Anyone on here doing the Ketogenic diet? Its hunter friendly

[Positrac]

So a few guys I work with are on what they call the Keto diet. I see them mixing packets in with water and drinking quite a few of them a day. From what I see they don’t eat before mid-morning either. Is this the same diet or something different that just gets a person into the ketosis state?

Kind of reminds me of the Atkins diet I did 10-12 years ago. I sure shed the weight but man my breath was bad...

[hayseed]

A spin off it I think, but same kinda thing...

[Jeron Kahyar]

Originally Posted by Johnny Huntnfish

Do you ever use the exogenous ketones that you can mix into a drink? Apparently Rogan is using a few

Wow that sounds dangerous! I would highly recommend consulting a medical professional before doing that.

Ketosis can be deadly if you are producing Keytone Bodies faster than your cells can break them down in the TCA cycle. Adding more Acetyl CoA in the form of keytone Bodies may cause this issue (Acidosis). You are already forcing yourself to produce Keytone Bodies at a much higher rate as your liver is starving and using the Oxaloacetic Acid to produce Glucose for itself. Leaving the Acetyl CoA from the breakdown of fatty acids to be converted to Keytone Bodies that can be (must be) transported in the blood.

I'm not here to tell you this diet is good or bad. Just be safe and be health.

[SLH]

Diabetic ketoacidosis is a danger but dietary ketosis is not. Im not sure when exogenis ketones are useful.

Reading this thread I think there is a lot of confusion between a high fat, low carb diet (keto) and a high protein low carb diet ( like atkins).

Sugar and refined carbs are the enemy! Keto diets and fasting are real beneficial actions.

[1899b]

Originally Posted by Buckhead

I can agree with that. Perhaps some people are just taking it to the extreme.
I have eaten mostly high protein foods and fats most of my life. I can't remember the last time I had sugar (probably 25 years ago). My bodyweight will fluctuate 10-15 lbs up or down over the course of a year and always has.
If I want to trim down a bit I will reduce my carb intake to where I am only having them at breakfast - none after lunch.
As I age I have to watch what I eat or drink - especially in the evening. I just don't believe in a harsh change in diet. Any change must be gradual to allow your body to adapt to the new regimen.

Absolutely. As we age our metabolisms start to slow down. It’s also common thatvas we age most, not all people become less active. People are doing themselves no favours by becoming less active as they age. The body was made to move not be stagnant.

[58thecat]

Originally Posted by omega50

What doesn't make sense to you?
100 lbs down in 4 months

You try that and tell me how you fare

Ahhhh not healthy weight loss....

[58thecat]

Originally Posted by 1899b

Absolutely. As we age our metabolisms start to slow down. It’s also common thatvas we age most, not all people become less active. People are doing themselves no favours by becoming less active as they age. The body was made to move not be stagnant.

Very true, stay active,eat,drink sensible and rest well....not complicated at all.

[Tarmac]

Havent done Keto but am on day 47 of “Insanity” lost 12lbs that I didn’t know I had to lose. Feeling lighter, tighter and stronger than I have since high school. Cut out alcohol and can’t believe how much better I sleep! Makes long days carrying a pack full of fresh game a breeze!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sdeviation]

Just to add
I have also stopped taking my heart burn meds,,,who woulda thought it was the cards.... the doctors didnt,," stop the fat",...stop the booze"," stop the coffee"

[1899b]

Originally Posted by sdeviation

Just to add
I have also stopped taking my heart burn meds,,,who woulda thought it was the cards.... the doctors didnt,," stop the fat",...stop the booze"," stop the coffee"

Carbs do no favours for anyone. With that said though, for hardcore weight training and when i am in a bulking phase and i need to replenish glycogen stores fast so i recuperate faster i do introduce carbs and start carb cycling.

Your situation is an example of how carbs can lead to various ailments for some. Instead of turning to medicines or prescriptions its much better to tweak your diet just as you have.

[getatmewolf]

Best thing I have ever done was read The Primal Blueprint by Mark Sisson. I lost 50 pounds in 6 months and they have stayed off. Its been two years and no more seasonal allergies, no more heartburn, almost never sick(like one day a year) and muscle/joint pain are minimal rather than always nagging. Always having energy and never "starving" for my next meal. The thing that needs to be said is not everyone is the same, some people can thrive with starchy tubers and some with a little rice and some feel best with zero carbs. My version of paleo has me borderline Keto at all times and easily pop into a ketogenic state in about three days depending on physical activity, diet and fasting. (24 hour fasting is super easy and feels great at this point)

Get rid of the sugar and simple grains, and do a little reading before you judge others success's because it really is that simple.

