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-   -   Grande Prairie region mulie population (http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=382160)

Outbound 05-26-2020 11:37 AM

Grande Prairie region mulie population
 
I'm getting back into hunting after a 6+ year hiatus. I'm looking at the draw info and regulations as I start planning. I noticed that mule deer are pretty much all a draw species in the GP area. From what I remember the last times I was hunting we would see countless mule deer over a season, but only a tiny handful of whitetails. Even these days, on my fishing and hiking trips the deer I come across are almost all invariably mulies.

Do white tails and mule deer not share similar territory, thus meaning we were only in mulie country? Has the F&W management got their thinking backwards in allowing a GOS on a species with a smaller population? Is there something I'm missing here?

Steyr Luxus 05-26-2020 05:32 PM

Yes, these deer intermix in the same territory. I have also observed them feeding together in the same feeding areas and still continue to see this mixing

Grizzly Adams 05-26-2020 06:01 PM

When I was in the Yukon last Fall, learned an interesting fact, Mule deer were not native at one time, but have gradually been moving in from the South.

Grizz

Outbound 05-26-2020 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steyr Luxus (Post 4176623)
Yes, these deer intermix in the same territory. I have also observed them feeding together in the same feeding areas and still continue to see this mixing

That's what I thought. If that is indeed the case, then I'm not sure why there would be a GOS on whities and not on mulies if the former's population appears so much smaller. It'd make more sense to me as a layman and casual observer that the draws would be for the more threatened population.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams (Post 4176640)
When I was in the Yukon last Fall, learned an interesting fact, Mule deer were not native at one time, but have gradually been moving in from the South.

Grizz

I did hear something to that effect. It's interesting how critters move. I read an article recently that stated whitetails actually did better with humans around and mule deer kept migrating higher and farther from humans.

Positrac 05-26-2020 06:45 PM

I don’t know about Grande Prairie but I was a bit north of there in January on a cow elk hunt (526) and I wouldn’t be going back for a Mulies. We saw a few does but not much in total for Mule deer. I won’t be heading back for cow elk either though.

35 whelen 05-27-2020 07:31 AM

Mule deer
 
The mule dear heard has takin quite a hit in this area over the last 10yrs,i would look somewhere else ,if your looking for trophys,

calgarychef 05-27-2020 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 35 whelen (Post 4176883)
The mule dear heard has takin quite a hit in this area over the last 10yrs,i would look somewhere else ,if your looking for trophys,

That’s the same all over. I think it’s code for “don’t come shoot our trophies.” 🧐

Outbound 05-27-2020 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Positrac (Post 4176661)
I don’t know about Grande Prairie but I was a bit north of there in January on a cow elk hunt (526) and I wouldn’t be going back for a Mulies. We saw a few does but not much in total for Mule deer. I won’t be heading back for cow elk either though.

Interesting. We used to hunt as far north as 359, and saw plenty of mulies. We occasionally saw elk, but they seemed real migratory. One day the herd would be around, the next day you don't see any but a buddy 20 clicks away saw a bunch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 35 whelen (Post 4176883)
The mule dear heard has takin quite a hit in this area over the last 10yrs,i would look somewhere else ,if your looking for trophys,

That could explain the draw. Like I say I've been out of the game for awhile and haven't done much with regard to dedicated animal spotting. It'll be interesting to note what I see as I get out scouting more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by calgarychef (Post 4176898)
That’s the same all over. I think it’s code for “don’t come shoot our trophies.” 🧐

LOL! It very well could be.

bucksman 05-27-2020 10:33 AM

whitetails definitely aren't threatened around Gp

DiabeticKripple 05-27-2020 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Positrac (Post 4176661)
I don’t know about Grande Prairie but I was a bit north of there in January on a cow elk hunt (526) and I wouldn’t be going back for a Mulies. We saw a few does but not much in total for Mule deer. I won’t be heading back for cow elk either though.

must be looking in the wrong place in 526, theres mulies all over the place by my uncles farm. Can barely go for a drive down a RR and not hit one.

Positrac 05-27-2020 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple (Post 4177059)
must be looking in the wrong place in 526, theres mulies all over the place by my uncles farm. Can barely go for a drive down a RR and not hit one.

Well I guess we were then...

