Are you surprised?

[bearb8er]

Surprise...Surprise!
Wind and solar were unable to produce enough or keep up with demand on a cloudy and less than breezy day? Enmax actually simply shut off power today for a bunch of customers? I'm speechless!

[elkhunter11]

Imagine if even 25% of Albertans had switched over to electric vehicles.

[silvertip]

Originally Posted by bearb8er

Surprise...Surprise!
Wind and solar were unable to produce enough or keep up with demand on a cloudy and less than breezy day? Enmax actually simply shut off power today for a bunch of customers? I'm speechless!

IMAGINE THAT,

what were they thinking

[Savage Bacon]

This can't be true. If we wish it to work, then it must work!

Sent from my SM-S901W using Tapatalk

[I’d rather be outdoors]

Shocked…no really. said nobody.

[Dean2]

The companies selling and installing backup home generators are running flat out, just because a whole bunch of people believe it will get a bunch worse before it gets better.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Dean2

The companies selling and installing backup home generators are running flat out, just because a whole bunch of people believe it will get a bunch worse before it gets better.

Of course it will get worse, people want to depend on unreliable wind and solar power, while increasing the electrical demand with more electric vehicles, and more electric heat.

[vinny]

Can’t wait for air conditioner season. What’s gonna happen then?!

[Dick284]

Back in 2008, I was telling a very cautionary tale on this very subject.

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=20942

Wind and solar are a sham!

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Dick284

Back in 2008, I was telling a very cautionary tale on this very subject.

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=20942

Wind and solar are a sham!

It will take more serious outages to get some people to come to their senses, and some of the real green fanatics will never listen.

[Off in the Bushes]

I fail to see the how turning off people’s power is saving anything. At current they are cycling on demand when needed. But you shut everyone's power off for a period just long enough to change the temp or to inconvenience someone, when the power is restored it is used with even a greater demand. To get house warmed back up to start or finish cooking etc. Now it’s a finite resource that may go out again and people may run their homes warmer etc.
Maybe for EV car owner the government should have a switch that doesn’t allow you to charge when the grid is at 80% max capacity. Or only when the green energy is available. 🤣

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Off in the Bushes

I fail to see the how turning off people’s power is saving anything. At current they are cycling on demand when needed. But you shut everyone's power off for a period just long enough to change the temp or to inconvenience someone, when the power is restored it is used with even a greater demand. To get house warmed back up to start or finish cooking etc. Now it’s a finite resource that may go out again and people may run their homes warmer etc.

So what is the alternative to shedding loads, when you can't make enough electricity to supply the demand?

[Off in the Bushes]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

So what is the alternative to shedding loads, when you can't make enough electricity to supply the demand?

I’m sure the province has the ability to import or export power. Stop the export and increase the import. I am a firm believe that any city over 70k people should have a power plant that can produce the needs of the city. Well also having the ability to import enough power in the event of a black out to run the essentials.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Off in the Bushes

I’m sure the province has the ability to import or export power. Stop the export and increase the import. I am a firm believe that any city over 70k people should have a power plant that can produce the needs of the city. Well also having the ability to import enough power in the event of a black out to run the essentials.

So where is that power supposed to come from? Someone has to have the extra generation available, and has to be willing to generate that extra power and send it to you. Other provinces/states, aren't going to make sure that they have extra generation available, just in case Alberta needs it. They have their own customers to provide for, and they need maintenance outages as well. If we want reliable power, whenever we need it, then we have to generate it ourselves. As for every city over 70k people having their own generation plant, that is laughable, do you have any idea what infrastructure is required, and what it costs?

[CanuckShooter]

It's hard to believe that with govt pushing the go electric nonsense that there isn't enough power capacity to keep the lights on.

Why on earth aren't they building new NG power plants or even a few small nuclear ones?? Doesn't anyone plan for the future anymore??

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by CanuckShooter

It's hard to believe that with govt pushing the go electric nonsense that there isn't enough power capacity to keep the lights on.