[1899b]

Originally Posted by getatmewolf

Best thing I have ever done was read The Primal Blueprint by Mark Sisson. I lost 50 pounds in 6 months and they have stayed off. Its been two years and no more seasonal allergies, no more heartburn, almost never sick(like one day a year) and muscle/joint pain are minimal rather than always nagging. Always having energy and never "starving" for my next meal. The thing that needs to be said is not everyone is the same, some people can thrive with starchy tubers and some with a little rice and some feel best with zero carbs. My version of paleo has me borderline Keto at all times and easily pop into a ketogenic state in about three days depending on physical activity, diet and fasting. (24 hour fasting is super easy and feels great at this point)

Get rid of the sugar and simple grains, and do a little reading before you judge others success's because it really is that simple.

Great post!👍

[Brbpuppy]

The only thing that I don't like about Keto, is the restriction on fruit. I just started on a keto diet, but I love fruit, sucks to cut it out.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by 1899b

What do you contribute the loss of muscle to? I have been a gym rat and have been picking up and putting down heavy things for 20 plus years. Im curious why you would end up in a catabolic or muscle wasting state. That doesnt make sense...

My understanding is that ketosis is a condition that hunter gatherers experienced more often than we do but it may not be desirable to be in ketosis forever and ever. Not all of us do well limiting carbs too low too often. The body can make sugar or glucose out of protein but often the body takes the protein required from muscle mass. That process is called Gluconeogenesis.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by 1899b

People eating the Ketogenic way refer to it as a WOE "way of eating" Its not considered a diet.

Alot of people have found success doing the keto way but throwing in carb cycling on the weekends.

At one time the word diet used to mean away of eating and now it is taken on a negative tone and often means an unhealthy fad done to loose weight. The first goal of as diet should be to become more healthy and often that means loosing fat and loosing fat does not always mean loosing weight. Sometimes the best way to loose fat is to increase lean body mass.

For me I sort of do a paleo thing and for short periods I do keto and sometimes even fast. I find that fasting is well tolerated after a short time on keto.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by 1899b

Its the sugars that really hurt folks. People do not understand or really know how much sugar they consume until they start paying attention or counting their macros. Veggies high on the glycemic index are killers as well...

Yep! I read one and I believe that two slices of whole wheat bread will raise the blood glucose level as high or higher than two tablespoons of table sugar.

Blood glucose too high is toxic and dangerous. We do not die because the pancreas produces insulin in response to high blood glucose and removes it from the blood. The problem is that insulin does this by converting it to fat which it stores for later use. The problem is that we often never use the stored fat and repeat the too much sugar thing and while the pancreas is still combating glucose with insulin no fat is being burned.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by Buckhead

Whatever people are calling it - it sounds like some are doing permanent damage to their own bodies by taking it a little too fast or far.

Moderation in all things is usually a key to success.

In my not so humble opinion, for most of us moderation is not good. Eating bad calories even in moderation is not healthy. eg. Lays potato chips. I bet you can't have just one

A moderate amount of sugar leads to an insulin response and insulin works by over kill and the next thing the blood glucose is too low and we need to eat or crash.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by sdeviation

Just to add
I have also stopped taking my heart burn meds,,,who woulda thought it was the cards.... the doctors didnt,," stop the fat",...stop the booze"," stop the coffee"

Stop coffee

Lets not get carried away here

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by getatmewolf

Best thing I have ever done was read The Primal Blueprint by Mark Sisson. I lost 50 pounds in 6 months and they have stayed off. Its been two years and no more seasonal allergies, no more heartburn, almost never sick(like one day a year) and muscle/joint pain are minimal rather than always nagging. Always having energy and never "starving" for my next meal. The thing that needs to be said is not everyone is the same, some people can thrive with starchy tubers and some with a little rice and some feel best with zero carbs. My version of paleo has me borderline Keto at all times and easily pop into a ketogenic state in about three days depending on physical activity, diet and fasting. (24 hour fasting is super easy and feels great at this point)

Get rid of the sugar and simple grains, and do a little reading before you judge others success's because it really is that simple.

^^^^^^^
This is sort of what I do.
After a bit of a health scare I went to the Zone Diet because I did well on it in the past. After a bit of research I went to a modern day paleo diet and then picked up on the word ketogenic in my reading. For the most part I do not eat wheat or any grain products and potatoes are few and far between. I really try to avoid much fruit and starchy vegetables. I am no longer afraid of fat and usually add some form to every meal. I do very moderate exercise, mostly walking and I try to avoid excessive cardio. I lift the odd weight from time to time. I am down about 60 pounds from my heaviest. In spite of the amount of fat in my diet my blood work is great. I do not think I have overcome all of the abuse I have put my body through in the past but I am able to manage my body pain without drugs and my blood pressure is lower than average. I do not think my diet will get me out of a hip replacement, but for now I am putting it off and able to walk every day.

