Walking with cocked gun

[antlercarver]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

I would never hunt with someone who has such little faith in their own weapons handling that they are terrified to have one in chamber. Nor would I want a nervous Nellie with me who is quaking with fear because my rifle or shotgun is readied. I feel very fortunate to have a group of hunting buddies that are proficient with their firearms and trustworthy enough that we all can safely move amongst one another without fear of shooting each other in the face.

I hope you have many happy safe hunts with those who hunt with you and that you never have regrets. I been hunting and on trapline for almost 20 years before you were born and have experienced many things. Stay safe.

[fordtruckin]

I generally hunt with a round chambered. When I'm walking out to the truck I'll clear it. While accidents will happen, I DO watch where I step and make sure it will hold my weight before I put my full weight on a foot. I also carry a pistol with a round loaded. I get a kick out of movies where they show a cop pull his side arm, chamber a round and then go. I don't own a pistol with a physical safety.

[calgarychef]

In a stand I'll have one down the pipe although even then I prefer not to have the bolt closed. Like others I consider a gun loaded or not loaded, I'll never rely on a safety while walking. In fact any of my rifles would suit me just as well with no safety as I never use them. I'd never let someone walk behind me with a firearm on safe and come to think of it I don't have any buddies who rely on safeties.

[Headdamage]

For me it depends somewhat on the gun in question, I'll carry my Ruger M77 mk2 with the safety fully on to where it blocks the firing pin with a round in the chamber but I wouldn't do that with a Remington 700 for example.

[Rockman]

I carry with a loaded chamber anytime I'm actively hunting (expect to see an animal at any time). It's not a matter of swing and shoot, as I'm very careful about that, but noise. But while I do keep the safety on, and am practiced at flicking it off as quietly as possible, I don't count on that for safety.

Muzzle control and safe handling are ultimately what I rely on. I wouldn't mind chamber empty if with a good group that felt safer that way, but I would find myself wondering if that might cause them to sometimes miss muzzle control and other safe handling due to relying on their empty chamber. I guess this can go both ways. Ultimately some people rely on never muzzling others, other people rely on an empty chamber. Just different approaches.

[58thecat]

My safety is my finger, I don't chamber a round unless it is go time, immediate action...spot and stalk is different but again I have spotted, chambered the round and now it's go time.....I watch that gator show and man they shoot, chamber a round, safety on and lay it down drives me nuts....not in my boat

Been with some people that as soon as they are out of the vehicle, off the vehicle they chamber a round and put the safety on shoulder the gun, lay it against a tree etc and the next thing I tell them is unload the rifle, gun cuz we are humping up a hill, crashing through the bush etc no need for a potential discharge.....or I go on and hunt by myself....real easy.

[58thecat]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

I absolutely disagree. I always have a round in the chamber and the safety on from the moment I depart my vehicle to the moment I return to it. To each their own but in my opinion doing otherwise has nothing to do with safety and more to do with the user being unsure of themselves and a lack of confidence in their personal weapons handling. I can't imagine sitting while coyote calling and waiting until I have a dog come in on high alert to make the unnecessary movement and noise making that cycling the bolt would create, worse yet if it was a big deer. Chances are you would lose the opportunity.

Jeepers eh....have a safe dark walk out on uneven, slippery ground....one oops and was the safety on, was I in haste to get out and go etc....over confidence will get ya or someone else.....now if your setting up and it's go time....yup round chambered end of go time whether successful or not moving to another area take the road out of the chamber...better to have lost the opportunity then to lose a lifetime of opportunities.

[Norwest Alta]

Are those Elmer Fudd types that have one in the pipe, finger on the trigger and safety on more successful in shooting the animal they’re hunting?

[Groundhogger]

Originally Posted by calgarychef

In a stand I'll have one down the pipe although even then I prefer not to have the bolt closed. Like others I consider a gun loaded or not loaded, I'll never rely on a safety while walking. In fact any of my rifles would suit me just as well with no safety as I never use them. I'd never let someone walk behind me with a firearm on safe and come to think of it I don't have any buddies who rely on safeties.

^this, 110%+++. In the interest of transparency, I don't hunt big game..nor do I ever find myself in a situation where complete silence is required. While I have lost shot opportunities on skittish grouse because of the time it took to chamber a round in a pump gun, I take that in stride. Poor gun handling habits have been a dividing line between me and at least one guy I used to hunt with, but I watch anyone I shoot with to make sure their sensibilities jive with my own. Anyone wishing to trust their lives with a $9 piece of stamped steel~go for it. I'm not one of those people, and I do reject the notion that safe gun handling/muzzle control justifies leaving a round chambered while you ramble around in the bush, on a trail, etc. There is no such thing as a "good" gun accident, and just because you've never had one..it doesn't mean you never will. The first may very well be the last.

