for the AOF crowd?

There are very good reasons why hearsay is non-admissible in court, and should be avoided in general usage whenever possible and clearly identified when it is used. You did properly cite your source, but it was not until I went to the NFA release and compared it with your cited report that I realized how misleading the report really was.

Mark Twain said "People who do not read the newspaper are uninformed, those who do are misinformed."

[Ruger1022]

Originally Posted by qwert

There are very good reasons why hearsay is non-admissible in court, and should be avoided in general usage whenever possible and clearly identified when it is used. You did properly cite your source, but it was not until I went to the NFA release and compared it with your cited report that I realized how misleading the report really was.

Mark Twain said "People who do not read the newspaper are uninformed, those who do are misinformed."

Yea well welcome to today's real world I guess, especially the world of the anti gun hearsay world!!

[qwert]

For those interested in the CBC report of response to the NFA statement, includes explanation from Sheldon Clare.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/moncto...ture-1.2667704

From that report
While the NFA felt the need to speak out, some gun control advocates felt that the timing was indeed premature. When CBC contacted the Coalition for Gun Control, the organization responded with an email saying, "The Coalition feels it's too early to have this discussion. We will not participate at this point."

Blake Brown, author of the book Arming and Disarming: A History of Gun Control in Canada, said he was "surprised" by the quickness of the NFA's reaction.

'The NFA very quickly got out of the gate with a very radical message.'- Blake Brown, gun control expert

"It did strike me as different from the recent approach taken by the NRA in the United States, which after Sandy Hook went quiet for a while until it could figure out what's going on, what its stance should be," Brown says.


The CfGC did not post a release on their website but did post a link to another site serving as their proxy.
http://www.pressprogress.ca/en/post/...oncton-manhunt
By doing this the CfGC are able to claim they are not seeking to take advantage of a current tragedy.

[nof60]

Originally Posted by Ruger1022

This..↑↑

I posted the CBC view because this is the veiw precieved by most people reading the interweb, not from the NFA website. Why sugar coat it for the AOF crowd?

You posted the CBC view because like the majority of Canada's gutless gun owners you don't put your money where your mouth is and support the gun lobby but will cry rivers when they come for yours

[qwert]

Originally Posted by nof60

You posted the CBC view because like the majority of Canada's gutless gun owners you don't put your money where your mouth is and support the gun lobby but will cry rivers when they come for yours

With respect,
A huge part of our problem is we spend too much effort attacking each other, rather than finding common ground which unites us.

[nof60]

Originally Posted by qwert

With respect,
A huge part of our problem is we spend too much effort attacking each other, rather than finding common ground which unites us.

And that common ground is found in the 2 major lobby groups (which should be one) I shoot LR you shoot red rifles he shoots pistols she shoots trap...who cares??? The antis want them all gone and in the meantime the Fudds are more than happy to quote CBC rather than bucking up for the common cause. The Fudds actually help the other side.

Gun crime is not a gun problem...it is a mental health and social problem. Until we get that message out we are sunk. And the only way to get that message out is a common lobby.

Instaed of spending money on registries and cfos and all the other waste why is the nation not putting the money into the only thing that can prevent these tragedies and that is mental health. And why are we not spending money on a united front?

But ruger can prove me wrong and post a pic of his NFA dues card.

[TehZow]

While doing some reading today about the incident in Moncton, I came across an article in the Huffington Post that has an interesting bit of information in it.

While it’s unclear where Bourque acquired his guns, Global News describes them as an M-14 semi-automatic rifle (or possibly a similar M305), and a Mossberg 500 SPX six-shot pump-action shotgun. An M-14 rifle is approximately 45 inches in length and weighs about nine lbs. The shotgun is described as about 39 inches and six lbs.

According to a redacted copy of the long gun registry acquired by Global News, there are 10 M-14 rifles registered in the Moncton area, and only one Mossberg 500 shotgun.

How did Global get this information when it should no longer exist?

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/06...n_5454901.html

Sorry if this has been posted here already but I did not see it, so I thought I would put it up here.

[nof60]

Originally Posted by TehZow

While doing some reading today about the incident in Moncton, I came across an article in the Huffington Post that has an interesting bit of information in it.



How did Global get this information when it should no longer exist?

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/06...n_5454901.html

Sorry if this has been posted here already but I did not see it, so I thought I would put it up here.

did you post this on cgn? if not you should.

[Ruger1022]

Originally Posted by nof60

You posted the CBC view because like the majority of Canada's gutless gun owners you don't put your money where your mouth is and support the gun lobby but will cry rivers when they come for yours

I don't have any guns...
lol
were you expecting a emotional response?.

I found a new profile pic for you nof

[Ruger1022]

Originally Posted by nof60

But ruger can prove me wrong and post a pic of his NFA dues card.

I need to prove nothing to you sir... see last post.

[qwert]

Originally Posted by Ruger1022

I need to prove nothing to you sir... see last post.

I support your freedom of opinion and your right of association.

There is no requirement for a gun owner to join NFA or any other lobby group, similarly, there is no requirement to own a gun in order to join the NFA.

Citizen ownership of firearms is a basic tenant of democracy, and also benefits those who choose not to. This benefit is not absolute, and is also a great responsibility for those who do.

"That rifle hanging on the wall of the working-class flat or labourer's cottage is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there." George Orwell

[nelsonob1]

Originally Posted by TehZow

While doing some reading today about the incident in Moncton, I came across an article in the Huffington Post that has an interesting bit of information in it.



How did Global get this information when it should no longer exist?

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/06...n_5454901.html

Sorry if this has been posted here already but I did not see it, so I thought I would put it up here.

I doubt the accuracy of the information. There's got to be more than one Mossberg 500 in Moncton.

[topher32]

Originally Posted by nelsonob1

I doubt the accuracy of the information. There's got to be more than one Mossberg 500 in Moncton.

Maybe per street? Isn't a Mossberg 500,everyone's first gun?

[nof60]

[QUOTE=Ruger1022;2457233]I don't have any guns

were you expecting a emotional response?.

QUOTE]

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showt...highlight=1022

You sir are a liar

I was expecting an intelligent response. And I am still left wanting.

[Ruger1022]

[QUOTE=nof60;2457275]

Originally Posted by Ruger1022

I don't have any guns

were you expecting a emotional response?.

QUOTE]

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showt...highlight=1022

You sir are a liar

I was expecting an intelligent response. And I am still left wanting.

That was from 2010, 4 years ago.

Any rifle associated with my name on the LGR now have proud new owners.
lol
If you want an emotional response from me you will have to try harder than questioning my intelligents and name calling...


Maybe it time to go outside and play nof