About importing 585 cases a birdie told me
he had heard, a dealer in Canada was importing our 585HE case from AUS, And would sell in lots of 100. Does anyone know who that is? Ed |
Here is picture, nice cast bullet I like for the 585HE and 24ga FH.
It is .585" diameter and 650 gr and these particular ones are a hard lead alloy, plus they've been heatreated. They are about as hard as copper jacketed softs. These have a flat base, and fairly streamlined.. http://www.gunownerstv.com/585castbul.jpg But to penetrate good and do great damage to game or target they can be soft lead and hollowbase like Minie Bullets. Here is picture of timber drilled through with .585 soft lead Minie from 585HE. Picture is the back of 6x6 timbers where Minie bullets came out. Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/58calpen.jpg |
In Canada there are 3 guys there now setting up 585HEs,
and one setting up 24ga FH. Another friend setting up a 585HE handed out a bunch of cases and info sheets at the SCI convention. We are getting some more reamers made. Some more dies sent here. Another pallet load of cases coming. Here is picture of a light spitzer bullet in the 24ga FH case, will work in 585 also. Good for hunting and medium range target work. http://www.gunownerstv.com/24litebarnes.jpg Here is picture of 585HE we did in the FBW with regular two piece stock.We put a tenon on the forearm to wedge into the front of the action below the barrel and a tight barrel band on the front. Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/fbw2pc.jpg |
Here is comparison of our 585HE and Trex case, and while
we have barrels of cases and more coming and many available in stock in AUS, many are finding Trex cases scarce... http://www.gunownerstv.com/heandt.jpg Here is picture of a neat falling block that could work for our 585HE with little work, the Wickcliff. http://www.gunownerstv.com/wic.jpg Here is picture of the singlestack mag box we built for Enfields fitted to the bottom of BBK action.Very little changing and it fits a lot of different actions, as a fixed magazine, with its own feed lips,and we load from the top.Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/585bbkmag.jpg |
Here is picture of a 585HE we did in a Mauser 98 as a
singleshot test gun. We used a composite stock we adapted to fit action. Weighted to 12 lbs. Enfield in back, you can see it is longer. http://www.gunownerstv.com/mau585he.jpg And speaking of singleshots a fellow in the Yukon is just finishing up one in a Ruger #1. Here is one reason to like 585 calibers is bullet varieties, this picture is only about half the bullets and slugs we know of, and most can easily found. Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/all58sl.jpg |
There is couple 585 videos on Swann Gunsmithing's Facebook site;
Of our 585HE in first Ruger #1, that was done in Australia, set up for the poster Tankhunter on the AR big bore forums. That gun killed the first buffalo that I posted picture of above. You can go direct to the page and click on the videos to watch the test firings.. https://www.facebook.com/swanbarrels/videos Here is picture our 585HE in a Montana PH action in a MPI stock, with the style of a CZ stock, that a guy is setting up. The stock will be finished brown and metal finished with a Gun Kote finish...Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/ph585jm.jpg |
One of the first of modern 585 caliber wildcats, since WW2, the 575 Miller Greiss Magnum,
was first in records in the fifties, It was made from BMG brass shortened to 2.70" long and necked up from 50 cal to .585" with what looks li\ke a little sharper shoulder.. They rebated the rim quite a ways to .618" to maybe fit 98 Mauser bolt.Used a special action. Listed as a shooting 750gr bullet about 2400 fps. It holds about 150gr of ball powder under a 750 gr bullet, maybe little less than 3" 50cal spotter case, where our 585HE holds 180gr under a 750gr'. We made one for experimenting on a full length BMG case.With rim left same as the base and would need a BMG sized bolt and action. I'm glad to be a big bore wildcatter, and happy to be in the company of big bore nuts, old and new. Years ago when guys did big wildcats they took what was available, to rework, and maybe they could have used the 3" spotter case if they could have found couple barrels full. But it takes a lot of work to reform cases that much, with the multiple dies, multiple annealings, and case trimming and extreme reworking of regular rifle actions, which is why I like our 585 case, simple and straight, any regular long bolt action, falling block, break action, etc, a 585 good for dozen or more heavy loadings, moderate loads, last forever.. In making our 585HE we made it a size, actually new belted size, to fit regular size bolt guns, (not BMG actions)that didn't have to be used from a tripod, and could be put in a favorite, of many, the Ruger #1, other falling blocks, without taking metal out of the feed trough. And to get the same and much more powder space as a cut back, real short, fat, BMG case wildcatted to 585, we made longer case and worked with guys with a group buy to get a factory run made. We thank gun nuts for the help. Here is picture from the great site, cartridgecollector dot net, of the M&G Mag .Ed http://www.cartridgecollector.net/si...NUM%20FULL.jpg |
Probably first 375 caliber cartridge made from 585HE necked down, the 375 Warlord.
