Bad Requests for PAL

[Rocky7]

Hi,

I just had an experience with Bass Pro that I wanted to share. I have had the odd request for a PAL when buying reloading components. I don't take it well. The conversation usually goes like this:

"Do you have a PAL?"
"Yes."
"Can I see it?"
"No. And you should not be asking for it. I don't need a PAL to buy (bullets, powder, brass...) I am not going to show it to you. If you insist on this, please call the Manager because I am not going to show it to you."
"OK. I didn't know that you don't need a PAL to buy x."

And so another clerk is educated and another gun owner refuses to yield to the stupidity. It's not a big deal to some but it's a big deal to me. If others don't know this, I am telling you that you do NOT need to produce a PAL to buy reloading components so please don't. Don't yield. If we stand together on these small issues, we can help to undo the damage of years of liberal propaganda.

Here's an email I just got from Bass Pro with my reply below:

On 2012-01-02, at 4:19 PM, Glenn M. Puschner wrote:

Rick,

Let me apologize for what happened to your brother in law yesterday. You and him are correct when you say that you do not require a PAL to purchase reloading components. This does come to a surprise to a lot of gun owners that do shop here and elsewhere. Many times I’ve had customers offer to show their license when buying components. My staff upstairs in hunting try very hard to make sure that we are up to date with the current legislation. Unfortunately sometimes a few things slip through the cracks, this issue being one of them. I can also say the same for the cashiers downstairs. Many of them do not have a background in hunting or shooting, so they must also learn on the fly.
I hope this is a satisfactory answer for you. If you would like you could call me directly to discuss the issue further. I can be reached at 403-xxx-xxxx

Thanks,

Glenn Puschner
Hunting Manager
Calgary,AB

.......

Fair enough, but it's your job to teach your staff. This was a young lady cashier downstairs. Fix it.

A lot of us are fed up to the gills with dumb gun laws and the last - and I mean last - thing we need are those who hold themselves out as our "friends" piling on more of that liberal gun control crap.

My brother-in-law made a special detour to your store, at my request, to pick up some bullets that are hard to get here in *, some powder (which you didn't have anyway - R17) and some binos. I have my eye on one of your safes. I'm a gun nut. I spend quite a bit on hunting and shooting stuff that I really don't need and am grateful for an understanding wife.

I appreciate your reply, but I'd rather have heard "this won't happen again" instead of "Oh well, they don't know what they are doing."

I'm not surprised you have customers who offer to show their PALs. So many gun owners have been whipped for so long, it's a wonder some don't offer to drop their pants. That's no excuse for you or your staff, though, is it?

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Sincerely,

Rick

ps: I am copying this to my brother-in-law who did me the favour of driving to your store and was frustrated by someone who was inventing laws that don't exist.

We have to take our small victories where we can find them.

[Robmcleod82]

Are you for real? You seriously get that upset over something like that? You must lead a fairly uneventful life if that is a big deal for you. Your going to give a 16 year old girl grief for not knowing that you dont need a license to purchase reloading equipment, people like her get payed 9 bucks an hour, they dont need people treating them like they are morons because they make a mistake. She wasnt the one that made the dumb laws. Then Glen sent you a very polite apology letter and thats not good enough either. If I was the manager there I would have told you to pound sand. Hey heres an idea for you why dont you spare yourself and others the misery of having to deal with an ignorant jerk and buy your stuff online from grouse river then you will never have to show your pal for reloading stuff again.

[nick0danger]

never had a problem at basspro, i would of showed my pal and than said im pretty sure you do not need a pal for this perhaps you can ask your boss when you get a chance.

[.257Weatherby]

Guys, it is as simple as Apple Pie, if you do not like the "Store Policy" Do Not shop there.
Eventually they will get the idea.
As for people getting rude with the staff at these stores, do you really feel more better after the rant? (spelling/grammar pun intended)
The store can and does set policy, no matter how absurd it may seem to those of us in the know.
Tight Groups,
Rob

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by .257Weatherby

Guys, it is as simple as Apple Pie, if you do not like the "Store Policy" Do Not shop there.
Eventually they will get the idea.
As for people getting rude with the staff at these stores, do you really feel more better after the rant? (spelling/grammar pun intended)
The store can and does set policy, no matter how absurd it may seem to those of us in the know.
Tight Groups,
Rob

I agree somewhat......they set the policy if you want to buy the product then.....

The other side I see is that when the store employees do not know the rules then "politely" tell them.....if they still resist, then contact the managers, if they still resist.....then take your buying power elsewhere.