Why on earth aren't they building new NG power plants or even a few small nuclear ones?? Doesn't anyone plan for the future anymore??

Because it's the federal government pushing the go electric agenda, and they want green electricity that has proven to be unreliable. And the federal government doesn't build electric generation plants for the provinces anyways. And any attempt to build a nuclear plant, would have the environmental activists in full protest mode. In fact many people would resist having a nuclear plant built anywhere in Alberta.

We have a huge catch 22 here. People want plenty of reliable, affordable electricity, and yet they don't want to allow us to generate it it in a way that will be reliable,and reasonably priced.

[Dean2]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Of course it will get worse, people want to depend on unreliable wind and solar power, while increasing the electrical demand with more electric vehicles, and more electric heat.

The title of the thread is "Are You Surprised". What I was trying to say is, a lot of people are not the least bit surprised and have been taking matters into their own hands. I am one of them, we installed a generator last fall because we also believe the rolling brown outs will get worse. Winter you freeze up, summer you risk the frozen foods you have stored.

Maybe it would have been clearer if I worded it a tad different;

Originally Posted by Dean2 View Post
The companies selling and installing backup home generators are running flat out,

PHP Code:

just 


precisely (should have used precisely instead of just) because a whole bunch of people believe it will get a bunch worse before it gets better.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Dean2

The title of the thread is "Are You Surprised". What I was trying to say is, a lot of people are not the least bit surprised and have been taking matters into their own hands. I am one of them, we installed a generator last fall because we also believe the rolling brown outs will get worse. Winter you freeze up, summer you risk the frozen foods you have stored.

Maybe it would have been clearer if I worded it a tad different;

Originally Posted by Dean2 View Post
The companies selling and installing backup home generators are running flat out,

PHP Code:

just 


precisely (should have used precisely instead of just) because a whole bunch of people believe it will get a bunch worse before it gets better.

I am actually considering having a natural gas powered generator installed myself, for now I do have a portable inverter/generator that I can hook up to my furnace or freezers/fridges/sump pump.

[Dick284]

The nuances of grid operations is not widely understood, and its shows, even on this forum.

Collapse the grid and watch the level of anarchy that will ensue. That’s why the revolving black outs, these happen to drop load, and stabilize the grid frequency collapse, and prevent a chain reaction of system collapse.

If anyone cared to check the AESO supply and demand real time grid situation yesterday, they would have seen two gas fired generating sites were offline, and the 3 tie lines to outside of the province were supplying power to Alberta (BC, SK, MT)
http://ets.aeso.ca/ets_web/ip/Market...DReportServlet

Alberta needs base load generation, Cascade at Edson is 6-8 months behind schedule coming online (900 MW)

Nobody can get financing or find shareholder dollars due to the Fed’s stupid rules around green energy, so where’s base load gonna come from?

Once the average person gets a dose of these realities, then finally an awakening may begin, until the pain is felt by a good many common folks, don’t expect voter sentiment to change anytime soon.

[Smoky buck]

If only there was common sense planning in place to improve our infrastructure. Not that I have a great understanding of potential projects but I have not heard of any real focus to improve besides fluffy green energy

With the rate Alberta is growing and will likely continue to grow something needs to happen

[416 Ultramag]

Originally Posted by Off in the Bushes

I fail to see the how turning off people’s power is saving anything. At current they are cycling on demand when needed. But you shut everyone's power off for a period just long enough to change the temp or to inconvenience someone, when the power is restored it is used with even a greater demand. To get house warmed back up to start or finish cooking etc. Now it’s a finite resource that may go out again and people may run their homes warmer etc.
Maybe for EV car owner the government should have a switch that doesn’t allow you to charge when the grid is at 80% max capacity. Or only when the green energy is available. 🤣

Actually if you are an EV owner maybe you should be required to only use so called green energy and have solar powered hook up and batteries at your house and be completely reliant on it. Before you are even allowed to buy an EV car.