Guy did a real nice job, with what looks similiar to a Weatherby style shoulder. Kinda outdoes Weatherby & Cheytac. We have cases with no headstamps for wildcatters. First notice of the case sent to me today off of a guys facebook. http://www.sniperforums.com/forum/at...lord-image.jpg Another fellow is planning on shortening the 585HE to maybe 2.4", for use Marlins and Henrys, and other leverguns, redoing their 45-70s. With the belt they will have good headspace control. Without a rim that takes up space in a levergun action, say like our rimmed 24ga FH, a 585 bore, but which is perfect with that rim for break actions like our 24ga FH in a Magtech...Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/24gamagtech.jpg |
Sorry to be away so long. Health and money problems.
Here is how the top of the singlestack magazine looks that we made to use in Enfields and other bolt actions. The lips that hold the cases are springy, and we can load it from the top. The inside of action below rails is relieved a little so the feed lips can move, and being able to move they can work ok. http://www.gunownerstv.com/topmag.jpg Here are couple 24ga FHs break actions, a CBC with monoblocked 585 barrel in it, and a guys NEF he had a 585 barrel monoblocked in. The 585 barrels are perfect fit for 24ga, and 585 Minie Bullets are a perfect for barrel and 24ga case fit. http://www.gunownerstv.com/24gacbc.jpg http://www.gunownerstv.com/nef24fh.jpg Another matter--- I know it seems like I'm begging for help when I ask guys on the net for help at times. . But I really am in a bind. That is truth, Our small income disappeared from our farms truck garden business as my my knees are shot and can't hardly walk, I can't do field work, etc. And the wife's lung condition got so bad she can't work.. So we finally had to quit that, but were and are in debt. We need little extra money to try to keep our health fixed up and pay bunch of back bills and utilities. As well as needed for traveling to doctors, treatments,drugs, etc. Could you all maybe get together with others on these forums and kinda take up a collection to help get me out of my troubles and debt. Like 10 or so bucks each put into our paypal account as gifts. And if you want to mail it, use email below to contact me to get you my mailing address. The Paypal email is je@gunownerstv.com Best Regards- Ed PS-- I really need help. Not astronomical amounts, but fairly fast. Just a little from each to help. A quick boost so to speak. We never made anything on the 12ga FH, etc, work and research. The little coming from sale of our groups buy of 585 brass, dies, barrels, etc, goes to pay to the places, where the money is owed, for getting them made..Ed |
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Thanks for your concern, please let others know.Ed
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Here is picture of a lightweight Barnes bullet in 24ga FH.
Guys cut the back off of 750gr bullet off to get 500gr weight. And would do in 585HE for light recoiling load. http://www.gunownerstv.com/24litebarnes.jpg Here is picture 58 cal Minie slug that's little long on the side for our 12ga sabot, with the front of the slug above the grooves swaged to fit in sabot. The swaged front third of the slug fits next to the internal ridge in sabot and the sabot doesn't bulge out.Just run front into a die and punch it back out. http://www.gunownerstv.com/slugswage.jpg And speaking of 12ga we worked with hairy loaded slug loads. And some info about 12ga FH and other hopped up shotgun slug loads, You know we like to use the rifle, IE slower than shotgun, powders. We like to use IMR 4759 for some loads and RE17 for others where we have room for larger charges. Those two powders are ignited ok in large diameter cases like 12ga, 10ga, 16ga, etc, without needing BMG primers. But we have always been looking for easy to ignite powders of the RE17 type, when cold, that has a speed between IMR 4759 and the RE17. RE17 uses different process to put the deterrents in the powder to control speeds, which allows much easier ignition, compared to big majority of rifle powders with all the deterrent on the outside. There are some out there made by Nitrochemie Switzerland, who makes RE17, RE26, RE33, etc, for Alliant. It's the ' RELOAD SWISS' brand available for those in UK and Europe, They are called RS 40, about same speed as RE12, RS 50 & 52, same speed as RE15, RE60 & 62 same as RE17. Also one ' Vihta Vouri ' powder called TR140 available over there, that Nitrochemie made.. Many guys can't get IMR 4759 anymore, some can't get RE17. I'd like to get some of RS 40-50-52 powders or V V TR140 into the states, would really be great help for hairy slug load work. And guys in UK/EU now can load some real hairy, slow powder, slug loads, even though not having IMR 4759....Ed |
Another action we found that isn't priced 3 grand
or more that will work great for our 585HE is the Stiller bolt action that is made for Cheytac based cases. Less than 1200 dollars. Compares in size to the Montana PH actions we have put the 585 in.Ed |
Here is picture of 375 Warlord next to our 585 case he made it from.
