Severance package.

[sewerrat]

Well I got let go from my job this week, my employer gave me a severance package, I have until 4 pm Friday to hand in the signed document if I want to accept it.
I have contacted a lawyer and will be seeing him tomorrow.

I was told never sign and accept the first offer.
For those of you that dealt with this what have you done?

[Stinky Buffalo]

I've gone through this twice in the past five years due to downsizing and restructuring... I just took what they offered and went my way.

It can be scary. In this economy, that chunk of cash can disappear fast, especially when you have a family to support.

[Trochu]

Isn't severance pretty cut and dried? You've worked for us for this long, your salary is this, so this is the lump sum kinda thing.

[fishnguy]

^ Pretty much, as prescribed by law. Not sure what the lawyer can do unless you are being shorted.

[Twisted Canuck]

That's why you always want to get pictures of the boss doing something totally inappropriate at the staff Christmas party. You'll have a much stronger negotiating position.

[lone wolf]

I have not experienced it personally, however I know several close friends who have. Without exception they recommended seeking professional legal help.

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by Twisted Canuck

That's why you always want to get pictures of the boss doing something totally inappropriate at the staff Christmas party. You'll have a much stronger negotiating position.

Didn't you own your own company???

[Deb]

Lawyer up, and don't cheap out. You need a labor lawyer, someone who'll go to bat for you. Everyone's personal experience is different, and expectations of what severance you should receive is not truly formulaic, but based on many, many factors.

Whatever your former employer is offering you is structured to their benefit, not yours.

They tell you that you have a "deadline," but your lawyer will explain that you have time to negotiate. No one can be expected to make such a life altering decision in a matter of days. It's a pressure tactic to get you to agree to the first number they throw at you.

[Rdamours]

The wife of a friend at work got offered 6 months severance after 22 years. She got 180000 after suing. It seems it was worth the extra effort

[Twisted Canuck]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

Didn't you own your own company???

That's why we never had staff parties.

[Who Da Fisherman]

Originally Posted by Rdamours

The wife of a friend at work got offered 6 months severance after 22 years. She got 180000 after suing. It seems it was worth the extra effort

I am sure there is more to this story.
WDF

[HyperMOA]

Originally Posted by sewerrat

Well I got let go from my job this week, my employer gave me a severance package, I have until 4 pm Friday to hand in the signed document if I want to accept it.
I have contacted a lawyer and will be seeing him tomorrow.

I was told never sign and accept the first offer.
For those of you that dealt with this what have you done?

I know it may seem stressful, but I dream of your situation. Getting paid to walk away and use my skill-set to enhance their competition's viability.

[roper1]

Originally Posted by Deb

Lawyer up, and don't cheap out. You need a labor lawyer, someone who'll go to bat for you. Everyone's personal experience is different, and expectations of what severance you should receive is not truly formulaic, but based on many, many factors.

Whatever your former employer is offering you is structured to their benefit, not yours.

They tell you that you have a "deadline," but your lawyer will explain that you have time to negotiate. No one can be expected to make such a life altering decision in a matter of days. It's a pressure tactic to get you to agree to the first number they throw at you.

Very good advice. As others stated, get a labor lawyer. Depending on length of service, age, health, re-employment, etc, can be up to two years pay. Glad to hear you've sought counsel, just make sure you get a labor specialist. Best of luck!

[Hilgy]

From experience, if you return to work somewhere else before your case is settled, your former employer is entitled to deduct all wages earned from the time you let their employ until the settlement date.

I found this out the hard way. Cost me a substantial amount of money.

[EZM]

Originally Posted by Trochu

Isn't severance pretty cut and dried? You've worked for us for this long, your salary is this, so this is the lump sum kinda thing.

That is referred to statutory severance ...... and is applied for short term, non management and/or key employees. It's kinda like "the bare legal minimum".

If you are an hourly guy, who isn't too old, or hasn't been there a very long time ..... that's where this may apply. Don't expect much and don't expect to have a strong case. That's 95% of the workforce.

If you are in management, senior leadership, executive the severances are much different.

Also

If you have years of service, are older you likely to get far more severance.

In the eyes of the courts, should you pursue legal recourse, and are the 5%, you have a strong case. BUT typically they will settle far before it goes to litigation. In 35 years, and dozens and dozens of cases like this (maybe hundreds), there was maybe 4-5 cases that went to court (or provincial arbitration) - it gets settled long before that.

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by Twisted Canuck

That's why we never had staff parties.

Hahaha! Good stuff!

[CBintheNorth]

Your age, your position with the company, your years of service, your employability, ie- likelihood of finding other employment in your field, all come into play.
In some cases only current Employment Standards Act rules apply, sometimes Common Law can be applied.

I've been through this several times from the other side of the fence. Nothing is necessarily cut and dry unless you were just a number for less than 2 years.

Depending on how you answer the questions in the first paragraph will dictate what will apply, and to what extent.

[CBintheNorth]

Originally Posted by Who Da Fisherman

I am sure there is more to this story.
WDF

Uhhh, ya.
That is definitely not the norm and must involve a tremendously significant background.

[CBintheNorth]

Originally Posted by Twisted Canuck

That's why we never had staff parties.

Amen to that!!!

"Here's a gift card. Take your family to dinner, away from everyone else here."

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by Rdamours

The wife of a friend at work got offered 6 months severance after 22 years. She got 180000 after suing. It seems it was worth the extra effort

I would suggest she probably won a wrongful dismissal suit as opposed to negotiating increased severance.