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by 416 Ultramag

Actually if you are an EV owner maybe you should be required to only use so called green energy and have solar powered hook up and batteries at your house and be completely reliant on it. Before you are even allowed to buy an EV car.

No no no I have a better idea tax ev users to help fund improvements to our power generation do to the increasing demand they help generate

Might as well make it benefit society instead of just penalize them out of spite

[Bushrat]

Population of Alberta has nearly doubled in the last 30years, that has pretty much doubled our consumption. It is still increasing. Our electric generation and infrastructure hasn't kept pace. Doesn't make a lot of sense continuing to increase our consumption massively with a conversion to electric vehicles when we already don't have enough power to go around.

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

Population of Alberta has nearly doubled in the last 30years, that has pretty much doubled our consumption. It is still increasing. Our electric generation and infrastructure hasn't kept pace. Doesn't make a lot of sense continuing to increase our consumption massively with a conversion to electric vehicles when we already don't have enough power to go around.

Agree 100% put the whole debate of if EVs are viable or not and the biggest issue in the push to get people to switch to EVs is the lack of effort to increase power generation to offset the increased demand that would come with it

Like you mentioned we might want to sort out infrastructure to even fulfill present demands that come with population growth first

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by Smoky buck

Agree 100% put the whole debate of if EVs are viable or not and the biggest issue in the push to get people to switch to EVs is the lack of effort to increase power generation to offset the increased demand that would come with it

Like you mentioned we might want to sort out infrastructure to even fulfill present demands that come with population growth first

And you have the activist/criminal Fed Minister wanting no hydrocarbon generation by 2035! Where’s this base load infrastructure magically going to come from? Nobody will invest or bank roll any generation project with that big black cloud hanging over the province! And it takes a minimum 10 years from concept to commissioning to get new generation too.(closer to 15)

Can you say up the creek without a canoe!

Small nuclear is an option, but nuclear is so heavily regulated by the Fed’s, and lord knows the NIMBY crowd will cry to the heavens at the prospect, and oh ya, that’s likely a 20 year project to see it bear fruit.

Alberta needs base load online and running some 4 years ago, not 10-20 years in the future.

[urban rednek]

Surprised this happened? Not really.

The cult of useful idiots won't stop championing half-baked ideas until they are personally inconvenienced by the effects of their beliefs. The more painful and/or expensive the lesson, the faster they will learn.

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by Dick284

And you have the activist/criminal Fed Minister wanting no hydrocarbon generation by 2035! Where’s this base load infrastructure magically going to come from? Nobody will invest or bank roll any generation project with that big black cloud hanging over the province! And it takes a minimum 10 years from concept to commissioning to get new generation too.(closer to 15)

Can you say up the creek without a canoe!

Small nuclear is an option, but nuclear is so heavily regulated by the Fed’s, and lord knows the NIMBY crowd will cry to the heavens at the prospect, and oh ya, that’s likely a 20 year project to see it bear fruit.

Alberta needs base load online and running some 4 years ago, not 10-20 years in the future.

No argument from me I have been shaking my head at all this crap even without your level of knowledge on the subject

The miss management of this country is brutal

[KGB]

Originally Posted by urban rednek

Surprised this happened? Not really.

The cult of useful idiots won't stop championing half-baked ideas until they are personally inconvenienced by the effects of their beliefs. The more painful and/or expensive the lesson, the faster they will learn.

I guess the beating should continue until morales improves!

[I’d rather be outdoors]

If we could only harness the hot air coming out of the mouths of lieberals, we would have limitless energy.

[Au revoir, Gopher]

Originally Posted by I’d rather be outdoors

If we could only harness the hot air coming out of the mouths of lieberals, we would have limitless energy.

If you called it 'biogas' then it's all good!

It boggles the mind

Natural gas (aka methane) = bad
Biogas (aka methane) = good

Strangely enough the emissions from both are about the same... who knew?!?

ARG