CLAS and Paid Access

[matt1984]

There have been many discussions on the CLAS app, and skirting the legal boundary on paid access. I see today they are pushing the envelope even further by encouraging land owners to list their hunting blinds for rent on the CLAS app. Maybe legally that's not "paid access", but about as close as you can get.

https://blog.clas.app/listing-your-h...m-marketplace/

[burbotman]

They found the loop hole. I have a hunch priority will go to the people choosing the rent the blind option…. Business opportunity created Blind builder

[edmsmith]

Wow.

Can anyone rent a hunting blind with agreed upon hunting regulations that must be followed? Why would anyone have to sign up on CLAS to do that?

I'm going to build some blinds and start renting them out.... got lots of useless land I can rent out blinds to without much work. I'd guess this would be quite lucrative early on.

[pikergolf]

It is a game of elimination of competition for the wealthy, many boomers are more than willing to squeeze others out in their quest for their past time. Look at the fees being paid for guided hunts. Sad really, when they are gone and the next generation loses interest because they could not afford access, then what?

[cowmanbob]

Originally Posted by pikergolf

It is a game of elimination of competition for the wealthy, many boomers are more than willing to squeeze others out in their quest for their past time. Look at the fees being paid for guided hunts. Sad really, when they are gone and the next generation loses interest because they could not afford access, then what?

Wouldn’t you hunt crown land then?

[KGB]

I just looked at this app and without paying a $10 I can’t really understand what this is about… Does it show you the land owner info like IHunter does without paying for each county ? Does it show you the crown land?

[Dewey Cox]

Good.
People should be able to rent out their land.

[DiabeticKripple]

Originally Posted by KGB

I just looked at this app and without paying a $10 I can’t really understand what this is about… Does it show you the land owner info like IHunter does without paying for each county ? Does it show you the crown land?

no its shows you private land owners that use the CLAS app to manage the access to their lands for them.

Essentially you pay to use the app, landowners pay to use the app, and the company will manage the access to the properties on the landowners behalf.

I emailed SRD about this a few years ago, and its legal because CLAS doesnt pay the landowners.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

no its shows you private land owners that use the CLAS app to manage the access to their lands for them.

Essentially you pay to use the app, landowners pay to use the app, and the company will manage the access to the properties on the landowners behalf.

I emailed SRD about this a few years ago, and its legal because CLAS doesnt pay the landowners.

But now the landowners will receive payment for the use of the blind. If the conditions of rent include or imply access for the purpose of hunting, the situation would become illegal.

[waldedw]

Waterfowl outfitters have been doing it for years, " gratuity " to land owners in various forms for exclusive hunting permission to large tracks of farm land, just ask Claudio how it works

[edmsmith]

Originally Posted by waldedw

Waterfowl outfitters have been doing it for years, " gratuity " to land owners in various forms for exclusive hunting permission to large tracks of farm land, just ask Claudio how it works

This hasn't been ongoing for years. This now allows any land owner to rent a blind and advertise said blind for profit and to market it to anyone.

I can rent my bear blinds... how about renting duck blinds/setups. Seems like a very profitable business for many land owners.

I don't get why you'd need to use CLAS for this... why give
them a cut of things??

Ill guess those first to market will profit nicely this year.

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

no its shows you private land owners that use the CLAS app to manage the access to their lands for them.

Essentially you pay to use the app, landowners pay to use the app, and the company will manage the access to the properties on the landowners behalf.

I emailed SRD about this a few years ago, and its legal because CLAS doesnt pay the landowners.

And this is where a lawsuit could bring CLAS to an end.

SRD is just giving you their legal opinion, not an actual court ruling on whether this is legal.
I call it a bluff.

CLAS is being paid by the Landowners to be an "Agent" for them.
The public is also paying CLAS to be an "Agent" for the landowner.
Thus the consumer's payments to CLAS are actually a benefit received by both CLAS and the Landowner.
This is where (IMO) the arrangement is illegal.



Have a lawyer ready to sue CLAS and the Landowner if you stumble over a rock and hurt yourself.

These payments will likely be accepted by a court as payment for access, thus making your access a commercial endeavor.
This payment will likely remove the Landowner and agent from protection by the Trespass to Premises Act.

If anyone gets hurt while hunting CLAS properties. SUE!


Screw you CLAS.
You lied to my face.
Years ago you promised me that you would not go down this road.
Greedy liars.

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by cowmanbob

Wouldn’t you hunt crown land then?

No crown land anywhere near where I live. And the lots of states have no or very little public lands.

[Hilgy]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

no its shows you private land owners that use the CLAS app to manage the access to their lands for them.

Essentially you pay to use the app, landowners pay to use the app, and the company will manage the access to the properties on the landowners behalf.

I emailed SRD about this a few years ago, and its legal because CLAS doesnt pay the landowners.

Did we not run into a couple GR that were using CLAS down south? Does this then open up Lease holders to "rent" blinds on what is essentially crown land?

[DiabeticKripple]

Originally Posted by Hilgy

Did we not run into a couple GR that were using CLAS down south? Does this then open up Lease holders to "rent" blinds on what is essentially crown land?

yup thats when i emailed SRD and talked with one of them on the phone. He said as long as CLAS is not paying the landowners, which isnt their business model, then they are operating under the laws.

I suppose anyone could rent their blinds out if this is the case. You technically arent getting money for access, but money to use the blind. Very gray area.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

yup thats when i emailed SRD and talked with one of them on the phone. He said as long as CLAS is not paying the landowners, which isnt their business model, then they are operating under the laws.