Honestly coming accross like a bull in the china shop just makes the not-knowing employees think that us gun toting lunatics....are lunatics

LC

[ShawnM]

No need to get testy with the cashiers/staff that ask to see your PAL when they aren't required to. It happens to me at Basspro/WSS etc. pretty well every other time I purchase components, etc. When they ask if I have my PAL with me I usually say "Yes, but you don't need to see it for any of these items." and I've only had someone not take my word for it once.

Why should I get worked up at a small error like that? All it takes is a small correction on my part and if it's done politely and in a friendly manner then I'm making it easier on the next guy to come through. I still get my way, and if I don't I smile and say I'd like to speak to their supervisor.

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

The other side I see is that when the store employees do not know the rules then "politely" tell them.....if they still resist, then contact the managers, if they still resist.....then take your buying power elsewhere.

Pretty much what I said.

Glad to hear others feel the same way. Very glad. We should support our friends in the business world. That requires knowing who our friends are.

On the education side, no business is going to change the way they do business if they don't know it's costing them money to act like a Gun Zombie. I make sure they know. Politely, but in no uncertain terms. After that, they can make their choices and I'll make mine.

Conversely, I go out of my way to support our friends. I buy more than I have to at the Sportsman's Den in Red Deer and for prices that are a tad higher than places like C.T. because Dale has his head screwed on right. I've told him that, too. I do buy some stuff at C.T., but the guys there also know I'd buy more if they dropped some of their phobias. For the most part, they see my point and are sympathetic. I've asked them to relay my opinion to management. Sorta like a voluntary customer survey.

Same goes for Chapters. I went in last year looking for a book on gunsmithing. They didn't have any. Odd. On a hunch, I went and looked at their magazine rack. No hunting or gun magazines. I asked "Why not" and found someone in the store who would tell me. Turns out their corporate brain trust in Ontario won't allow them to stock shooting/hunting books (although they will order one for me. In a plain brown wrapper, no doubt.) I asked for the manager and told him that I would never again buy a book at Chapters that I could get elsewhere and I told him why - I am a committed hunter and gun owner and do not appreciate for-profit businesses getting into the social engineering arena nor denigrating something that is important to me. Nor will I support a business that is, in effect, enabling censorship and supporting gun control advocates. It offends me and it insults my values. You don't have to raise your voice to do that, but I guess a couple of people at the counter probably overheard some of it and that's ok, too. I tried to be as civil as possible. Now, they can then choose what to put on their shelves; it's a free country. I just want them to know in no uncertain terms that, for some us, their choices result in lost revenue.

It's not about being rude. It's about deciding what I will, and will not, go along with and letting that be known where it might make a difference.

I'm all done going along to get along. If that makes me look like a redneck to some - oh, well. If I overstep, I'll apologize. If I don't, I won't.

[ctd]

You need a valid firearms licence to obtain ammunition. As defined in the Criminal Code: "ammunition" means "a cartridge containing a projectile designed to be discharged from a firearm and, without restricting the generality of the foregoing, includes a caseless cartridge and a shot shell." The definition does not include loose black powder and shot used in muzzleloaders. Black powder is regulated primarily under the Explosives Act, which is administered by Natural Resources Canada (NRCAN). Check with NRCAN or refer to the Explosives Act for any requirements applying to the purchase of loose black powder

ammunition” means a cartridge containing a projectile designed to be discharged from a firearm and, without restricting the generality of the foregoing, includes a caseless cartridge and a shot shell.


The Top Paragraph was taken from CFC website.
The second paragraph was taken from the Criminal code..

You are correct you can buy powder, primers and casings with out a PAL.
But to buy Cartridges you need your PAL according to what I just read. Whos right and whos wrong?

Unless you can provide me with a link that counters what is abovre I think you need to apoligize to the girl behind the counter and the store manager.

[elkhunter11]

You are correct you can buy powder, primers and casings with out a PAL.

Bullets also belong on that list.

But to buy Cartridges you need your PAL according to what I just read. Whos right and whos wrong?

He mentions bullets and powder, but I see no mention of cartridges.

My brother-in-law made a special detour to your store, at my request, to pick up some bullets that are hard to get here in *, some powder (which you didn't have anyway - R17) and some binos.

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by ctd

But to buy Cartridges you need your PAL according to what I just read. Whos right and whos wrong?

Unless you can provide me with a link that counters what is abovre I think you need to apoligize to the girl behind the counter and the store manager.

Do you have a reading problem?