If I would have know I was going to live this long I would have taken better care of myself. I wish I would have know about the damage that excessive sugar causes at lto earlier.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by Brbpuppy

The only thing that I don't like about Keto, is the restriction on fruit. I just started on a keto diet, but I love fruit, sucks to cut it out.

Sugar is sugar if it comes in white granules, Hershey chocolate or fruit. I try to limit to one serving a day.

Every once in a while when we are out for dinner and I am offered desert I usually go with the flow and have some. I used to feel guilty, but now I know that one well planned meal will put me back in the game.

[silverdoctor]

Tried this a couple of years ago, made me realize how addicted I am to wheat products. Couldn't do it, bread is a downfall.

[artie]

Just read the OBESITY CODE BY JASON FUNG. I had a friend lose 50 pounds on this diet. He claims we put on pounds because of sugar putting our insulin levels out of wack. If we keep out insulin levels down we will lose weight. One way of reducing your insulin levels is to fast. Fasting will reset your insulin levels but I have not had much success at fasting.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by artie

Just read the OBESITY CODE BY JASON FUNG. I had a friend lose 50 pounds on this diet. He claims we put on pounds because of sugar putting our insulin levels out of wack. If we keep out insulin levels down we will lose weight. One way of reducing your insulin levels is to fast. Fasting will reset your insulin levels but I have not had much success at fasting.

I found I enjoy eating too much to want to fast and when I did try all it amounted to was a time where I was obsessed with food.

Now that I am not relying on carbs as much, I find short fasts much easier. If I eat a quality evening meal I find that I am not hungry and I do not need breakfast and can I can often go past noon before I break my fast.

When I used to eat toast and jam and/or cereal and juice in the morning I very seldom lasted til mid morning before I was obsessed with having something to eat and often felt a need to eat just to stay focused.

I found myself eating different foods for breakfast (left overs from supper) was often convenient and eating keto style dinner sometimes involved what was tradition breakfast foods (bacon and eggs or an omelette) seemed to make me feel very good.

Bread still calls to me from time to time but it is easily dismissed from my mind, but if I give in it calls me again almost immediately. I think breads natural addictive quality is what makes it a big food industry best seller.

[The Elkster]

IMO the main thing to come from things like Keto is the idea that we can eat meat and fat and still lose weight. I'm not on Keto but I have started watching my eating and exercising. I have been eating most of my regular foods including homemade burgers and steak plus lots of other meat and eggs but I started to count calories and control portions and have lost 15lbs in two months. I put a limit on high energy density foods like sugar drinks (NO pop), desserts (very small portion and mostly get sugar fix through fruit) and limit snackfood/chips. Still have bread but not as much and I've also cut out pasta fillers as much as I can and replaced with things like spaghetti squash. I mean look at spaghetti as a dish. Where is the real flavor? the sauce or the pasta? Cut out the pasta and you cut over 50% of the calories and keep +90% of the flavor. I also cut down on the amount of rice and potato as its really just a pretty tasteless filler food. Ya got X amount of calorie allotment per day. Use them wisely.

If a diet is so restrictive it can't be reasonably maintained then it isn't much good in the long run. Eat smart, eat balanced and earn yourself some calorie room or extra weight loss through exercise. I'm sure there are quicker ways to lose weight but I am comfortable knowing my method is very sustainable.

[slopeshunter]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

I found I enjoy eating too much to want to fast and when I did try all it amounted to was a time where I was obsessed with food.

Now that I am not relying on carbs as much, I find short fasts much easier. If I eat a quality evening meal I find that I am not hungry and I do not need breakfast and can I can often go past noon before I break my fast.

When I used to eat toast and jam and/or cereal and juice in the morning I very seldom lasted til mid morning before I was obsessed with having something to eat and often felt a need to eat just to stay focused.

I found myself eating different foods for breakfast (left overs from supper) was often convenient and eating keto style dinner sometimes involved what was tradition breakfast foods (bacon and eggs or an omelette) seemed to make me feel very good.

Bread still calls to me from time to time but it is easily dismissed from my mind, but if I give in it calls me again almost immediately. I think breads natural addictive quality is what makes it a big food industry best seller.