He is going to make couple later necked down to 416, and 458. There is another guy working on doing one necked down to 357 wildcat. http://www.gunownerstv.com/375warlord.jpg Here is a picture of our poster Biebs on AR, 585 HE, in a MPI stock. He used a big Enfield action, with a fancy jeweled bolt. http://www.gunownerstv.com/biebs2.jpg We found couple other big actions for our 585, that can even feed really long overall length loaded cases, like 4.5" long or more, if you are using long pointed bullets for real long range target and hunting work. One is Lawton 8000 Cheytac action, and the other is Stiller Cheytac actions made similiar, justa newer version. Both actions come in 1.45" diameter and a 1.60" diameter recievers. And Vestals Gunsmithing in Virginia does great work, decent prices, has these actions and will build you fancy 585 HEs. .. He has, working with another guys mag box setup, setup an extra long, good working, single stack, center feed, magazine..He has our 585 HE reamer on hand, we have barrels, cases, and reloading dies..Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/lawton8000.jpg |
Here is couple different setups our guys checking for our 585HE
in a long, Lawton Cheytac action. First laminated thumbhole stock. Second in a Hogue Compstock. The action can mount a scope rail like shown on the table in 1st picture or a receiver sight in 2nd picture. The scope rail is a piccatiny,. if you need long range work. http://www.gunownerstv.com/lawtonthumb.jpg http://www.gunownerstv.com/lawtonhogue.jpg The stocks used were wide ones for REM long actions, just add recoil block ahead of recoil inleting for the longer action, drill new screw hole Open the stock forward to original bolt hole for longer cases and mag. About Enfields for our case, one of my favorites, Some don't like the sporterizing, welding bottom metal straight. Many think straightening is a huge job needing special jigs, etc, Not really, just use one for a jig with a bolt, to weld on the straight extension, Do top weld, then cut old extension that is under off with a thin cutting wheel, then weld bottom. When we bolt the short piece on the one we are straightening, we grind the short slant off so the added piece lays on there flat. The one you cut off can be used as the top extension for the next one!!! Just keep on building...Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/guardlen.jpg |
Here is picture of another neat sporterizing deal for Enfields.
On those without rear bridge pocket welded up, we just mill down and shape it so debth of the pocket matches bottom section of weaver rail and screw or epoxy it in. Shape to drive in hole tight. Can use as a rear scope ring mount or mount for peep sight like a compact UTG sight... http://www.gunownerstv.com/enfieldsight.jpg If we have a welded up Enfield rear bridge, then we can use sight like on this gun a guy is doing. Has a rosewood laminate stock. He will have it checkered, sanded, with fancy finish. http://www.gunownerstv.com/enbro.jpg Here is a fancy stocked 24ga FH built on a NEF, built by a guy in Canada. Its straight back, high comp stock, handles recoil great... Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/brian24.jpg More about 585 BB short case for lever guns, pistols,AR Uppers, Work in 71s, later 1886s, Henry steel frames made for 45-70. One guy is putting one in single shot action set up with Contender style pistol grip for testing in long rifle barrel, to simulate pistol recoil..Be very brisk recoil in a case that holds 110 gr powder under a light Minie bullet Maybe work in a Rossi Judge with heavy barrel. Or rolling block rifles and pistols....Ed |
Here is a picture from the back, of a big Lawton action that
our 585HE fits in nice. Scope rail on there is tapered for long range shooting. http://www.gunownerstv.com/lawton35-2.jpg Here is what our wildcatter buddy is making from our 585HE brass to see how they look and experiment with. He is getting reamers, dies, and gun setup first for the 375. http://www.gunownerstv.com/warlord4.jpg In some ways big bore shotguns and rifles are sexy. By looking at the shape of the fire and smoke cloud.... Thanks for picture, to the great NitroExpress Forums site. Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/Mickyboob.jpg |
That .416 Destroyer looks nifty!
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A poster reading our threads said '' I'm slowly becoming a recoilapheliac''..