My bro-in-law was buying components.

I am well aware that a PAL is required for factory ammunition.

[Robmcleod82]

I think you need a hug rocky. Your very emotional right now.

[Rocky7]

Hahaha. Nope, not really. I just can't fathom why gun owners would bend over for this. Why complain about gun laws is you're going to comply with laws that don't exist?

That's like complaining about an ATV helmet law while you ride around with an extra helmet strapped to your backside because somebody said you should.

[newdrenalin]

I'll have to agree with what a couple other guys already stated. Giving a 16 kid, that makes 9 bucks an hour, ****. Really ?

[coldredneck]

[airbornedeerhunter]

I was I believe, the first person to read your post. I was about to reply when I said no, I'll wait and see where this goes. 32 other people read your post and did not reply, finally someone did and I echo their sentiments. You and people like you are the reason why most people who work in the service industry are surly,grumpy and seem like their souls have been crushed. Not everyone who works at a sporting store is an outdoor / gun/ fishing/ hunting/ legislative/legal expert. Some poor kid working for minimum wage or a new employee at such a store learns as they go. Firstly, when asked for your PAL you could have simply been polite, smiled and explained in a non confrontational tone that one is'nt required to be produced for reloading components. You chose a different route and you did'nt stop at berating the employee, you took it further and filed a complaint, if I was the manager I would have ignored you as I'm sure your tone was no more pleasant that your first encounter with their staff. Then, when the guy takes the time out of his day to send you a polite apologetic letter, you practically tell the guy off for his apology! You need to pick and choose your battles! I would hate to see your reaction if one of your civil liberties really got trampled on! WoW!!!

[ROAD HAMMER]

Was at Peavey Mart they would not sell me pellets for a air gun without my PAL they got told wear to go and i want to speak with the manager and he told me the same thing so i showed him my PAL then i told him to pound sand and left .

[sns2]

Cabelas and WSS wanted my PAL / name for powder tonight. It was given gladly. What's the big deal? You think CSIS is watching you or something? Take it easy on people who make $9/hour.

[elkhunter11]

Firstly, when asked for your PAL you could have simply been polite, smiled and explained in a non confrontational tone that one is'nt required to be produced for reloading components.

I have done this myself a couple of times, and although one clerk did go to ask the manager to verify this, nobody became upset, and the transaction went smoothly. Now had I been refused service without producing my PAL after politely informing the clerk of the rules, I would have asked to see the manager.

[airbornedeerhunter]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

I have done this myself a couple of times, and although one clerk did go to ask the manager to verify this, nobody became upset, and the transaction went smoothly.

See! You get more bee's with honey than vinegar!

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

I have done this myself a couple of times, and although one clerk did go to ask the manager to verify this, nobody became upset, and the transaction went smoothly.

I was a tad upset on this one because my bro-in-law went out his way to go there, spent time in the store rounding up what was on my shopping list and - after I told him a PAL was not required - he was then refused the sale. There's no excuse for that.

Otherwise, I don't get upset either. But neither do I show my PAL.

[ctd]

What is the defintion of caseless cartridge.

[Lonnie]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

I was I believe, the first person to read your post. I was about to reply when I said no, I'll wait and see where this goes. 32 other people read your post and did not reply, finally someone did and I echo their sentiments. You and people like you are the reason why most people who work in the service industry are surly,grumpy and seem like their souls have been crushed. Not everyone who works at a sporting store is an outdoor / gun/ fishing/ hunting/ legislative/legal expert. Some poor kid working for minimum wage or a new employee at such a store learns as they go. Firstly, when asked for your PAL you could have simply been polite, smiled and explained in a non confrontational tone that one is'nt required to be produced for reloading components. You chose a different route and you did'nt stop at berating the employee, you took it further and filed a complaint, if I was the manager I would have ignored you as I'm sure your tone was no more pleasant that your first encounter with their staff. Then, when the guy takes the time out of his day to send you a polite apologetic letter, you practically tell the guy off for his apology! You need to pick and choose your battles! I would hate to see your reaction if one of your civil liberties really got trampled on! WoW!!!

airborn don't take this personally I picked your post just becuase it was the best written one people that work in a store should no there job even if min. wage and it is the managers job to see that they do he is the biggest one at fault and the manager should go and point out to all employees what is required for what. as people that work for you represent you and the business. the other thing that makes some people ticked off is that people that work in stores act like they know the laws that are associated to firearms like when storage laws came in every sports store was adamant that you had to have a gun safe to store long guns. made a lot of sales because of this and a lot of people believe that it was law as there gun store said it was. and if public opinion is left unchecked it cuold easly become law. and that is scary