[Rdamours]

Dismissed for no reason and the lawyer got 1 month for every year of service.

Just as qualified or more do than any replacement so they paid. Salaried not hourly.

[Ronji]

[QUOTE=Rdamours;4731483]Dismissed for no reason and the lawyer got 1 month for every year of service.

Just as qualified or more do than any replacement so they paid. Salaried not hourly.

1 month per year is pretty common.

DO not sign, with out legal advice. They cannot give you a deadline.

I never did sign my papers, 20 years later and they are still unsigned. They had all kinds of terms and conditions they wanted me to agree on.

My lawyer told them to f-off.

They tried on many, many occasions to get me to sign off. Even came by the house.

[NCC]

There are so many variables with a termination that it's difficult to comment on this. Many times the employer will terminate without cause and pay the additional severance rather than make a case for with cause dismissal.

If you severance package is reasonable, I'd be cautious about fighting it. If your employer needs to get a lawyer involved they may be motivated to fight for the minimum severance to set a precedent.

[Groundhogger]

Originally Posted by Deb

Lawyer up, and don't cheap out. You need a labor lawyer, someone who'll go to bat for you. Everyone's personal experience is different, and expectations of what severance you should receive is not truly formulaic, but based on many, many factors.

Whatever your former employer is offering you is structured to their benefit, not yours.

They tell you that you have a "deadline," but your lawyer will explain that you have time to negotiate. No one can be expected to make such a life altering decision in a matter of days. It's a pressure tactic to get you to agree to the first number they throw at you.

^if you want to remember one reply, make it this one.

sorry to hear about the job, lost my job 4-1/2 years ago and I'm 55, first and only time that's ever happened but it was due to the fact the company was folding. 21 years with the company as a manager, entitled to a good package, but to go after it in the position the company was in, the owner would have had to mortgage his house, possibly lose it. My job prospects were good/a modest offer was made if we could defer the payment a bit. All worked-out.

I might suggest you consider the type of lawyer you get, and what their take is. Here in Ontario/close to Toronto, there are constant TV/radio ads from what I call "don't pay a cent event" labor and injury lawyers. "We don't get paid unless you get paid" one ad boasts. Make sure you know what % is if that sort of thing is a factor in AB. Basically, they send some threatening letters to the employer and if that doesn't work, simply drag it out so the employer's legal bills start stacking up. Correct, most cases I've seen settle. Saw "constructive dismissal" cases go that way a handful of times. Literally had videos of the employee doing the very thing that got them fired, 100% in the wrong...yet our legal bills got to over $10K before we folded and paid a sum anyway.

[Hilgy]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

I would suggest she probably won a wrongful dismissal suit as opposed to negotiating increased severance.

Dont be so sure. I was in a very similar position and after settling my package went up significantly.

The big mistake i made was going back to work a couple days after my release.

[Sundancefisher]

Depends upon the job, industry, length of service and age… plus any common law legal precedence versus labour laws.

Labour laws set a minimum legal obligation. Common law courts set the industry and role specific expectations.

So work at McDonald’s for 10 years as a fry cook. Expect 1 weeks severance.

Work in oil and gas at a high level for 24 years and you likely will get 24 months severance.

Lawyer will take a case if you have a wide variance between offer letter and common law.

Other severance negotiations can include when your benefits expire, what you get for retirement benefits, any RRSP plans transfers, and post layoff job search help.

First call to a qualified lawyer is important.

[Deb]

How’d the meeting go? I can tell you that weeks following my “offer” were some of the most stressful and frightening times of my life. I hope it goes easier for you.

[TBark]

Back in late 2021 I got turfed. 11 years with the Co.
My severance was reasonable. Retiree pension / benefits too.

And I was working contract the entire final month they kept me on salary.
As there was no company policy that said I couldn’t and I even cleared it with them.
2 additional months on salary was part of the deal. More-so to find another role within the company.
Needless to say I didn’t look very hard to find another role with them, ha.

TBark

[MoFugger21]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

Depends upon the job, industry, length of service and age… plus any common law legal precedence versus labour laws.

Labour laws set a minimum legal obligation. Common law courts set the industry and role specific expectations.

So work at McDonald’s for 10 years as a fry cook. Expect 1 weeks severance.

Work in oil and gas at a high level for 24 years and you likely will get 24 months severance.

.....

Correct that there are minimums for Alberta when terminated without cause. Incorrect on the notice/severance for 10 years of service. Even at McDonald's, being let go without cause and having 10 years of service would require 8 weeks termination notice or termination pay (pay in lieu of notice).


https://www.alberta.ca/termination-pay

The Province sets the minimum notice/pay in lieu, but companies are free to go above that amount and that may be where a lawyer is required. There may be precedence set for what other companies have paid (if disclosed) for a similar position and you may be able to argue you should receive similar.

[7magtime]

Originally Posted by Deb

Lawyer up, and don't cheap out. You need a labor lawyer, someone who'll go to bat for you. Everyone's personal experience is different, and expectations of what severance you should receive is not truly formulaic, but based on many, many factors.

Whatever your former employer is offering you is structured to their benefit, not yours.

They tell you that you have a "deadline," but your lawyer will explain that you have time to negotiate. No one can be expected to make such a life altering decision in a matter of days. It's a pressure tactic to get you to agree to the first number they throw at you.

^^This^^.

I know a guy who went through this during Covid, he got significantly more than their original "best offer" was.

The company is definitely not looking out for the best interests of the former employee they're letting go IMO, due your due diligence.....