Hey Covey, curious what you eat in a day (for example). Thanks

[sharpstick]

A couple weeks ago I started the Keto diet, the first week I was doing good as far as being strict. I was losing almost a pound a day. (5 pounds in first week).
But it is so hard to stay on when the rest of the family is eating carbs etc. You almost have to make 2 meals and the wife isn't about to start making different meals. This week was 2 of my kids birthdays and I fell off the Keto wagon. Ive had carbs, dessert and chips... Now to start over again...
Breads, pastas, starchy veggies and fruits are hard to stay away from. Sugary drinks/candies are no problem as I rarely ever had those but chips are my weakness when it comes to snacks/cheating...
I do need to start exercising more as well. I'm only looking to drop 15 ish pounds so it shouldn't be too hard... but I like food...

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by slopeshunter

Hey Covey, curious what you eat in a day (for example). Thanks

For starters in my home I only eat food that I like. I don't eat anything no matter how healthy if I do not like it. When I am a guest, I usually pass on the bread but for the most part to be polite I eat what is served to me.

For the first meal of the day I have either bacon and eggs or left over meat and veggies from yesterdays supper. When I am in a hurry and I try not to be, my wife makes me a shake or smoothie made from protein powder and blubeberry and strawberry. I use a bit of kefir and water for the liquid. I try not to do the shake often because I think solid food works better.

For lunch, if I feel like eating it is often meat and salad. Leftover chicken or whatever meat I have on hand. I eat canned salmon and sardines when my wife is not around. If I have not had bacon and eggs for my first meal I often have b and e at lunch.

Supper? For a good portion of the year I cook my meat on my bbq or in my smoker. Steak, beef or pork roast or salmon. Whatever I feel in the mood for. I usually eat my most carbs at this meal. Usually a pile of low glycemic veggies or my wife sometimes oven bakes lightly oiled veggies in the oven. Coconut oil or melted butter is my favorite. When I cook inside it is in the oven or fry pan. Meat is cooked in coconut oil, butter, bacon fat or lard. I cook all my own meat because my wife is a vegetarian.

If I feel the need to snack it is often a small chunk of meat and a small portion of fruit. I sometimes eat hard cheese but I make an effort to reduce dairy because it not always agrees with me. Sometimes I have a small handful of raw nuts like almonds or walnuts or hazel nuts. I usually have to limit the nuts because for me it is easy to over eat.

I eat my game meat mostly in the winter when cooking outside is not an option. I do best with game meat on the stove top or in my slow cooker.

Maybe the above seems a bit boring but it works for me. My advice to anyone interested in this type of eating is to get some reading material on keto or paleo and build your menu from foods you like. We are not all the same and we do not all like the same foods or thrive on the same foods.

The food industry has made sure that there is lots of cheap filling foods available to us. Most of the available food will prevent us from starving but not all will allow us to thrive.

I can eat anything I want, but I am starting to understand that all of my choices have consequences.

Nutritionists will always tell you to read food labels. For me I have found what is best for me is whole food that is not processed and does not need a label.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by sharpstick

A couple weeks ago I started the Keto diet, the first week I was doing good as far as being strict. I was losing almost a pound a day. (5 pounds in first week).
But it is so hard to stay on when the rest of the family is eating carbs etc. You almost have to make 2 meals and the wife isn't about to start making different meals. This week was 2 of my kids birthdays and I fell off the Keto wagon. Ive had carbs, dessert and chips... Now to start over again...
Breads, pastas, starchy veggies and fruits are hard to stay away from. Sugary drinks/candies are no problem as I rarely ever had those but chips are my weakness when it comes to snacks/cheating...
I do need to start exercising more as well. I'm only looking to drop 15 ish pounds so it shouldn't be too hard... but I like food...

For sure it is difficult to follow any diet when everyone in the house is not on board. The people who write the books advise to remove all non paleo or keto foods. I can not do that because my wife likes a whole bunch of stuff that would not be on my diet. If I fall off the wagon it is difficult to not throw in the towel and grab the nearest bag of Lays and smother my disappointment. Falling off the wagon is not the end of the world but not get up might be. Get up, start over and forgive yourself. You are still better off for starting and it is not forever to get back on track.

Some authors on the topic of keto and paleo suggest a 30 day trial to see if the diet actually works for you.

[slopeshunter]

Thanks for the details covey.

[sharpstick]

Thanks for the input Covey, much appreciated.
I guess I shouldn't look at falling off the wagon as a failure, just maybe a stall...
Can you recommend a good book or 2 to read about the Keto diet. I'm sure there are hundreds out there but would like to get one that guys have read and think added value.
Thank you.
SS