In case anyone is curious, the issues I've seen with guys that don't cut it with me..but I've seen countless times;

1. Having a live round in the chamber, safety on (presumably?) and walking behind me, gun in the ready position

2. Having a live round in the chamber, safety on (presumably?) and sling-carrying in front of me

3. Taking a shot while hunting, and not clearing the round. (then walking with a closed bolt)

4. Taking a shot while hunting, clearly making a solid hit, then instinctually...clearing the empty, chambering another (for what?) and engaging the safety. (Or not..I always ask)

Maybe I'm a "stick in the mud"/over-cautious...but I do allot of shooting, and have given lots of instruction to new shooters. I believe there is no room for errors with firearms, and relying on a mechanical safety adds an element of risk that I honestly think is not required. Not judging anyone who feels differently, just throwing in my 2 cents. The guys I like shooting with most are like me~very safety minded, lots of communication about being unloaded/mag out/bolt open, etc. After reading the comments in this thread, I bet some people here would laugh if they overheard the way we do things...but so be it.

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

Have at 'er. Don't need any nervous nellies in my camp.

Better nervous than dead. Libraries full of stories about people shot accidentally by someone carrying a loaded gun where they had no business.

Grizz

[bobtodrick]

Never walk with a cocked gun when others are around.
Think about it...if 'accidents' didn't happen there'd be no traffic fatalities.
I'll bet everyone here thinks they are pretty good drivers...but I'll bet 25% can't say they've never had an at fault claim on their insurance.

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

If one is unsure about their ability to safely carry a loaded firearm maybe they shouldn't be carrying one.

Has nothing to do with ability and everything to do with safety...

[Groundhogger]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

Has nothing to do with ability and everything to do with safety...

^excactly

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

I would never hunt with someone who has such little faith in their own weapons handling that they are terrified to have one in chamber. Nor would I want a nervous Nellie with me who is quaking with fear because my rifle or shotgun is readied. I feel very fortunate to have a group of hunting buddies that are proficient with their firearms and trustworthy enough that we all can safely move amongst one another without fear of shooting each other in the face.

I find the nervous Nellies are the ones walking around with one in the pipe thumb on the safety, then you hear the safety click off as they swing into action when they hear a squirrel hop thru the leaves or a twig snaps. The same ones who claim they got to be ready because "things happen fast" where I hunt.

I've seen many guys who claim they are always in control, know what they are doing, bla bla, they hear something, suddenly swing around, sweep everybody with their muzzle as they click the safety off . I prefer to hunt with folks who are calm, If the rare and odd time having to chamber a round causes them to lose an opportunity it isn't the end of the world. I avoid hunting with wound too tight jumpy people who are afraid of losing an opportunity because they don't have one in the pipe.

[zabbo]

Originally Posted by buckbrush

My self I don't understand this. Lots of guys I have hunted with carry a round in the chamber with the safety on. When I was young I was told that a gun is either loaded or not. I've carried this on and I never use the safety on my gun. I can chamber a round pretty quick and have never regretted not having a round chambered.
I do sometimes load the gun on the tail end of a stalk if I think loading it is going to get me busted but otherwise its unloaded. (no round in the chamber)

I was always taught, "Treat every gun is if it is loaded." When hunting I pretty much always have a round chambered, safety on and muzzle control at all times. Just the way I was taught.

[MK2750]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

I find the nervous Nellies are the ones walking around with one in the pipe thumb on the safety, then you hear the safety click off as they swing into action when they hear a squirrel hop thru the leaves or a twig snaps. The same ones who claim they got to be ready because "things happen fast" where I hunt.

I've seen many guys who claim they are always in control, know what they are doing, bla bla, they hear something, suddenly swing around, sweep everybody with their muzzle as they click the safety off . I prefer to hunt with folks who are calm, If the rare and odd time having to chamber a round causes them to lose an opportunity it isn't the end of the world. I avoid hunting with wound too tight jumpy people who are afraid of losing an opportunity because they don't have one in the pipe.

The people you are describing shouldn't be carrying guns period. I am every bit as uncomfortable with poor firearm control loaded or not.

[brendan's dad]

When I am walking into a specific location to "sit", then usually I will not have a round up the pipe. Once I arrive and get situated, then I will load a round. If I am just walking trails, then the terrain and type of trail dictate. I can be the safest handler of firearms, but a loose rock or unseen hole could result in a fall. Once a fall starts a person can attempt to maintain good muzzle control, and attempt to not disengage the safety, and attempt to not have a branch hit the trigger, but sometime the worst happens. Generally though on a well used cut line or a 5+ foot wide trail I will walk with a round up the pipe if I am solo hunting.