I suppose anyone could rent their blinds out if this is the case. You technically arent getting money for access, but money to use the blind. Very gray area.

If the blind is on private property, and the fee provides access to the private property, for the purpose of hunting, that would be illegal. All F&W would have to do, is ask if the rental includes access for the purpose of hunting, to build a case.

[edmsmith]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

If the blind is on private property, and the fee provides access to the private property, for the purpose of hunting, that would be illegal. All F&W would have to do, is ask if the rental includes access for the purpose of hunting, to build a case.

Clas goes a step further to allow land owners to direct the rules one must follow. Like safe hunting. Following all regulations etc etc. LOL.

I'm tempted to throw a Facebook ad up offering up some blinds people can rent on my land. See what f&w will do.

[DiabeticKripple]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

If the blind is on private property, and the fee provides access to the private property, for the purpose of hunting, that would be illegal. All F&W would have to do, is ask if the rental includes access for the purpose of hunting, to build a case.

yes, but what if permission is granted regardless, but there is a rental fee to sit in the blind?

i think any compensation with regard to hunting ought to be banned, other than outfitting.

[edmsmith]

This is from the website:

Terms and Conditions

Clearly outline your terms and conditions for access to the hunting blinds. This may include information about hunting regulations, safety guidelines, and any associated fees.

They aren't even pretending it's not paid hunting. It's hilarious.

I wonder if they define what a blind is.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

yes, but what if permission is granted regardless, but there is a rental fee to sit in the blind?

i think any compensation with regard to hunting ought to be banned, other than outfitting.

Ask permission, if it's denied, ask if you get permission, if you rent the blind.

[Dewey Cox]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

yes, but what if permission is granted regardless, but there is a rental fee to sit in the blind?

i think any compensation with regard to hunting ought to be banned, other than outfitting.

So, someone gets a loan for some land, makes payments, pays the taxes, hires someone to control the noxious weeds, grows the forage the game eat, farms around the bush the game lives in, and you don't think they should be allowed to get any financial benefit from the people they let hunt there?
But you're ok with outfitters charging to take people out hunting on crown land?

Please expalin better, because that makes no sense to me.

[DiabeticKripple]

Originally Posted by Dewey Cox

So, someone gets a loan for some land, makes payments, pays the taxes, hires someone to control the noxious weeds, grows the forage the game eat, farms around the bush the game lives in, and you don't think they should be allowed to get any financial benefit from the people they let hunt there?
But you're ok with outfitters charging to take people out hunting on crown land?

Please expalin better, because that makes no sense to me.

paying for access is illegal. paying an outfitter to use their tag and guide services isnt. its that simple.

[edmsmith]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

paying for access is illegal. paying an outfitter to use their tag isnt. its that simple.

Paying to rent a blind is still paying for access. It's hilarious that f&w don't agree and would allow this.

It's good for landowners like Dewey who can now decide to profit from their land. Thanks CLAS.

[landowner]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

paying for access is illegal. paying an outfitter to use their tag and guide services isnt. its that simple.

Actually it’s not that simple, I have a neighbor who rents out hunting privileges on private land via a loophole by using an outfitter. The outfitter doesn’t have a special tag for this area, the hunter is drawn like any one else..So all the difference would be the services. He just chaperones the hunter. Why should a landowner have to use scumbag outfitter ?

[DiabeticKripple]

It’s all right here fellas

[edmsmith]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

It’s all right here fellas

If CLAS is advertising the rentals of hunting blinds I'd guess it's been run past fish and wild life. So as much as you think it's illegal I'm going to guess they've done their homework and been provided the go ahead.

Question is can we all offer the same services.

[IL Bar]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

yes, but what if permission is granted regardless, but there is a rental fee to sit in the blind?

i think any compensation with regard to hunting ought to be banned, other than outfitting.

So you are ok with outfitters paying for land access? Who are these outfitters that are paying for access? I’ve yet to be offered a dollar from any that I’ve ever let on. Most of them end up being a big pain in the ass and you have to shake it out of them that they are guiding.

[DiabeticKripple]

I think you guys are misunderstanding what I said.

I did not mean that outfitters paying for access should be allowed.

I meant any paying for anything (access, rental blinds, CLAS) should all be illegal, while paying to use an outfitter, like currently is allowed, should be fine.

[Battle Rat]

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple

I think you guys are misunderstanding what I said.

I did not mean that outfitters paying for access should be allowed.

I meant any paying for anything (access, rental blinds, CLAS) should all be illegal, while paying to use an outfitter, like currently is allowed, should be fine.

It doesn't matter if it's illegal or not.
Its standard practice for an outfitter to "hire" the land owner as a guide, put him on the payroll.
It's not illegal for that land owner to only allow hunting by the outfitters clients.
Right or wrong it happens all the time and impossible to hold either party accountable.
We then have different opportunities for outfitters than for the average hunter.
Implementing paid access would open the doors that would be detrimental to the outfitters monopoly they have now.

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by edmsmith

If CLAS is advertising the rentals of hunting blinds I'd guess it's been run past fish and wild life. So as much as you think it's illegal I'm going to guess they've done their homework and been provided the go ahead.

Question is can we all offer the same services.

Yes, the gov has decided to allow CLAS to operate.

This does not mean it is legal.
It will take a court case to determine that.