Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckhorn2
There is no eldx available in 30 caliber under 178gr that is why i choose sst to compare in the first place. Identical bullet design in as close as weight as possible in those calibers. You cant compare a 6.5m to 308 if your not using as close as set of variables as possible. Which bullet has higher bc a eldx 178gr or a 180gr rem corelokt. In 308. You cant compare ballistics of those bullets the eldx fired from same gun at same velocity, in all tests will win. The 308 will push a 143gr bullet faster than a creedmoor by a fair margin. Given same weight of bullet. So if we went closer in BC with same bullet then the 308 ballistics are same or better.
Is it fair to compare a 180gr bullet shot slowly vs a 140gr bullet faster. Who wins are we measuring energy its 308 still. Who wins if the creedmore tried to push a 180 gr bullet really slow and the 308 allowed to fire a 140gr match bullet faster. Taking the rifle/ recoil etc out of the equation is how you compare bullets. The shooter supplies the accuracy. (Wind and drop)The only way to compare hunting “ballistics” is with down range energy at the velocity that the bullets are designed to expand which most manufacturers is 1800fps . Yes the 6.5 will open up larger diameter but so will the 308, and the larger hole allows to bleed out faster. If we are again comparing the same bullet for a fair comparison.
Im not a 600 yard shooter. This is each hunters personal pick they choose a bullet and should know how low they are willing to accept for velocity and energy. If you are ok shooting sub 1000 ftlbs and right on the dieing edge of the velocity required for your bullet to function fill your boots. For a long shot why would you not want more energy and velocity then the bare theoretical minimum that the 308 or creedmoor can provide.
When comparing 308 to 6.5 creedmoor why not just say the creedmoor is just a similar option to a 308. The creedmoor didnt reinvent the 6.5 hunting caliber. If you want a bigger hole shoot a 308. Other options are 7mm08, 257, 270 win, all depends on the size of the caliber you prefer to hunt with.
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You were absolutely right when you stated this,
"The only way to compare hunting “ballistics” is with down range energy at the velocity that the bullets are designed to expand which most manufacturers is 1800fps ". You should have realized that the object is to find the 'Optimum" bullet in each cartridge to meet the criteria that you laid out. I pointed out that I have seen Factory 180 grain Win PP Bullets "under the hide on the other side of a moose" and that Factory 130 Win PP bullets from a 270 would pass through at 600 yards. A 308 with a 180 Win would likely not have enough energy, or momentum to, pass through so both other calibers would leave a longer wound channel and the one from the 270 would likely bleed out more as it will bleed out both sides. In any event the moose will be dead if the bullets passed through, or into both lungs.
The 6.5 Creedmore, with the 143 ELDX satisfies the minimum velocity, as it is still traveling at 1836 fps and has 1191 ft.lbs. energy at 600 yards. I estimate that it would make a complete pass through on a moose. The 178 ELDX is a much better choice than the SST as it meets the criteria and actually has better "hunting ballistics than the Creedmore but with more felt recoil as I pointed out. So I guess rather than comparing calibers and cartridges you should compare the terminal ballistics of "Bullets" or available ammunition as the winner will be the bullet with the best ballistics.
There are a lot of people that get hung up on Caliber and cartridge when comparing hunting ballistics. My gun is bigger than yours, or the 300 win mag , STW and 7mmMag are much better long range choices than your lady's gun. Invariably they get their nose out of joint when I show them that their "Mans gun" actually has much the same or inferior hunting ballistics at 600 yards with the ammunition we have chosen. In fact my RCBS Load program has the ballistics for nearly every Factory Round made. I can easily point out at least a dozen factory loads in 7mm Mag, 7mm STW and 300 Win Mag that are similar to, or inferior, to the 6.5 Creedmore with the 143 ELDX Factory load at 600 yards. However they will all kill moose/elk/deer if the shooter is capable of placing a bullet through both lungs.
Instead of all of the hatefull bickering that goes on when discussing cartridges that are different than our "pet" cartridges perhaps we should analize each one for their merits or their faults. Hornady and other manufacturers have done a great job, since the introduction of the 375 Ruger, in bringing out cartridges that fit better in magazines when seated out to the lands and supplying quality ammunition among other things, than most other cartridge designs. For this I applaud their efforts.