If I am unfortunate enough to be trailing a wounded animal, then I will have a round up the pipe, but i will be carrying in a readied position with control on the pistol grip and fore stock. If I have assistance with tracking, I will be on point with the only readied rifle.

[MK2750]

I think it should be determined if we are out for a hike or hunting. I walk so slow when I am big game hunting, if I fall over I am already dead. Like already mentioned, I hunt alone so no one is at risk.

Bird hunting, the last thing I want is someone fumbling around trying to load a shotgun in a hurry during a flush. I watch those hunting around me and if there is a hint of poor firearm control I call it a day.

You can generally tell who is comfortable and confident carrying a firearm before you get 20 feet from the truck. I would much rather hunt with someone that is competent hunting with one in the pipe than wondering all day if incompetent buddy's gun is loaded or not. If he can't be trusted with a loaded gun, how could you trust that his gun is actually unloaded or not?

The most common excuses I have read when it comes to hunting "accidents" are;

I thought buddy was an animal.

I was shooting at an animal and hit buddy.

I thought the gun was unloaded.

None of these circumstances are going to be prevented by walking with an unloaded gun or rifle.

Accidental discharge is rare and most of those are in circumstances when the firearm should have been unloaded. Entering tree stands, crossing creeks, going over/under fences, slippery/steep side hills, extremely thick brush, loose rocks, etc., etc., I would also bet that accidental discharge is used as an excuse more often than it actually takes place.

[YYC338]

Originally Posted by MK2750

I think it should be determined if we are out for a hike or hunting. I walk so slow when I am big game hunting, if I fall over I am already dead. Like already mentioned, I hunt alone so no one is at risk.

Bird hunting, the last thing I want is someone fumbling around trying to load a shotgun in a hurry during a flush. I watch those hunting around me and if there is a hint of poor firearm control I call it a day.

You can generally tell who is comfortable and confident carrying a firearm before you get 20 feet from the truck. I would much rather hunt with someone that is competent hunting with one in the pipe than wondering all day if incompetent buddy's gun is loaded or not. If he can't be trusted with a loaded gun, how could you trust that his gun is actually unloaded or not?

The most common excuses I have read when it comes to hunting "accidents" are;

I thought buddy was an animal.

I was shooting at an animal and hit buddy.

I thought the gun was unloaded.

None of these circumstances are going to be prevented by walking with an unloaded gun or rifle.

Accidental discharge is rare and most of those are in circumstances when the firearm should have been unloaded. Entering tree stands, crossing creeks, going over/under fences, slippery/steep side hills, extremely thick brush, loose rocks, etc., etc., I would also bet that accidental discharge is used as an excuse more often than it actually takes place.

+1!

[260 Rem]

Sounds like the best of all worlds is to hunt with a firearm featuring an external hammer with half-cock default....

[Groundhogger]

Originally Posted by MK2750

I think it should be determined if we are out for a hike or hunting. I walk so slow when I am big game hunting, if I fall over I am already dead. Like already mentioned, I hunt alone so no one is at risk.

Bird hunting, the last thing I want is someone fumbling around trying to load a shotgun in a hurry during a flush. I watch those hunting around me and if there is a hint of poor firearm control I call it a day.

You can generally tell who is comfortable and confident carrying a firearm before you get 20 feet from the truck. I would much rather hunt with someone that is competent hunting with one in the pipe than wondering all day if incompetent buddy's gun is loaded or not. If he can't be trusted with a loaded gun, how could you trust that his gun is actually unloaded or not?

The most common excuses I have read when it comes to hunting "accidents" are;

I thought buddy was an animal.

I was shooting at an animal and hit buddy.

I thought the gun was unloaded.

None of these circumstances are going to be prevented by walking with an unloaded gun or rifle.

Accidental discharge is rare and most of those are in circumstances when the firearm should have been unloaded. Entering tree stands, crossing creeks, going over/under fences, slippery/steep side hills, extremely thick brush, loose rocks, etc., etc., I would also bet that accidental discharge is used as an excuse more often than it actually takes place.

I agree with all of this, but in reading that particular comment, I'm mindful of how "confident" careless guys usually are. I agree with the spirit of the comment though, especially your first time out with someone. Those can be uncomfortable conversations, but I've had to have them.

[YYC338]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

Sounds like the best of all worlds is to hunt with a firearm featuring an external hammer with half-cock default....