35 whelen 05-27-2020 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calgarychef (Post 4176898)
That’s the same all over. I think it’s code for “don’t come shoot our trophies.” 🧐

NO .I have been at my cabin 12 yrs now ,my buddy used to guide archery m.d. in 521 they are not like they used to be .

tony d 05-27-2020 11:00 AM

YES the MD population has been in nowhere near what it used to be in the late 90s early 2000 s not certain about anywhere else but they are here still but really poor age classes I know several people whom have burnt 9-10 prioroties without filling a tag not that they couldnt have but that they didnt see any bucks in the area worthy of killing on a high priority tag

st99 05-27-2020 01:00 PM

If the op thinks there's tons on mulie in GP, I guess there's tons of caribou in Alberta. There should be a general tag for caribou as well. :rolleye2:

Outbound 05-27-2020 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by st99 (Post 4177146)
If the op thinks there's tons on mulie in GP, I guess there's tons of caribou in Alberta. There should be a general tag for caribou as well. :rolleye2:

I said I could be wrong. Hence why I asked the question. I also said I haven't hunted for 6+ years. Whether things have changed over that time, I don't know. I do know my experiences back when I was hunting were that we saw way more mulies than whitetail. It would appear that the mulie population here is in fact low.

Thanks for your valuable insight though...

Twisted Canuck 05-27-2020 03:01 PM

When I moved here and started hunting 14 years ago, I used to see really good healthy herds of mule deer in 357 where I do most of my hunting, and even more so in 522. Not so much anymore, and I haven't seen any really good bucks since I filled my draw back in 2015. They aren't extinct, but a couple hard winters hurt them and the white tail. That's not to say they don't exist, and that there aren't some good bucks around....but I don't see numbers anywhere like a decade ago.

blgoodbrand1 05-27-2020 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twisted Canuck (Post 4177223)
When I moved here and started hunting 14 years ago, I used to see really good healthy herds of mule deer in 357 where I do most of my hunting, and even more so in 522. Not so much anymore, and I haven't seen any really good bucks since I filled my draw back in 2015. They aren't extinct, but a couple hard winters hurt them and the white tail. That's not to say they don't exist, and that there aren't some good bucks around....but I don't see numbers anywhere like a decade ago.


Yup. Winter ‘06 wiped out anywhere from 50-90% and while not nearly as ba, ‘12 and ‘18 were deer killers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Outbound 05-27-2020 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blgoodbrand1 (Post 4177259)
Yup. Winter ‘06 wiped out anywhere from 50-90% and while not nearly as ba, ‘12 and ‘18 were deer killers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Damn, that's too bad. I do know that the number of deer in general I'd seen had gone down. That would explain why. I suppose I'll be travelling a little farther afield for deer this season.

Barry D 05-27-2020 10:14 PM

Here is somethings to think about.
High number of hunters and access = higher harvest success and overall numbers. Longer priority line ups (hunters frustrated they have to wait so long, creates pressure on the F&W to issue more tags at the expense of growing potential troghies. Then combined that with the winter of 11-12 killing at least 50% of all deer, and COD deaths (mostly mule deer, and a large percentage of them are bucks at that, like 80 % of all deer deaths). OH, then remember, mule deer does do not bare a fawn till they are minimum 2 years old, where about 40% of white tail does do it at one. That's from a Camp Wainwright study back in the 80-90"s.

Check in with any trophy scorer out there, and they will tell you that the number of mule deer that score over 170" are far and few in between all over Alberta. There are no consistent large mule deer areas in my opinion, just one here and there to some lucky and probably very hard working hunter.

The good news now.
My son and I put in a combined 200 man hours looking for sheds this year, from central north, central, south east, and south west in the province. Found exactly 232 horns. Only place we saw anything more than the odd winter kill was in the south foothills, and they showed evidence of all predator kills (wolves, they turn the legs and head inside out, 15 animals in two days) we did see wolves on both days we walked the land. So I believe most of us should see more deer this fall than last. The wolf is a real problem for all ungulates in the heavy forested areas of Alberta. That's a whole other discussion.

Interesting personal fact. We have collected about 1100 sheds over the last 15 years. Moose, Elk, caribou (Yukon), white tail and mule deer. Not a B & C horn in the bunch. Largest set of W. T. would score about 166", Largest Mule deer set about 175". More evidence that the large trophies are hard to come by and with hunting pressure for large deer higher than ever, it won't get easier in my mind unless we have a good 5-10 years of good winters, and lower predator numbers.

Moral of the story! Hunt hard, believe you can, and celebrate the animal you get, if you are so lucky.

Xiph0id 05-28-2020 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry D (Post 4177465)
Here is somethings to think about.
High number of hunters and access = higher harvest success and overall numbers. Longer priority line ups (hunters frustrated they have to wait so long, creates pressure on the F&W to issue more tags at the expense of growing potential troghies. Then combined that with the winter of 11-12 killing at least 50% of all deer, and COD deaths (mostly mule deer, and a large percentage of them are bucks at that, like 80 % of all deer deaths). OH, then remember, mule deer does do not bare a fawn till they are minimum 2 years old, where about 40% of white tail does do it at one. That's from a Camp Wainwright study back in the 80-90"s.

Check in with any trophy scorer out there, and they will tell you that the number of mule deer that score over 170" are far and few in between all over Alberta. There are no consistent large mule deer areas in my opinion, just one here and there to some lucky and probably very hard working hunter.