That is neat term , and very glad that folks are catching the big bore fever. Here is a simple, yet neat peep sight we can use on the rear sporterized bridges of Enfields, works on other rear bridges also.Including shotguns. I like peep sights the best for most shooting. They also come with flat bottoms also for bridges and receivers that are flat on top. http://www.gunownerstv.com/2wgrs.jpg Another picture of the 585 HE one of our guys put in the MPI stock.. http://www.gunownerstv.com/biebs.jpg Here is another pic of our guys 24ga FH in the NEF http://www.gunownerstv.com/brian24-2.jpg On straight sided cases like our 585 HE the die set has a mouth expander die to make it easy to insert bullets. The die flares the mouth, but I always felt that doing what is really a relative relatively sharp flare, and then the slight roll crimping the same area of the case into a groove on the bullet or slug, shortens case life. So I just use expander plug out of the die, by hand, using just the bottom of of the expander plug and just push it in a little, wobble it around a small amount, bullet goes in ok, case mouths last longer, good for dozens of loads, with moderate hunting and target loads.Only takes a few seconds and less work that has to be done in the press ... Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/mouthex.jpg |
Here is picture of a hard plastic molded shotgun case, holding
a slug, without crimping, a company is experimenting with. This one with light slug supposed to do over 2000 fps. http://www.gunownerstv.com/shrifle.jpg Here is video by Corlanes Sporting, Dawson Creek, BC, CAN. Known as, Rocky Mtn Rifles, video on Youtube of them testing our 585 HE in a barreled action, they are building for a guy. They are shooting it into their big bullet trap with test load.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vzQjRGfT1A Allan and Grant Swan in Australia are building 585HE for a guy, the second they built. First one killed the buff pictured earlier . AHR and Vestals will make folks here in US a 585 HE. Here is another view of a Lawton action big enough for 585HE.. http://www.gunownerstv.com/lawton35.jpg Here is picture of Rossi SS with 585 barrel mono-blocked into it, chambered for our 585 BB 2.17" case, to do testing in a light rifle with just pistol grip to simulate the case in pistols. Others going to put case in leverguns, autoloaders. We got plenty of cases Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/rossi585bb.jpg |
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I feel that Bruce Bertram has done a huge amount for big bore shooting.
We have heard that fellow big bore nut, Nathan Vale in AUS, is working with Bertram in making order of the full length 12ga From Hell cases. Drawn cases as strong as BMG brass with unbreakable rims. Any wanting some, and maybe get in on the run, contact Bertram at the email -- b.bertram1@bigpond.com ...... Ed |
The style of most break actions singles aren't the greatest, that we
we used for 12ga FH, 10ga FH, other caliber barrels we mono-blocked in them like .585" bore for 585HE and 24ga FH.. One that is close that we have, is the Magtech. Well the guys have found one that is super strong lockup and looks real nice. And has the good quality look. It comes 12ga light shot barrel, soon be monoblocked to rifled 24ga FH, the little brother of the 585HE. We told company if they did them with NEF style, rifled, heavy slug barrel, for shotgun caliber only hunters, they couldn't make them fast enough. http://www.gunownerstv.com/perfect12.jpg Here is picture of 585HE, In an Enfield that Bret and Darrel in Minn set up with great camo finish, with nice brake job. It is in a Hogue, recoil reducing, rubber coated, Compstock.Great job they did.. Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/camo-en.jpg Here is picture from the rear of the Enfield we mounted the short Weaver rail piece on. It is mounted in the sight pocket that the actions have; Can hold scope ring or a rear peep sight like UTG makes.. Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/enbackwea.jpg |
We will have arrived when we have this big bore in our back yard,
Kind of a neat suppressor, http://www.gunownerstv.com/bigsuppressor.jpg Here is folder shotgun guys set up as 24ga FH. http://www.gunownerstv.com/companion24.jpg Here is another view of what we feel is a nearly perfect break action. Guy is making a strong 24ga FH with it. http://www.gunownerstv.com/perfect12open.jpg Here is picture of a 585HE MRC PH a guy set up.. http://www.gunownerstv.com/coyote2.jpg Here is picture of our shorter 585 BB for leverguns, etc, with a variety of bullets..Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/585bbloads.jpg |
Here is a Midland break action a guy is doing in 24ga FH.
http://www.gunownerstv.com/midland24.jpg Here is old catalog picture of different stuff used in old days for shotgun loads. Some would be hairy in brass cases http://www.gunownerstv.com/ballshot.jpg Here is picture of a MN a guy is doing 585HE in.. It is singleshot. Redid bolt handle mounted it on the bolt further bac, so the port could be lengthened for our long case. Needs polishing and blueing, scope rail added. http://www.gunownerstv.com/585mosin.jpg Here is another picture of the Enfield with great looking stock. Nice looking wood. Ed http://www.gunownerstv.com/coyote.jpg |
Last rifle pictured is PH 585HE..Ed
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I find it interesting. Thanks for posting.
As for the chumps above, don't mind them. They think that all people care about their posts when in fact most are too polite and respectful to post negative remarks. I hope you continue to post. Thank you |
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It's no secret that this stuff is all copy and pasted on a number of differant forums, the first time I came across it was long before it appeared here. However- I like seeing it, it's unique and makes me want to spend more time on my own projects, I don't have the budget right now for full custom builds but it's enjoyable to tinker with things like the 450 Mongo, not because they're a epic performer but mostly because it's good cheap fun! What more do you want? We all like something different so enjoy the diversity! :)
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