[alwaysfishn]

Originally Posted by Lonnie

airborn don't take this personally I picked your post just becuase it was the best written one people that work in a store should no there job even if min. wage and it is the managers job to see that they do he is the biggest one at fault and the manager should go and point out to all employees what is required for what. as people that work for you represent you and the business. the other thing that makes some people ticked off is that people that work in stores act like they know the laws that are associated to firearms like when storage laws came in every sports store was adamant that you had to have a gun safe to store long guns. made a lot of sales because of this and a lot of people believe that it was law as there gun store said it was. and if public opinion is left unchecked it cuold easly become law. and that is scary

And this has to be the worst written one!

Please start your sentences with capitals and take a breath between them.... LOL

[Element]

Originally Posted by airbornedeerhunter

I was I believe, the first person to read your post. I was about to reply when I said no, I'll wait and see where this goes. 32 other people read your post and did not reply, finally someone did and I echo their sentiments. You and people like you are the reason why most people who work in the service industry are surly,grumpy and seem like their souls have been crushed. Not everyone who works at a sporting store is an outdoor / gun/ fishing/ hunting/ legislative/legal expert. Some poor kid working for minimum wage or a new employee at such a store learns as they go. Firstly, when asked for your PAL you could have simply been polite, smiled and explained in a non confrontational tone that one is'nt required to be produced for reloading components. You chose a different route and you did'nt stop at berating the employee, you took it further and filed a complaint, if I was the manager I would have ignored you as I'm sure your tone was no more pleasant that your first encounter with their staff. Then, when the guy takes the time out of his day to send you a polite apologetic letter, you practically tell the guy off for his apology! You need to pick and choose your battles! I would hate to see your reaction if one of your civil liberties really got trampled on! WoW!!!

x2. Couldn't agree with you more. Great post.

[Cowtown guy]

Originally Posted by Rocky7

Hi,

I just had an experience with Bass Pro that I wanted to share. I have had the odd request for a PAL when buying reloading components. I don't take it well. The conversation usually goes like this:

"Do you have a PAL?"
"Yes."
"Can I see it?"
"No. And you should not be asking for it. I don't need a PAL to buy (bullets, powder, brass...) I am not going to show it to you. If you insist on this, please call the Manager because I am not going to show it to you."
"OK. I didn't know that you don't need a PAL to buy x."

And so another clerk is educated and another gun owner refuses to yield to the stupidity. It's not a big deal to some but it's a big deal to me. If others don't know this, I am telling you that you do NOT need to produce a PAL to buy reloading components so please don't. Don't yield. If we stand together on these small issues, we can help to undo the damage of years of liberal propaganda.

Here's an email I just got from Bass Pro with my reply below:

On 2012-01-02, at 4:19 PM, Glenn M. Puschner wrote:

Rick,

Let me apologize for what happened to your brother in law yesterday. You and him are correct when you say that you do not require a PAL to purchase reloading components. This does come to a surprise to a lot of gun owners that do shop here and elsewhere. Many times I’ve had customers offer to show their license when buying components. My staff upstairs in hunting try very hard to make sure that we are up to date with the current legislation. Unfortunately sometimes a few things slip through the cracks, this issue being one of them. I can also say the same for the cashiers downstairs. Many of them do not have a background in hunting or shooting, so they must also learn on the fly.
I hope this is a satisfactory answer for you. If you would like you could call me directly to discuss the issue further. I can be reached at 403-xxx-xxxx

Thanks,

Glenn Puschner
Hunting Manager
Calgary,AB

.......
So he politely answers and admits there is sometimes an issue and is willing to try and work with staff to try and fix this. You want a credible answer and he doesn't try to fib his way thru it and say that there is no way it happened.
Fair enough, but it's your job to teach your staff. This was a young lady cashier downstairs. Fix it.
And you answer rudely.
A lot of us are fed up to the gills with dumb gun laws and the last - and I mean last - thing we need are those who hold themselves out as our "friends" piling on more of that liberal gun control crap.
Again, rude.
My brother-in-law made a special detour to your store, at my request, to pick up some bullets that are hard to get here in *, some powder (which you didn't have anyway - R17) and some binos. I have my eye on one of your safes. I'm a gun nut. I spend quite a bit on hunting and shooting stuff that I really don't need and am grateful for an understanding wife.