The good news now.
My son and I put in a combined 200 man hours looking for sheds this year, from central north, central, south east, and south west in the province. Found exactly 232 horns. Only place we saw anything more than the odd winter kill was in the south foothills, and they showed evidence of all predator kills (wolves, they turn the legs and head inside out, 15 animals in two days) we did see wolves on both days we walked the land. So I believe most of us should see more deer this fall than last. The wolf is a real problem for all ungulates in the heavy forested areas of Alberta. That's a whole other discussion.

Interesting personal fact. We have collected about 1100 sheds over the last 15 years. Moose, Elk, caribou (Yukon), white tail and mule deer. Not a B & C horn in the bunch. Largest set of W. T. would score about 166", Largest Mule deer set about 175". More evidence that the large trophies are hard to come by and with hunting pressure for large deer higher than ever, it won't get easier in my mind unless we have a good 5-10 years of good winters, and lower predator numbers.

Moral of the story! Hunt hard, believe you can, and celebrate the animal you get, if you are so lucky.

What do you do with all these sheds?

tbrown 05-28-2020 12:25 PM

The local outfitters in the region seem to continue to shoot nice mule deer, I think the one claims that he has guided 100 muley bucks over 180".

With CWD sweeping across the prairies and the inflated tag numbers that come with it; there is very poor trophy quality in the eastern zones. And, if you are lucky enough to shoot a muley buck in the east there is a good chance that it will be CWD positive.

People are going to start flooding north for mule deer! Can't blame them, no CWD, big muley bucks, season opens September 17th, lots of general elk, bears, big whitetail. If you are going to use up your priority, you might as well make a trip of it and go with a pocket full of tags!

Good luck in the draws everyone! I'm heading north and I will see you there!!

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

Twisted Canuck 05-28-2020 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbrown (Post 4177692)
The local outfitters in the region seem to continue to shoot nice mule deer, I think the one claims that he has guided 100 muley bucks over 180".

With CWD sweeping across the prairies and the inflated tag numbers that come with it; there is very poor trophy quality in the eastern zones. And, if you are lucky enough to shoot a muley buck in the east there is a good chance that it will be CWD positive.

People are going to start flooding north for mule deer! Can't blame them, no CWD, big muley bucks, season opens September 17th, lots of general elk, bears, big whitetail. If you are going to use up your priority, you might as well make a trip of it and go with a pocket full of tags!

Good luck in the draws everyone! I'm heading north and I will see you there!!

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

So it's gonna look like all the big city hunters flooding into the Saddles looking for elk, only for mulie bucks now? Great....

tbrown 05-28-2020 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twisted Canuck (Post 4177782)
So it's gonna look like all the big city hunters flooding into the Saddles looking for elk, only for mulie bucks now? Great....

I have no idea, I'm just goofing. But, it honestly wouldn't surprise me.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

35 whelen 05-28-2020 05:32 PM

I heard theres some real big ones in 522

Twisted Canuck 05-28-2020 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 35 whelen (Post 4177823)
I heard theres some real big ones in 522

I haven't been out there for a number of years, but there used to be good herds. They used to have under-subscribed doe tags, 2 for 1 at one point. A farmer out there had asked a couple of us if we would come out and thin it a bit, as they were really hitting his green feed hard. We saw a few decent bucks, but that was 7 or so years ago.

I actually quite liked the area, I may have to head back out there again and snoop around this year.

greywolf 05-28-2020 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blgoodbrand1 (Post 4177259)
Yup. Winter ‘06 wiped out anywhere from 50-90% and while not nearly as ba, ‘12 and ‘18 were deer killers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agree 100%, definitely have not recovered since the winter of 06/07

greywolf 05-28-2020 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 35 whelen (Post 4177823)
I heard theres some real big ones in 522

I heard there are bigger ones in 521.😉

Twisted Canuck 05-28-2020 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greywolf (Post 4177921)
I heard there are bigger ones in 521.😉

Well, I got my B&C down in 356 actually. My best wall hanger ever. 183 3/8.

husky7mm 05-29-2020 09:49 AM

Mule deer are managed different than whitetail. Whitetail are much better at escapement and being elusive, they can handle a very liberal season and it doesnt destroy the population. Multiple bad winters has crashed the deer numbers in the GP area. Outside the the farmland the number are pretty bleak and I would waste draw. As for the outfitters doing well, I hazard a guess that they are well connected in the private land department, and they have intimate knowledge of their herds locations. If a buck is good its days are numbered.....

Big Grey Wolf 05-29-2020 10:31 AM

My 60 years of experience we saw very few whitetails north of the Athabasca river in 50-60's. They migrated north over last 50 years to Grand Prairie and Peace River as more farms were developed.
The Peace Country mulies have been hit very hard over last 20 years as more hunters chased elk and took mule deer. Guides have also cleaned out Peace Country trophies.


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