Half cocked is just another form of safety. In some cases it works off a sear and isn't a lot different than some safety's. Marlin's lawyers thought so little of it that as of 1982 or so they have both half cock capability as well as a cross bolt safety installed on their 1895's and others.

Not necessarily any worse than a safety, just not a lot better or different.

Now if you have a Marlin and carry loaded, using both systems can really mess you up.

[gtr]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

Sounds like the best of all worlds is to hunt with a firearm featuring an external hammer with half-cock default....

A BLR is that.

[calgarychef]

The thing about a safety it "can" get caught on a sleeve, glove, branch... And then it's not safe anymore, only thing is no one knows about that little tidbit. If there's no round in the pipe there's never an issue. A quick search on YouTube will show all kinds of folks who "thought it was on safe."

[parfleche]

X2 Calgary! I am far from being a nervous nelly ! LOL I am a cautious nelly! And I have to laugh at the OLD excuse ( I thought the gun wasn't loaded )
I,m sure it was on safety !
Oh I tripped ! I understand all the excuses BUT Had there been NO shell in the chamber , you would never have to discuss an accident!
All you hot shots out there better hope you never have an incident because it doesn't go away anytime quick!
OH How about this one ? You get hit by a train!
excuse : I didn't see it! lol ! So when you cant come up with a good reason , then make a good excuse!

[CNP]

OP could have created a poll, two options, do you or don't you, no comments permitted....................all these comments are just lalalalalalalalalalalalalal....................... .....three pages dohhhhhhhhhhhh.

[MK2750]

What is Killing Canadian Men?

Number of Deaths, Cause of Death, Frequency


39,290 Circulatory system diseases 1 death every 13 min.
30,481 Cancer 1 death every 17 min.
9,411 Respiratory system diseases 1 death every 56 min.
3,774 Digestsive system diseases 1 death every 2 hrs.
2,923 Suicide all causes 1 death every 3 hrs.
2,376 Motor vehicle collisions 1 death every 4 hrs.
2,317 Substance abuse 1 death every 4 hrs.
1,932 Suicide, non-firearm 1 death every 5 hrs.
1,559 Mental Disorders 1 death every 6 hrs.
1,288 HIV 1 death every 7 hrs.
991 Suicide by Firearms 1 death every 9 hrs.
985 Accidental falls 1 death every 9 hrs.
528 Accidental poisoning 1 death every 16.5 hrs.
487 Homicides all causes 1 death every 18 hrs.
309 Homicide, non-firearm 1 death every 28 hrs.
178 Homicide, by firearm 1 death every 2 days
142 Homicide, by cutting/piercing instrument
1 death every 3 days
74 Surgical/medical misadventure 1 death every 5 days
61 Fatal gun accidents 1 death every 6 days

Now hopefully all you folks are not foolish enough to be eating fatty foods, carrying extra weight, smoking, drinking, avoiding annual check ups and cancer screening, driving too fast for road conditions,,,,,you know the kind of stuff that is actually likely to end your life.

[airbornedeerhunter]

Originally Posted by calgarychef

The thing about a safety it "can" get caught on a sleeve, glove, branch... And then it's not safe anymore, only thing is no one knows about that little tidbit. If there's no round in the pipe there's never an issue. A quick search on YouTube will show all kinds of folks who "thought it was on safe."

That's negligence, not a safety issue. If one becomes so oblivious to their weapons state that they simply apply the safety and never check it periodically they are guilty of being negligent.

[YYC338]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

That's negligence, not a safety issue. If one becomes so oblivious to their weapons state that they simply apply the safety and never check it periodically they are guilty of being negligent.

If you're responsible and hunt with the safety on and one in. you're likely repeatedly checking it, either visually or physically. I know I do.

How many, and of them how often do the never loaded crowd check to confirm it's not loaded while hunting.

It was referenced by someone that it's frequently said when there's an accidental shooting, "I thought it was on safety". I would propose that it's equally often, if not more frequently said: "I thought it was empty"

[calgarychef]

Originally Posted by YYC338

If you're responsible and hunt with the safety on and one in. you're likely repeatedly checking it, either visually or physically. I know I do.

How many, and of them how often do the never loaded crowd check to confirm it's not loaded while hunting.

It was referenced by someone that it's frequently said when there's an accidental shooting, "I thought it was on safety". I would propose that it's equally often, if not more frequently said: "I thought it was empty"

I never have to check my safety it occurs to me that if you "constantly check your safety" then you must be concerned that it isn't on safe? What will happen when you think it's safe but it isn't? No bullet in the pipe is as safe as it gets.