I appreciate your reply, but I'd rather have heard "this won't happen again" instead of "Oh well, they don't know what they are doing."
And rude again.
I'm not surprised you have customers who offer to show their PALs. So many gun owners have been whipped for so long, it's a wonder some don't offer to drop their pants. That's no excuse for you or your staff, though, is it?
Need I say it again?
Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Sincerely,

Rick

ps: I am copying this to my brother-in-law who did me the favour of driving to your store and was frustrated by someone who was inventing laws that don't exist.
Who cares?
We have to take our small victories where we can find them.

Good for you! A small victory indeed. What more could you have asked for? You voiced your opinion, you elicited a response. It was polite and to the point.

Have you ever tried to teach an 18 year old kid anything? Retention for most of them is minimal. Sorry to the young folks but that is the norm. Add to that the fact that She probably isn't a shooter. There are a bunch of new cashiers and most don't know the difference between a bullet or a cartridge. She made a mistake. Deal with it.

Better yet, take on a part time job at a store like this for a few weeks just for kicks and giggles and see what those kids have to put up with.

I had to step in and ask a customer to stop swearing and yelling at one of the kids at the gun counter in Bass Pro last week. He was loudly swearing at him for not having something in stock. These people repeatedly get abused weekly by guys that feel they need to educate staff and voice their opinion.

Hope it makes these guys feel good to b*tch out a teenager! Reeealll manly. I have no issue with someone politely stating that the PAL isn't needed for components. But really was the response to the e-mail that was sent to you really called for?

[Rocky7]

Originally Posted by Cowtown guy

I have no issue with someone politely stating ....But really was the response to the e-mail that was sent to you really called for?

Luckily, I don't need your permission nor your grammar lesson.

If you were as assiduous in upholding our collective freedoms and resisting politically correct extensions to gun control law as you are in defending store owners and dissecting my grammar, I expect by now we'd be trading comments on who is going to be hunting what with a handgun next fall and who isn't.

[shortaction]

I can understand someone disagreeing with the intensity the OP used in his response but I can't understand your acceptance of the stores training their staff to ask for a PAL to purchases something that doesn't require it? Where would you draw the line?

If you where purchasing a camo shirt and they asked for it would you still show your PAL, after all it must be for hunting! I am just saying that there must be a line for everyone, and I'm not sure why it isn't where the law states it is!

These big box stores are fully computerized and there is no reason they wouldn't have the appropriate items flagged as requiring a PAL for purchase. The only reason it isn't done as there hasn't been enough pressure put on them to get it right!

I will not show my PAL for anything that doesn't require it by law, but to each their own! I do not disagree with a store asking for my PAL to handle a firearm as you need one to possess a firearm and as soon as they pass you that firearm to you, I would consider it to be in my possession.

My personal preference is to educate not berate, but I would take berate over submission.

[Scar270]

Shortaction you dont need a PAL if you are under immediate supervision. If I'm in a store I would say that I'm under supervision.

If you are ok with the practice that is your choice, but the law certainly does not demand it. Only store policy.

[nekred]

I understand the feeling of the OP...

If it is not required by law... or even in this case by store policy and is a mistake that ended up in the hands of a cashier through ignorance, or carelessness that has shown to be dealt with by the stores management.

There are some interesting points brought up here... We complain about the laws and regulations that make life inconvenient, onerous, or remove what we see as our freedoms.

If we look at the laws implemented and revised in parliament today they are all the result of some type of civil disobedience such as, Hutterites not having their picture raken for driver's license, people lobbying to wear hijabs, or not showing their face for a drivers license photo, or court appearance either!...etc. because they feel it is an infringement on their freedom of religion. Many people on here that complain about the giun registry meanwhile support the laws requiring these people to show their face... because it does not bother us.

Tolerance is the path to having our freedoms impinged upon.

After the the engineering school massacre there was a change in law brought in by Kim Campbell that limited certain rifles and magazine amounts and a few people complained but overall there was no action. So then Allan Rock decided to go one step further and be a hero and went a great many steps further with C-68... and that finally crossed the line of tolerance into the land of indignance and caused civil disobedience with many people refusing to register their guns, and caused the various lobby groups to step up and form against gun registration and finally after wasting billions of our dollars (1 billion is the equivalent of every person in canada spending 300 dollars) because we finally decided we were not going to tolerate the infringement of our freedoms any further...

Canadians are known worldwide for being a tolerant country, Tolerance is a very dangerous thing. Indifference is different than tolerance. indifference is when a decision does not affect us or matter to us. Tolerance is when we choose to accept a negative consequence because to do otherwise would create uncomfort, conflict and requires effort.

Not long ago someone who fought for us against gun control was applauded here on the AO for having the cjones to stand up for us and go to Ottowa to make sure that the ludicrous gun registry disappears.

The OP here saw a situation and did what he could to educate and correct the situation by taking action.

In my opinion there has been assumptions made.

What I choose to take home is that I am glad that there are people choosing not to tolerate further unnecessary infringements on our rights and freedoms.

I love the quote, "For evil to prevail all it requires is that goos people do nothing"...

When I buy reloading supplies and people ask for my PAL I ask is it for law or for store policy. If they say law I explain that the law does not require it and I explain that I am refusing because it is not required by law and ask to speak with manager.

If they say it is store policy, then I explain that under PIPEDA that they require my written consent to access personal information such as drivers' license, SIN, or other unique identifier number or government issued licensing or cards. This act also requires for the company to disclose how they will use this information and the purposes it is collected for to determine if there is a bona fid requirement for this inforation in order for store to be in regulatory compliance...

Yes this does take time, effort and energy, but if I just leave my stuff on the counter and walk away and go to another store that does not do much to change store policy. All that happens is that the cashier or other low level peon ends up having to put the stuff away.

Stores do not collect information on how many people are walking out without making a purchase, and by the time the corporate management notices things it is on the quarterly balance sheet and the damage has long been done....

So the fact the OP took the effort to do their best to make difference, wrote a letter, come on here and posted the results along with their frustrations... then I see the East German style judges sitting behind screens and keyboards making assumptions and judgement calls.

In the end who do we want on our side... the ones willing to take action or those who sit back in the weeds and judge the actions of others while being inactive themselves.

Suggestions can be made on how to make this action more effective, and encourage people to be vigilant and diligent.

Things happened with gun registry once enough of us got fed up with what was happening and suddenly we have a voice.

When I had to sign the book at XXX for powder the counter person turned away to get it and Santa Claus boght a pound of IMR 4350 that day... Address was North Pole, Canada H0H 0H0. That was my act of civil disobedience... the counter person did not need any more educating as he showed me the book and said he would get my powder as I wrote the information in....

He tolerated my act of civil disobedience... because he was in agreement.

Being a cashier in s porting goods store would be a version of hell for me. I have a hard enough time at the self checkout in a grocery store getting the fricken scanner to work, then I place the items in the wrong spot... These cashiers need to know how to run the till, make sure nothing is missed, and then on top of it know what requires a Pal, what doesn't etc. all for minimum wage. On top of it all dealing with a bunch of redneck outdoorsmen who are all very particular or fussy...

So the letter after the fact to the manager of the store was a good move... put the focus on where it needed to be. On the policy makers...

Cheers!

[Bradleytank]

Originally Posted by Scar270

Shortaction you dont need a PAL if you are under immediate supervision. If I'm in a store I would say that I'm under supervision.

If you are ok with the practice that is your choice, but the law certainly does not demand it. Only store policy.

Direct and immediate supervision can be difined different ways however; to myself that means within arms reach so that if you mis handle the firearm I can reach out and correct that. As an associate hands a firearm across a counter there is now a barrier between the Associate and the customer. If the customer then takes a step back to view the firearm in better lighting (happens alot the lights at bass pro are terrible). This can be viewed that the associate has now broken the law.

Secondly it's store policy to view a PAL at bass pro before you handle a firearm. This is to prevent the above mentioned situation as well as to prevent aimless tire kickers. The associate isn't going to break store policy and possible face discipline because you feel you don't have to show your license.

As for the asking for the PAL to buy reloading components yes it's not required, no the associate shouldn't ask if they are paying attention. Saying that when I was working behind the gun counter I asked sometimes because I wasn't paying attention. I usually caught myself before the customer showed me and appoligized saying I didn't need to see it.

The learning curve for the cashiers in a outdoor store like bass pro is steep for the younger kids having their first jobs. It is a training issue they do need to point this out to the new cashiers but also remember that the cashier may have never seen reloading components until that week or day sometimes. If you're polite and tell them that it's not required for components that goes a long way in educating that person.

Good on you for emailing the manager, the only way to provoke change is to voice your concerns. You were polite and respectful as was Glenn's reply. Then it seemed to go down hill from there. I don't honestly expect every person to be 100% every time. Some people don't know the law, some people don't care to learn the law, and finally some people just have an off day. It happens it's how you deal with it that changes the way people act in the future both in the situation and with yourself.


Cheers,

Brad